My wish list is pretty basic:

1. Provide a way to draw circles & polygons starting from an edge instead of from the center (like most 2D vector drawing programs can do).
2. Likewise, provide a way to draw rectangles starting from their centers.
3. Allow the cursor keys to constrain the plane of rotation of the rotate tool along the red, green, or blue axis, similar to how they set constraints for the move tool.
4. Similarly, allow the cursor keys to set the plane for drawing out rectangles, polygons, arc bulges, & so on.
5. Additional selection tools, modeled after the oval, polygon, & selection brushes in Photoshop, plus an option to limit what they select to visible faces and/or edges.

Personally, I think all the math workaround suggestions miss the point: computers are supposed to do the math for us so we don't have to bother with it. It is a bit ridiculous that a sophisticated program running on an expensive computer can't even do all the simple math functions of a $10 pocket calculator, much less provide a user-friendly way to accept fractional or mixed unit expressions!

This isn't rocket science. Writing the code to parse an unambiguous arithmetic expression like (2' + 4mm)/2 is something any competent programmer should be able to do without breaking a sweat. Likewise, it is not much of a challenge to write the code to recognize a trailing "d" as a diameter specifier.

Using SU 7, I often import dxf files that are missing faces & have extraneous lines, something like this:

Oddly, the diagonal lines connecting the closed shapes are all coplanar with the front or back edges of the closed shapes, but do not "cut" any of the shapes' edges. For example, the rectangular slots each have just 4 edges front & back, even though the diagonals intersect those edges at various points. This by itself isn't a problem; I simply erase those lines before trying to add the missing faces, so I have something like this:
To do that, I start adding lines connecting the closed shapes. That's where the problems begin. As shown below, adding two lines creates two faces, but only one of the closed shapes is cut out of the larger face:
To create faces for the remaining closed shapes so I can cut them out of the large face, I draw a line connecting two of their vertexes, but this only creates one new face:
not the two I expect:

This makes it impossible to cut out the openings for the entire shape while retaining the large face that I want to have holes in it for those shapes. No matter how many times I subdivide the shapes with new lines, only one face is created at a time, leaving a part of the shape's face a part of the large face.

Sometimes, I can select all the edges of the shape & use the "Create face" tool provided with SU as a plugin & successfully create the complete face, but sometimes this fails, & often the shapes have so many edges that this isn't practical, especially when the imported model has dozens or hundreds of missing faces.

I hope this makes sense, & that someone can explain why it happens & a practical workaround to deal with it. It only happens with some dxf imports, all of which pass the "Fix problems" step with no problems found.

Here is the skp file used for the examples, if that helps.Example.skp

@unknownuser said:

Sorry to drift off subject.

Ken, thanks for you forbearance.

Since my topic was intended to discuss anything that helps make managing plugins easier, your comments did not seem off-topic to me.

About your #1 point, there is already a list of "quarantined" plugins that cause problems in this forum. And the plugin gurus already seem quite generous in posting advice about how to improve plugins. Besides, it often isn't so much that an early version of a plugin has any real errors but that it just needs a little tweaking to handle special cases or extend its usefulness.

Regarding your database approach, I would like to see something sort of like that built into SU itself, or possibly in a companion app. As I envision it, it would be OS-specific & integrate tightly with the OS's existing file database services. I don't know much about how Windows handles that but for example OS X maintains a built-in, schema-based database of file attributes that can easily be extended to include almost any sort of metadata imaginable (via what Apple calls "Spotlight" plugins).

I think it should be possible to create an OS X Spotlight plugin that automatically parses SU Ruby files to catalog their SU plugin dependencies & add that info to the metadata store, or failing that at least build an Applescript app or Automator action or shell script to add that data to the Finder's "Get Info" comments field (which is also included in the metadata database). That would enable users to search for plugin dependencies using the built-in Spotlight search engine, or at least to see them in the "Get Info" comments.

As I said, this is all still a half-baked idea I've only just started thinking about, & I don't know anything about how to implement something similar in Windows, but I hope you get the general idea: I'm hoping for an approach to SU plugin management that requires little or no manual effort by users, provides plugin dependency info in a simple, easy to understand format, & doesn't unnecessarily restrict plugin developers to some standard that might stifle innovations.

It's a tall order I know, but I can dream, right?

@wind-borne said:

copied and edited a small app

Do you mean you edited the icon of the app itself or that Alfred stores its own copies of app icons & you edited that?

One of the reasons I use aliases is that way, if an update changes an app's icon (like when Trimble acquired SU), I don't have to worry that my custom icon will be erased & replaced (since it is just an icon applied to an alias file, & not to the actual app).

