No...
KT has never been able to export to obj- and 3ds...
Files will be saved as .xml- or .kzx-format... (kzx = KT Zip Xml)

Not sure I get your Vue explanation...

But any way... You can instance anything you like in KT...

I'm not familiar with Onyx trees myself, but you can import the .obj-format directly into KT...
You can even make your own KT model libraries with these... That will save you time because you only need to assign material settings when you create the libraries...

You don't need to import to SU... That will only make your SU model impossible to orbit...

SU is IMHO the best application for making the buildings etc... (Non organic modelling)
One of the beauties of having 3D trees is that it - apart from making your renders look more realistic - enables you to create photo realistic animations...
Or just single images from different angles, where you don't see the trees from the same angle in each image...
(that came out all wrong, but I hope you understand any way...)

@solo said:

Sounds fantastic, hence the larger polygon support as it is added in KT and not SU.

Exactly... If you would place a single Xfrog tree in SU, it would be almost be impossible to orbit the model in SU...
So instead you create your model with camera positions etc in SU... Then you export it using the SU2KT or as an OBJ-file and then open it in KT, where you can place the 3D trees as shown above...

@solo said:

What if I have my own 2d and 3d tree library and want to instance them within the KT GUI, is there a conversion or a simple select and drop?

I assume that you already have placed them in SU - right..??
If so, you just export the model and then you can select whatever part you like and use the instancing brush to populate more copies in KT...

It's really simple once you learn the KT GUI...

I'm saying that we've been allowed to make KT model libraries of the Xfrog Public Plants and likewise the Xfrog Sweet Birch will be available... These will be free of charge, all with compliments from Xfrog...

We already have 6 DVD's from the Xfrog 3D trees, and if a user can show that he/she have purchased one of these DVD's, we can share the KT model libraries of that particular DVD...

In addition to the Xfrog models, Frolfer12 have made some various grass model libraries, which also will be available for download, and likewise we have some other 3D plants, flowers and scrub that will be available free of charge...

After import of a model, the user can easily insert a tree, scrub, grass or another model from the KT libraries by using the Insert > Models menu in KT...
And with the instancing brush the user can populate as many copies of these in the scene and then hit the render button...

Didier, you're a true ruby-master..!!
Haven't tried if this works, yet - but if you've succeeded this will be helpfull to many...
I remember back at the "old" SU forum, Todd was preparing a similar ruby for more than a year without success...

@solo said:

but first I will need to watch the tutorials, which I believe are included with Echo release...right?

We have prepared many video- and pdf- tutorials, which will guide you through the new release, the functions etc...

They will be available in our repository, and we actually plan to release these one of the following days (before the release of the application itself), in order to let users get familiar with the new interface and the new features...

Some of the tutorials will be available in both English, Espanol and Francais already from day 1, but we plan to translate all within the first month...

This will help users who already knows KT, but also new users...
Believe me... It's really not that difficult, and you can set-up all materials directly in SU before you export...

Some have asked for a sneak preview of the new material editor in KT2008, and since we're so close to release, we decided that it will be OK to post a screen-dump...

@solo said:

[Podium was slower than Vue and KKt
The current Podium and Kt have the same render engine, if anything with the same even handed setups they should be identical.

Exactly...!
This is also a good demonstration of how difficult it is to compare render applications...
It has a lot to do with materials used, lights and general set-up...

I feel it's time to end the discussion here...
Although it's very interesting, it's very difficult to compare render applications...

It's like comparing digital cameras...
Individual people have individual needs, and apart from that people have individual preferences...
There's so many things that need to be considered... What's the purpose, do you need a SLR camera, a quick snap... Do you need zoom, how many Mega pixels etc... etc...
Some prefer Nikon, oters Canon, others Sony, others Olympus, others Panasonic etc... etc... The list could be endless...

By the end of the day, I hope that people use something they feel confident with and will cover their indivisual need...

