@pbacot said:

Thanks, Sonder. So I think I see the walls are vector right? And in a print they'd be crisp. You shade the ceiling somehow with the sun from below as if you cut the house in half and flipped it over?

Yes the walls are vector. I actually struggled at first on how to do a true reflected ceiling plan. What I do is have a second SU model which the original model is referenced. I then mirror the model about the Z axis, cut a horizontal section and the result is a true reflected ceiling plan. Since it is mirrored about the Z axis, you still get the cast shadows which I think really helps with depth.

Here is a reflected ceiling plan I am working on. I enlarged an area so hopefully it shows what I am referring to a little better.

Sorry - do not explode the line work. Leave it as a reference set to vector. Otherwise, you lose the tie to the original model.

The advantage with dimensioning, is the simplicity of the section cut, whether it is a vertical section or horizontal plan. My models are detailed with baseboard, trim etc. Sometimes you have to be careful you do not hit the edge of a piec of 3/4" trim. Since the section for a plan is cut above the floor, it does not show the trim in the line work, making dimensioning must faster.

Yes the vector line work is crisp lines, while the model can show all the materials/shadows etc. The advantage of this method is primarily work flow. LO renders the basic line work nearly instantly in vector mode. The model rendered in raster is also very quick. Both Hybrid and vector rendering of the entire model is far too slow. If your output quaility is set to high, 1/4" scale plans read beautifully. IMHO, graphically it is far superior to hybrid or vector only rendering.

@utiler said:

That's exactly what I do too, Sonder. I only ever use Vector and Raster and layer references to get the required solution.

Nice work too!!

Thanks. It was definitely eye opening for me. I never have the issues with waiting for a render anymore. Heck the line work in vector renders faster than the whole model refernce in raster. I am almost done with 3 full CD sets done in Layout. Now that I finally have the system half way dialed, I am faster than I was with ACAD (I learned ACAD on version 2.0 and used it daily until last year).

I've been playing with the advantages and disadvantages of both Vector and Raster rendering. It is always a compromise of graphic/visual quality vs. graphic/visual accuracy vs. render time.

While playing around, I realized you can layer SU references over eachother and designate one to be raster render and one to be vector render. One very cool aspect of the SU section tool is that it allows you to create a group from the actual section cut. It not only creates a group, but a component within the group. This is really cool as you can open the group, then copy the component out of the model to edit. You can then set the line work of the specific component along with assigning color or tone to the faces created in the section.

Here is the big workflow advantage. While vector rendering takes forever on an entire model, it is extremely fast on isolated line work - such as a section. So you can have a base reference that is raster rendered - such as a floor plan or reflected ceiling plan or section. Then you overlay at the same scale a SU reference that is only the isolated component/group created from the section cut and set it to vector render. You can then easily set it over the raster image to create an amazing plan or section.

Doing this also helps for dimensioning as you can assign the vector portion to an isolated layer allowing for more precise selection.

Don't use "Last scene saved". Use the actual scene that you set up. The reason being, you may have just slightly rotated the scene out of orthagonal view. If so, you are seeing how it was last saved. That would reak havoc on your dimensions.

What are your computer stats?

I have many models over 40MB, with a couple up near 90MB without issues. Are you using groups and components? As TIG mentioned use purge in components first then materials. Use your view limts also in case you have some odd model or copies of line work/components/groups out in space where you can't see them.

If it happens, you only need to redraw one line to complete the geometry and it will create a face. I do this all the time, as it is quick and easy.

You can set dimension accuracy to round to nearest inch in Layout. Go to File/Document Setup/units & select precision set to 1".

@ccbiggs said:

Sonder I would say the difference between a space nav & a standard 3 button mouse is night & day!!
The space nav is very easy on the wrist. There is next to no movement to get movement on screen. And your hand rests more like you were holding a cup which I think is much more comfortable for extended use, rather than the bottom of your wrist on the desk. You should try one. I am saving up for a Wacom tablet should have one in the next month or so.

I don't use a mouse. I use the pen which eliminates all fatigue as you don't rotate your wrist like a mouse. I am very interested in the space nav though for my left hand.

I gave it a go for you.

