Price Rise
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Dave R;
I had a feeling you would come to Trimble's defense. Just saying 'there are many ways to run a company and attract customers'. Feel free to pick up my tab anytime....joe
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... also in the news ...
"Trimble announced that SU2016Pro will incorporate Skalp, Condoc Tools, Profile Builder 2, Vertex Tools, Artisan, Vali Architects' entire suite of extensions, 1001 Bit Tools Pro, and a few others (surprise!) as standard offering."
... and then I woke up ...
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official statement http://blog.sketchup.com/sketchupdate/lets-talk-about-price
edit: added and revised some math
So, new people pay 41% extra compared to 2012. People who already have a license continue to be happy using SketchUp paying $120 every year.
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@unknownuser said:
We’re continually investing in SketchUp, so that it improves in step with the other hardware and software you buy.
Interesting... i just tried to load a 1.5M poly OBJ into SU2015... no chance, i stopped it after 45 minutes of no response. And 1.5M is NOTHING today. 3DSmax did it in maybe 5 seconds.
And i remember that the first dual core processors have been introduced in 2005 - i've just build my new machine around an 8-core i7... great, now i can run 8 instances of sketchup simultaneously.
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I too am not happy with the price increase, without getting something in return. I'm self-employed and when (actually if) I raise prices, my clients always expect more.
I may be off base here, but why not get all the people who use Sketchup Make (free version?) for business to pay something, even if it's a small fee.
I don't think it is fair that I should have to pay (for Pro) and someone else gets to use Make for free to earn a living (or a little extra cash on the side).
Also, in my opinion, Sketchup is getting away from it's original purpose: quick & easy 3d modeling tool to set up perspective views (anyone that's done it by hand knows how much of a time saver SU is). A lot of the extra features, Layout especially, have no value to me.
Perhaps Trimble should explore pricing different Pro versions, or have add-ons for additional features at additional fees?
Just my opinions,
Glenn -
As a 'Make' user and having paid not a penny for what I have I still see a lot of basic items that need to be fixed before sketchup reaches a standard where I would want to pay for it. Here is the rub though, I get it free and honestly accept that this means a lower standard can be upheld by the company. Consider also the quite large improvements made since Trimble climbed on board and it is hard to see where the criticism is so harsh. 64 bit is here and while it is not before time it would NOT be here if google were still paying the wages bill.
I wish that the basic problems were ironed out and the gap between make and pro were wider but if wishes were fishes all I would need would be chips and I would be set up for free meals forever. I will take what I can get on the whole it is more positive than negative.
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@mike amos said:
I get it free and honestly accept that this means a lower standard can be upheld by the company.
You get it free because that was the condition imposed by Google to Trimble, to keep this version free alive. I don't know for how long, though... but FYI, this is not Trimble's good heart, rather this is how the deal was. Thank to Google for that.
@mike amos said:
Consider also the quite large improvements made since Trimble climbed on board and it is hard to see where the criticism is so harsh. 64 bit is here and while it is not before time it would NOT be here if google were still paying the wages bill.
Trimble did the improvements that were on Google's table at the moment of purchase, more or less... I agree that if it were for Google, maybe it had took way longer time to accomplish them. Think about this great improvements that Trimble did because "they considered that have to be done".
My rant is about too little improvements in this time before coming with the price raise. Yes, many things were done... Yeyy... at last. But I won't feel grateful for a delayed job that was eventually done. I will just say "thank you, was about time. Let's see how it goes from this point on".
As a MAKE user, SU is decent, so no complains about (especially because of the magic word FREE - still their EULA states that is forbidden to use Make for commercial purposes - aka for job).
But if you turn your eye to the Pro version and check the pro tools that come with (starting with different file importers and ending with boolean tools and Layout) you will notice that all of them behave rather poor, too much below the decent standard of any tool you are supposed to pay for. Layout 3, right now is like a improved Beta, like a Pre-Release Candidate.Think on this: you use PRO for the reason to do the work faster and better and you end up doing it SLOWER and with a lot of nerves (and sometimes worse because of the bugs) ... AND YOU PAID FOR THAT ! Your clients won't accept the excuses "you see, I am using SU Pro, we shouldn't be that harsh". And also Trimble won't compensate you for this either, even if you PAID for their Pro version. So, first, all this tools should become DECENT, like at least as good as the competition average tools available.
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If you have a competing application for $500 that does professional work in the modelling and presentation / construction drawing field, I want to investigate it. Are you talking about Bonsai?
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@pbacot said:
If you have a competing application for $500 that does professional work in the modelling and presentation / construction drawing field, I want to investigate it. Are you talking about Bonsai?