Congratulations, Jason!!
Trust me - it's going to be a tough time the first half year, but it's definitely worth it...!!

@gaieus said:

Either choose a preset with AA or choose your (going to be) quick preset, press the "Apply" button, then set the AA in the settings and now do not touch the presets but render with your "custom settings".

Exactly...

@unknownuser said:

But ... how about KT's interface? Has it become even more, errr, "whoa, I must've stepped into a cockpit"?

Well... Previous you might have had a feeling that you stepped into a simple cockpit, but we've upgraded things a bit... Now you step into a much nicer cockpit...

No... To be honest... The new material editor GUI have been completely re-designed and should be much easier to navigate... (At least that's how I feel...)
But in reality you don't need to fiddle much with material settings...
In SU you can apply standard SU materials and for special materials like glass etc. you can import these direct into SU using the SU2KT plug-in, export your model and start your render... It shouldn't be necessary to make things more difficult for yourself...

Besides, we have prepared many video- and pdf- tutorials, which will guide you through the process...

@stu said:

Kerkythea is to soon release a new version, which is great news!...and they are also bringing out a Mac version and need Mac people to test this .....

Thanks for bringing this up...

But we actually don't need any more beta-testers for the Mac port...
Kerkythea 2008 Echo in Windows, Linux and Mac versions will be released on January 30th...

@solo said:

Thank you for sharing, images like these inspire me to go further and better.

Solo, you're already a true source of inspiration for everyone here...
I hope that we will see some stunning renders of yours made with KT...

@solo said:

he must have used the 'big brother' computer

Actually not... KT2008 is capable of handling billions of polygons...
Please check the Billion polygons?? thread at the KT Forum...

Thought it would be time to post another teaser made with the new KT2008 Echo, which will be released on Wednesday, January 30th.

I can't take credit for these renders, but I've promised to post them here on behalf of Frolfer12 (a colleague to Fletch) who made these...

@frolfer12 said:

Here are some images that I made using the "instancing brush" feature of the new KT 2008!
Everything is 3d including the trees and grass. There was NO post processing done in Photoshop after rendering in KT.
The new features of KT 2008 are AMAZING and make KT even more unbelievable!

Everything except the grass and trees were modeled in Sketchup.
The grass and trees are .xml files that you insert through KT.
I have made a grass library that is free and royalty free that I will make available when KT 2008 is released and the trees are xfrog models that the company I work for bought and I converted to the .xml format.

Unfortunately, these cannot be shared as they were paid for by the company I work for. However, there are free xfrog models on the web that are going to be made available with the new KT I believe.

And I can confirm that these will be made available, free of charge and ready for use with compliments from Xfrog...

Click here to see the original size 1200 x 600...

Click here to see the original size 1100 x 550...

@unknownuser said:

Nick W wrote:
Kim, thanks for tips and for the encouragement.

You're very welcome..

@unknownuser said:

Nick W wrote:
I'm new at this, so any tidbits of basic information would be very helpful.

Well - I'm also learning new things regarding render techniques every day...
At the KT Forum, you can find many useful tips and tricks... And if you can't find an immediate answer to your question, you can post one and the users there will always try helping you...

@unknownuser said:

Nick W wrote:
I just used a standard glass material for the water (as you said in your tutorial), but didn't apply a bump map because I made the model itself bumpy. Does this answer your question?

First of all, I assume you're mixing me up with Fade..!? Rolling Eyes Wink
I've made the Getting Started tutorial, but not the water/pool video tutorials...
Any way - a glass material will be the right choice...

@unknownuser said:

Nick W wrote:
I have generally been using the Photonmap - Quick render setting, as anything with caustics or AA seems to take multiple hours to render. Is that normal or could it be on account of the many lights and large model?

Multiple hours is normal, especially given the information that you have used many lights (point-, spot- and mesh- lights)...
Also the choice of materials can increase the render time significantly, but it's something you'll learn along the way...