The one loader file/one folder per plugin approach has a few limitations. In particular, it isn't very conducive to the inclusion of shared resources (like LibFredo) that many different plugins use. I think that is a great idea: it reduces the size of downloads & the footprint of the Plugins folder, makes development easier, & potentially could simplify user management of plugins, especially if different developers were able to reliably leverage each other's resources instead of "reinventing the wheel" every time they need something that already exists.

I am aware there are potential problems with that approach too, like an update of one author's library breaking another author's plugin that relies on it, but I think that could be minimized & might even result in better, more robust code.

@unknownuser said:

[[and even more off topic ..i'm really liking this 3finger tap gesture in mountain lion.. tap on a word and the dictionary/thesaurus/wiki pops up ]]

Speaking of the OS X dictionary/thesaurus, if it weren't for the inline spell-checker that underlines words not in it in red as I type & offers corrections if I right-click on them, my posts would be full of misspellings & typos, & I would be revealed as the "spelling-impaired" person I really am.

Curious fact: the 3rd party software Apple uses to power its own user support forums includes a snippet of Javascript code that turns off the OS X in-line spell-checker in the reply editor! There are some things I don't like about the phpBB software that runs this forum but I am very happy it doesn't do that!

@unknownuser said:

nah.. not regional.. i think it's fair to say the vast majority of tradespeople worldwide just make up words as they see fit..

It is also fair to say that every word was made up by somebody sometime. The ones that become popular enough get put in dictionaries so people like me can post annoying references to them when someone claims they aren't real words.

@unknownuser said:

there's another way to do this that i've seen a few people around here using (myself included).. is to put the plugins folder in the finder sidebar..

I considered doing that too, but my Sidebar is already pretty full of things I need to access much more often than the Plugins folder so I opted for the alias approach for items like that instead. Otherwise, I would probably end up having to scroll through the Sidebar as often as the file list itself!

Either way, I would opt for moving the unzipped folder contents into the Plugins folder instead of copying & pasting them there to avoid wasting disk space on redundant copies in the Downloads folder & cluttering up file search results with all the extra copies. Retaining just the compact, zipped file in case I need to reinstall the plugin saves a little space & is slightly more resistant to mishaps like accidentally renaming or moving one of its component files out of its proper place in the folder hierarchy.

As my collection of plugins grows & changes, it becomes increasingly difficult to know which items in the SU Plugins folder are no longer needed because they support only a plugin I have deleted. This is mostly because there doesn't seem to be any consensus about the best way to supply support items: some authors use a single, top level .rb file & one or more folders for icons, libraries of supporting ruby files, documentation, & so on ... & some supply all or part of the required rubies as separate top level files, sometimes with names dissimilar enough that it isn't at all obvious they are all part of the same set.

I understand why that happens but I wonder if anyone has thought about or already created any tools that would help users identify unneeded "orphaned" items, & possibly also clearly identify which installed plugins are missing required support files. (Ruby console error messages are not particularly good in this respect.)

I have some half-baked ideas about how to create a stand alone tool to help with this, but they all depend on features specific to Mac OS X (Folder Actions, HFS+ file system attributes, Spotlight searches, etc.) & I have no idea if they would work or be useful to enough Mac users to justify trying to develop them.

Obviously, a cross-platform approach would be more useful, possibly one that leverages ruby files from within SU itself, but I haven't a clue how feasible that would be.

Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

TIA

@shannakae said:

I had permissions set to read write for everything but "everyone" so i updated that as well (as I am the only one using my computera anyway)….

In general, in Mac OS X it is not a good idea to manually change permissions on system level folders (including those in the main Library folder) unless you know exactly what you are doing. Instead, it is much safer & more secure to use Disk Utility's Permission repair for that. In particular, don't use the "Apply to enclosed items" option in the Finder's "Get Info" window unless you are absolutely sure that is necessary, even on folders in your home folder (which the Permissions Repair doesn't touch).

Also, if you plan on adding many more plugins to your Macintosh HD/Application Support/Google SketchUp 8/SketchUp/plugins folder, you might consider a shortcut that will simplify Dave's method a bit:

Create an alias of the plugins folder on the Desktop by pressing & holding down the Command & Option keys while dragging it out of the SketchUp folder & drop it on the Desktop. (Make sure the cursor shows a small curved arrow when you do this, indicating you are creating an alias instead of moving the folder itself.) You can then move this alias anywhere convenient, like into the Downloads folder.

Now, whenever you download & unzip a plugin, you can just drop the items enclosed in the unzipped folder (but not the enclosing folder itself) on the alias without having to copy & paste anything. Delete the now empty enclosing folder (& the original zip archive unless you want to save it for future use) to keep the Downloads folder tidy & free of clutter & you are done.

Funny. I sometimes hear "lathe" used as a verb in shops … but I have never before heard "bandsaw" used that way. Maybe it is a regional thing?

Anyway, in the sense of "shape as if by lathing" I think it is a better choice in discussions of SU tools & techniques than say "turning," which could easily be confused with rotating a shape.