Blender is free, granted the ease of use isn't anywhere near SketchUp, however it is far more advanced, and you have $500 in your pocket to spend as you wish, be it add-ons or whatever.
Layout is a separate program from SketchUp, they come bundled in the Pro version of SketchUp (and it is not available otherwise), integration isn't as tight / good as it could be. In essence, you are exporting / referencing your SketchUp model in another program. By my logic I could do the same with other softwares and modeling programs in combination.
The problem here is I have too little time to learn other software at this time, I've also spent a lot on plugins / extensions, etc. for SketchUp. So I'll probably just keep on keeping on with SketchUp until: a) I get really fed up, or b) discover a similarly simple workflow that works better for me, or c) get a time and money windfall that will afford me opportunity to move to other software.
Admittedly I'm a bit of a SketchUp junky, hopefully they can keep my interest going...
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I consider LayOut a part of the pro package, most of what you pay the $500 for. Blender has dimensions, templates, scrapbooks and all that you use for construction drawings? I am so not ready to try Blender after all the pro modelers here tell me it is so hard. But if it has a path to creating construction drawings comparable to what people do in SketchUp (with or without LayOut) that'd be interesting as well.
After using CAD for so many years where you output from the same application you draw in, SU to LO does seem to add complexity in the process. But I have become used to the idea of a discrete model, which can then be used in CD's or can be rendered, each through specialized software. Still I find LO to be lacking in ease of use (actually lack of tools and features), and right now I mostly use it as a step to output SU to CAD. So I am doing sort of what you say, except the CAD software costs a LOT more.
I don't understand why Blender is free. I don't see how I can expect people to work and improve anything for my use if they don't get paid. To me SketchUP is very cheap compared to what I have paid for CAD (and that's nothing compared to what AutoDesk users pay). Still I understand the concern: price hike vs. lack of progress.
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$700... A bit behind the times, but I just noticed this...
What a kick in the nuts...Well, I guess I'm no longer saving up to purchase Pro... The extra $200 just put it out of my Hobby price range.
A nice thing to have done would have been to have made different packages available...
A full suite for $700 and separate SU, Layout and Style builder packages... Invidually sold they could equal more than the bundled $700 cost, but allow those starting off, semi-professionals and honest hobbyists to afford what they need.Bean counters and marketing professional would say that's not maximizing profit... But it probably would bring in more small users who have absolutely no need for layout or style builder.
The music industry learned that making stuff affordable attracts customers... Big software companies disagree.
There are two groups in their eyes... Hobbyists/students who get PLEs and limited feature free versions, and Professional who pay top dollar (to be honest, I'm actually surprised they did not raise it to an even 1k)...
There is no semi-professional on a budget or small businesses... Anyone starting out or struggling to get by can suck it.But whats done is done and I'm just shouting at the wind...
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I am purchasing Photoshop this evening for a fair bit less than $200 for the next year, with updates coming in as they happen. That price hits the sweet spot for me. It is an industry standard, powerful resolved program......................enough said. I hope Trimble gets my point
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@l i am said:
I am purchasing Photoshop this evening for a fair bit less than $200 for the next year, with updates coming in as they happen.
This is not "purchasing", this is leasing. You own nothing when you stop paying.
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That may be true, but the point for me is I would think less than $200 for Pro would be about the sweet spot for me, I was using the Photoshop upgrade as an analogy. And the $700 US is for "New Single User + 1 year Maintenance & Support" by Trimble, so OK you get an out of date program to keep forever. I would be happy to pay less than $200 last year for a pro upgrade next year.
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@l i am said:
That may be true, but the point for me is I would think less than $200 for Pro would be about the sweet spot for me, I was using the Photoshop upgrade as an analogy. And the $700 US is for "New Single User + 1 year Maintenance & Support" by Trimble, so OK you get an out of date program to keep forever. I would be happy to pay less than $200 last year for a pro upgrade next year.
I hate subscription programmes, I know I'm not the only one...
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@juju said:
I hate subscription programmes, I know I'm not the only one...
The world is moving towards this model so there's no escaping it.
Unless you embrace open source tools.
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Numerobis makes a good point re model size. Once models get up in size, and we're not talking big here, the lag can become unworkable. Plenty of benefits to the Sketchup/Layout workflow over 3ds max but model size and poly count is not one of them.
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@rich o brien said:
@juju said:
I hate subscription programmes, I know I'm not the only one...
The world is moving towards this model so there's no escaping it.
Unless you embrace open source tools.
I'm already looking into it. New systems only get adopted if the client base accepts it (or has no alternative, as you already indicated); if it's rejected strongly enough, the new system will not survive.
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