In my opinion, you should only use the Quick render preset for tests... When you're happy with the materials etc., change to a higher preset and let it run during the night, while you're asleep...
For a scene like this, I would use the MLT preset...
It will take several hours to clear up, but you don't need to let it run for all 10,000 passes. At around 200 passes I'm sure it will be very clear, and remaining noise can get removed by using a program like NeatImage...

@unknownuser said:

Nick W wrote:
I had amended the Global Illumination settings as you described in your tutorial, but I gather now that it doesn't matter if you don't use a render setting with caustics... I am gaining understanding every day!

You're absolutely right...
If you have done everything Fade has described in his video-tutorial, it's the render preset that will do the trick for you...

Cheers
Kim Frederik

Hi Nick,

First of all, I suggest that you post your question at the KT Forum...
This forum is GREAT, but I'm sure that you'll get much more qualified help at the KT Forum...

I wonder what material you've used for the water and also what render preset... Confused
To me it looks as if you haven't been using one of the render presets where caustics is present, but I could be wrong...
Have you also remembered to amend the Global Illumination Method in the Render Rettings..??

The material is also very important, and you can find some very good and realistic water materials in the KT forum...

Looking forward to see the progress you're making on this...

Cheers
Kim Frederik

@dzinetech said:

No and yes. No I'm not surprised that followers of KT will want to defend the software because they believe in it however I am surprised that you as quite a respected person in the SU community, can't do this without assuming I am some sort of idiot just because I don't think KT is the best thing since sliced bread.

I'm really sorry to see that you have interpreted my postings this way...
That was definitely NOT my intention... I'm really sorry about that..!!

@dzinetech said:

Again, the tone and attitude by this was not warranted.

I really don't understand how you can interpret my responses this way...
I guess it has something to do with the fact that this is a written conversation and not the two of us sitting in a bar having a friendly discussion, where you could see the body-language, the glint in the eye etc...
Although I tried to write it and at the same time use as many smileys as possible...

@dzinetech said:

You would at least be wise to know who you are addressing before making such a slanderous statement. You know me back from the old SU forums (where I have posted renders using KT no less that you commented on) yet you seem so sure I've never gone near KT. How wrong you are especially as I have KT installed on this very PC.

I admit that I don't remember you in person... Sorry about that...
I responded the way I did because I felt you didn't know anything about KT based on the statements you made...
But again I'm really sorry to see that you interpret this the way you do...

I haven't tried to be rude or anything...!!

@dzinetech said:

Well if you take off your KT tinted glasses and did a bit of research you would find that Vray is capable of this.

OK... I can read the sarcasm between the lines here...
But no... I didn't know about that, cause you're right... I'm much deeper involved in KT and don't spend much time on other render applications...
But thanks for the info...

@dzinetech said:

Yes I did but it does not provide any information on the settings used for vray so the test is somewhat irrelevant.

OK... That's a fair argument...

@dzinetech said:

You claim to know vray well yet aren't aware of its unbiased rendering capbilities? Interesting...

Yes - I claim that I know Vray very well... And Yes, I didn't know...

@sepo said:

Also this guy in the tread http://www.sketchucation.com/forums/scf/viewtopic.php?f=82&t=4199&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=30
is not doing any favours to KT. KT is much more powerfull and better soft than he is presenting it there.

Yeah I saw it, but decided not to post any further comments in that thread long time ago...

@sepo said:

Coming back to the main issue. New KT looks quite good with all these new stuff. Can you tell us a bit more about new material editor...maybe screen grab of the new editor.

Hhhmmmm... Unfortunately Giannis have told us not to...
He's OK that we post renders made with KT2008, but don't want any screen grab of the material editor...
Sorry...

Can't have been much, James...
Looks very CG to me, and I assume that Ivica have used a very low render preset...?!?

I've seen the bottle at FormFonts, but can't see the texture...?!?
Could be fun giving it a go using better materials and render presets...

Cheers
Kim Frederik