@dave r said:

Lathed? Turned on a lathe. In woodworking, anyway, "lathe" is a noun.

At least according to the several U.S. English dictionaries I checked, it is both a noun & a transitive verb. See for instance http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lathe.

@unknownuser said:

something else i'm liking with launchpad (granted, i've used it for about 36 hrs only )..
you can move the apps around and drop them onto each other to create 'folders' and whatnot..

I haven't used 10.8 (& only was a beta tester for 10.7) so maybe it is better now, but one thing I hated about Launchpad in the 10.7 betas was it displayed every app on my Mac, regardless of location. Since I have dozens & dozens of Applescript apps & lots of seldom used 'helper' apps (like 95% of the stuff in the Developer folder), Launchpad displayed literally hundreds of apps on first use. I very quickly gave up on trying to organize them into logical Launchpad 'folder' groupings.

Besides that, none of the launcher apps I have tried let me easily substitute custom icons & 'nicknames' for apps like I can with my alias folder method.

re: Siri dictation: It strikes me as a lot like the inference engine in SU -- sometimes it 'knows' exactly what you want & sometimes it seems determined to do something else.

@unknownuser said:

re:launchers..
i'm stuck on keeping my apps folder in the dock and launch from there..

I created a few folders in my home folder that I filled with aliases of related apps, like for frequently used utilities, 2D/3D drawing apps, audio apps, & so on. I gave each folder a distinctive custom icon & a short, descriptive name. Then I put those folders in the Dock.

So instead of having to wade through a huge popup list of everything in the Application folder, I can easily control exactly what each folder shows, how it looks in the Dock, & include things not in the system level Application folder like AppleScripts apps, apps on networked computers, or anything else I want grouped with the related apps.

Plus, since the items in these folders are just aliases, I can rename them or give them their own custom icons without having to change anything in the apps themselves, avoiding potential hassles with app updates that might replace a custom icon or fail because the name has changed.

I also keep a select few app icons always visible directly in the Dock so I can drag & drop documents on them that otherwise would open with a different default app. That's handy for things like choosing which version of SU to use with a model & quicker (for me, anyway) than using the Finder's contextual menu "Open with…" feature.

@rich o brien said:

shame they changed the icon

It works out well for me that they did. I spend a lot of time converting a bunch of old dxf files I have into skp format.

As a retiree on a modest fixed income, I can't justify the cost of SU Pro so I use SU Free 7 for the initial import & then refine the files with SU Free 8. I keep icons of both versions in the Mac "Dock," & now that they have different icons there is no confusion about which one is which.

These dxf files are mostly from the "Replicas" CD that I bought long ago for use with an old 1990's Mac 3D modeling/rendering app called Infini-D from the now defunct Specular International software company. Many are crude by 21 century standards but some -- after a lot of work on my part to clean up bad vertexes, create & logically name groups & components, & so on -- look pretty good.

I would like to share them here and/or on the 3D Warehouse, but I'm not sure about the legality of doing that. I have tried to preserve the look of the originals as much as possible, but generally by the time I'm done maybe only half or less of the original geometry is left.

Any advice about that would be welcome.

TIA

For me, the most essential of the essential, why-wasn't-it-part-of-SU-to-begin-with? plugins is Rick Wilson's weld.rb available at http://www.smustard.com/script/Weld.

Even if you don't ever use any other plugin, the ability to join connected segments of curves, arcs, edges, etc. into one "polyline" is super useful, for instance so you don't have to group together or select each of them separately to scale them together, or so you can extrude a face along a complicated, multi-segment "Follow Me" path in one operation.

And it becomes much more useful if you use other plugins that operate only on or with connected line segments. like TIG's extrusion tools.

@mike lucey said:

I hope the other 30 odd downloaders have shown the good manners to thank you by PM but if they haven't please accept my further thanks x 30 for these ill mannered downloaders.

I may seem a little peeved but I find it very alloying and frustrating when I see this sort of bad manners here on SCF.

That seems a little harsh. There may be other reasons besides bad manners for the lack of thanks, among them:

• Language barrier - some downloaders probably can't read the comments, much less compose a reply.

• Lack of familiarity with how to post messages here - for some I'm sure it isn't very obvious what to click on to start a reply, or what all the options/icons/abbreviations mean. (Imagine that you are not familiar with terms like "BBCode," html code, & so on … even if English is your native language, technical jargon may be like a foreign language to you.)

• Accidental downloads - I'm pretty sure I am not the only person on the planet to mis-click on a DL link or to mistake one kind of file for another, especially when I get to some unfamiliar site via search engine results.

• Privacy/security/trust concerns - I know quite a few people who are unwilling to register or post messages to any forums like this one because they are fearful of inadvertently revealing private information that can be used by "data mining" software to compromise their (or their family's or their company's) security.