not that it really matters i suppose, since this dxf file does indeed import into sketchup, it will not import into rhino, or autocad 2000 - autocad gives this error message:

No layer specification for this object. on line 12.

Invalid or incomplete DXF input -- drawing discarded.
Regenerating model.

cheers
rabbit

Those are very nice drawings for sure, with clear notation, but you must admit dimensioning is not much in evidence. For example, and it may be because you have compressed the file, the red dimensions on the plan drawing on page 1 are very blurry, whereas the other text is not. - in fact, that whole image (presumably from a section of the sketchup model) is comparatively low resolution.

In the meantime, I have managed to get drawings from a CAD program into Layout and have them print as well as they would direct from the CAD program itself, as the following mini-tutorial explains if people want to give it a shot:

To use dimensioned cad plans in layout:

The secret here is to print from the cad application to a raster image (eg tiff or png) that layout can support, AT 300 DPI, and then scale the image in layout to the correct paper size the image was printed at.

Some apps (like rhino) allow you to do all this from their print dialog, but for others you have to have a printer driver installed that will print to a raster format. A suitable one, that many people will already have installed, is "Microsoft Office Document Image", which, as its name implies, is installed as part of the office suite.

So:
1] set up the drawing in the CAD program however you like.
2] From within the CAD program print dialog, set the properties of the Microsoft image document image printer to your preferred page size, (ie, whatever you are using in layout for your paper size) and also in the advanced tab set the output to "Tiff - monochrome fax" and in the options set the output to 300dpi.
3] Adjust the scale in the CAD print dialog to whatever is appropriate, and then print and save the image.
4] In layout, on a new page, insert the drawing. The drawing will come in centered on the page.
5] While it is still selected, click and drag on one corner WHILE HOLDING DOWN THE SHIFT KEY to constrain the image to the correct aspect ratio, and drag the corner out to align with the page corner. Repeat for the opposite corner. It would be nice if you could snap to the edges of the paper, but you can't, but it is pretty easy to eyeball it accurately.
6] Make sure you put this image on its own layer, and that within the layer order it is at the bottom of the list, and locked, so it won't move and your other notation etc that you add is on top of it.
7] When you are ready to print the layout, set the dpi in file/document setup to 300, and then print to your real world printer.
Thats it. - a few other tips:

If you are going to create a pdf, then you can skip step 7, but make sure you set the dpi in the pdf when asked to 300 if it is intended to print the plans from this file at a later date.
Note that Layout is, according to the google guy giving the presentation at basecamp, not really intended to print at paper sizes bigger than A3.
When testing this, include a scale in your CAD file, so you can check with a scale rule that you are getting correctly scaled output.
Finally, make sure the working resolution of the layout document is set to a low dpi, and only increase it to 300 when you are about to print to a real world printer.

cheers
rabbit

i have used a wacom for years - first serial ones way back on a 486, and now i use a usb cte-430. The cool thing is that they will install without interfering with the mouse, so you can run both. I am left handed, but years ago taught myself to use the mouse with my right hand (took about a week). so now I have the tablet on the left of the keyboard, and the mouse on the right, and i use the tablet for most everything, and the mouse mostly for scrolling. Sounds weird, but it is really easy, and keeps me from getting rsi. I notice new wacoms hve a scroll wheel at the top of the pad, so that would probably be great.

You get used to using the pen in different ways - for example in sketchup i use the pen + shortcut keys a lot - like to orbit i use a shortcut key and pen; i find this far easier than using the middle mouse button. On the other hand, in rhino i use the mouse to orbit, or the pen, since the rhino orbit command is the right mouse button..also great in word for hi-lighting words, paragraphs etc, since you can type (as i find myself doing now) while holding the pen..

buy one - you won't regret it.

cheers
rabbit

Hi

sure, i (and plenty of others i think) would be interested in seeing how you do that....but there is no attachment to your post..

cheers
rabbit

Having watched the basecamp video of using layout, I have been inspired to look at it again…

1] I had not realized until this presentation that the way layout works is by creating a raster image of the 3D sketchup file. Thus the explanation of working in a low resolution and then upping this before print makes sense – I think this should be made very obvious right at the start.

2] Likewise that layout embeds the sketchup model, so it doesn’t matter how many times you insert (differing views of) it, it is still only that one model, not multiple copies of it. I think this also needs to be made clear.