Dimensioning works fine. You need to pull the dimension far enough away from the insertion point and it automatically rotates orthagonal to the model. However, I get 1'-6" nosing to nosing on your Layout file. As a reference I get 5'-0" for the center landing/alter?

@kaas said:

for those already using a wacom pen: how do you pan and zoom while you're using another command?
For instance you're zoomed in, start drawing a line and want to zoom out, zoom in elsewhere and continue drawing the line. Using a three button mouse this is easy. Can this be done using a pen?

It is very easy: There are tablet keys -one is a stroke pad that you use for zoom. You can assign the other keys (4) for mouse button keys you would typically use, so for me one is set for orbit control. It is far more comfortable than a mouse and faster once you get used to it. You never struggle to find the cursor, because the tablet is set exactly to your screen format. So, when your pen is in the lower corner of the tablet, your cursor is in the lower corner of your screen and so on. I've used this setup for years now and will never go back to a mouse. I am interested in the space navigator as well. The 3d mouses look nice, but they unfortunately suffer as they are still a mouse. You scroll with no definitive cursor location and your wrist still must twist uncomfortably to control it. With the pen, you do not get any strain on the wrist due to how you hold the pen.

@mitcorb said:

If I get the 3DConnexion, it'll be a fight whether I use it left or right handed. I draw with a pencil left handed and use the mouse with my right hand.

So this brings up an issue! If I have my pen in my right hand and the navigator with my left, I guess I'll need a straw for the beer!

We are very close to the same age. I was doing the same thing in those years, just not on a bridge! I still have my "Fiberflex" skateboard from those days. In fact, I just got back into skating a little with my 12 year old daughter. I can still ride without breaking my neck.

Great TIG - I'll get that. Another simple work around is to simply rotate the SU view in layout 90 degrees.

I just ran into an issue with a single layout file. When I export the PDF or DWG file, it is not printing or exporting digitally exactly to 1/4" (1:48). It was hard to notice except when I scaled a 26' dimension and got approximately 25'10" with an architectural hand scale. My engineer noticed it in his ACAD file as well. He finds that it is at a scale of 1:48.0081.

This is only happening with one file, and not my others. I figured the main issue might be the view saved in SU, so I reset that view to top, saved it and regenerated it in LO. Same issues.

Anyone run into this? I know that seems like a small amount off, but it should be perfect.

@unknownuser said:

Wow! I am surprised about the tablet users. I have a tablet, as well, but only use it for drawing.painting (illustrator, photoshop, etc...). I tried to use it with SketchUp, but found that for line drawing, the mouse was easier. I do like the idea of programmable shortcut keys that a tablet provides. To the 3D mouse users, do you program buttons on your 3D mouse for different commands in SketchUp?

Once you get use to the tablet, it makes much more sense for line drawing than a mouse - even for CAD work. It is a pen afterall.

@cotty said:

I found this helpful: http://youtu.be/2sTyJki96Ec

Thanks for that. I really like that interface of the space navigator and the wacom tablet. The tablet and pen are extremely comfortable. He doesn't seem to use any of the tablet keys which can be programed to just about any key command. I use them primarily for selection, pan, and orbit. However after seeing this device used with the tablet, I'm getting one today!

While the tablet can orbit and zoom simoltaneously like this device, I really like how smooth this operates.

Anyone have a good source to purchase?

A major aspect of the tablet I like, is the relationship to the screen. There is no random placing of the device to find your location on the screen. The upper right corner of the tablet is the upper right corner of the screen and so on - not just some random placement like a mouse. The reduced fatigue and ease of programming specific actions to specific programs is so far ahead of the little rodent, that I can't imagine going back. It's all personal preference though. Whatever works best is best.

For those questioning the tablet. For me, it is far superior. You need to use it and give it a chance. I am much faster with it over a mouse now. The pen is far more comfortable than the mouse as your wrist is not twisted. The quick clicks, and customization of the pen, pen buttons and tablet buttons make it far superior to a mouse for graphic applications. I can access so much more control with it quickly over any mouse. I can't imagine going back. If you use photo shop, there is no comparison with the brush tools and sensitivity. You can apply pressure like a real brush, pen, charcoal etc.

If yours is just collecting dust, I'll take it!