3] All the general layout tools are really easy to use, and seem to do just what one would expect. A really good job has been done here.

4] There is no zoom window command. Why? This tool is available in sketchup, photoshop, all CAD programs for a very good reason. The zoom tool in layout is hopeless , since it zooms in and out without reference to where the cursor is, so then you have to pan after using it to get where you want to go.

5] You can’t turn the scroll bars off .

6] …but the really really annoying thing is that layout won’t import dwg files. Why is this a problem, when sketchup will, and then that file can be inserted?
It is a problem because sketchup won’t import a dwg file complete with text and dimensions; therefore there is no way of getting a dimensioned drawing into layout unless it is exported as a bitmap from the cad application, and the bitmap loses its scale information.
I have tried scaling the bitmap in sketchup, and this sort of works, except that it is not accurate since you can’t snap anywhere.
At present sketchup’s dimension tools are not up to creating construction drawings, and although the dwg exports of sections and plans from sketchup to a cad program work well, the reverse is not possible.

Thus:
1] sketchup’s dimension tools need to be bought up to scratch, (perhaps just in the professional package) or
2] sketchup needs to be able to import dwg files with dimensions and text intact, or
3] Layout needs to be able to import dwg files with dimensions and text intact, and also work with them as vectors, not bitmaps, or
4] Layout itself needs proper dimensioning tools, which once again means working with vectors.

Why this obsession with dimensioning – I am hardly the first person to complain about it – is that, if you are modeling stuff that is to be built in the real world, then that kind of annotation is essential, and the whole purpose of layout surely is to better present your model or concept on paper, and the whole point of doing this is so other people can approve it, and then still other people can go ahead and build it.

Cheers
rabbit

The database of hardware that supports sketchup needs additional fields to cover it - For example, it matters not only which video card you have, but also what drivers. In my case, (a HP Pavilion laptop with a nvidia go 7600 card) the initial software was vista, but i have "downgraded" to xp. Since there are no updated drivers for this card that support xp, sketchup had all sorts of problems, and it wasn't till i managed to install updated drivers (174.93) via modded inf files (http://www.laptopvideo2go.com/) that sketchup ran smoothly.

Running sketchup (and other cad / 3D programs that use opengl) on a laptop with nvidia cards can sometimes require additional tweaking.

cheers
rabbit

you might want to check this out

http://en.wiki.mcneel.com/default.aspx/McNeel/PointsetReconstruction.html

This is a free plugin for rhino that offers lots of possibilities for pointset reconstructions.

You can download a rhino trial which never expires, it just stops saving after 25 saves, and run the plugin to see how it might work for you. - http://www.rhino3d.com

Rhino is a perfect complement to sketchup, and many many things are much easier to create in rhino...
cheers
rabbit

So i have registered on the antics site, but to download the software i have to go through the antics / digital river checkout and "buy" something for $0.00, and in order to do that i have to enter a whole lot more personal info which is something i am not prepared to do...

even google does not require this... I have registered on the site, antics have acknowledged this with a return email, that should be the end of it.

I cannot tell you how much spam and other unrelated rubbish arrives every time my details are given to someone like this, and enough is enough....

cheers
rabbit

I use rhino and sketchup as my two main design tools - they complement each other very well. mostly I model anything I know needs to be fully documented in rhino V4, and use sketchup to visualise the model, texture it etc, but it depends on the job - sometimes i model directly in sketchup, then export section views to rhino to dimension etc.

Rhino has a skp import / export option, which works pretty well, although on a big model the exported skp file will be very big - rhino is much better working with big or complex files than sketchup.
I have found that dwg works very well for import / export between the two - in rhino you can tweak many of the dwg export parameters till you get the model to mesh how you like.

Rhino can make curved surfaces and complex curves with ease, that sketchup has great difficulty in doing.
V4 is a big step up from 2 and 3, in that it has solid editing tools that are similar to sketchups push pull, and also has full 2D document tools like line weight, line types, hatches, paper space etc...

They are both great programs, with different though complimentary strengths, and also both have a great company ethos, and are very easy and helpful to deal with - more than happy to give both these companies money for their products, which is certainly not the way i feel about many other software companies and vendors, but lets not go there....

cheers

rabbit