[Plugin][$] JointPushPull Interactive - v4.8a - 30 Mar 24

littleche

HI Dave

I had not checked the lines For this reason,The main tool push&pull was not any problem.
I did not know that fredo plugin is more sensitive.

thank you ...

Dave R

I don't know that it's more sensitive but since you have that little triangular loop with no face in it, i'd guess that causes problems. Try this: Scale the entire geometry up by a factor of 1000. make a face on that triangle by tracing one edge of it with the Line tool. Then trying running Joint Push/Pull on the result.

derei

Hy, I am a bit confused on how to PROPERLY use this plugin... Ok, I understood that I should keep the mouse button pressed while pulling the face, because click will only select/deselect (which is a bit annoying, honestly). But there is a funny behavior AFTER I do the push pull... sometimes (couldn't figure out in which conditions), when I press ENTER it actually CANCEL my pushpull.

Until now, every successful pushpull i did was out of luck... I have no idea how I confirmed the operation, because apparently I do the same thing like when it's canceled.

In my opinion it should do better use of ESC and ENTER keys (first to cancel, second to confirm). Also, selection of faces would be best to be key-assisted, as in regular SU behavior.

Is very confusing when plugins ask for different commands to do similar SU actions... is like two different programs. Select should be performed the same in native Su and under plugins (same key+mouse combinations), other operations should be similar.

Wish you best.

fredo6

@derei said:

In my opinion it should do better use of ESC and ENTER keys (first to cancel, second to confirm). Also, selection of faces would be best to be key-assisted, as in regular SU behavior.

Is very confusing when plugins ask for different commands to do similar SU actions... is like two different programs. Select should be performed the same in native Su and under plugins (same key+mouse combinations), other operations should be similar.

I know it is a change of habit, but JPP is not designed to replace the native SU Pushpull either.

SU PushPull only acts on a single face. So when you click, the next action is PushPull.

In multiface seelction, you cannot do the same, because when you click on the first face, then this face would move / pushpull with the mouse when you will try to select a second face.

The only possibility remain is to select with NO click:

if the mouse if over a face and you click, this face is PushPulled
if you press CTRL why hovering over faces (.ie. no click), then these faces are added to the selection. If you then click, the Push Pull applies to all faces selected.

This method is also different from Sketchup, which does not have a multi-element selection capability in implicit selection (i.e. just hovering the mouse).

Note that I use this method in FredoScale, but I am pretty sure few users noticed or use it.

I'll have anyway another look and reflection to see if I can improve the face selection process (the best, when applicable, is to select the faces and then just type the offset, if you don't need a placement by target).

Fredo

derei

I completely understand that this tool is not meant to replace a native SU tool. I was merely talking about the way of use of the similar commands (eg. selecting faces).
But this is not the biggest problem I got into. I could accommodate to it. The problem is that ENTER cancels the push-pull. I do it, i set custom value in VCB, then i press ENTER. And voila: no pushhpull. And I get confused: did I pressed ESC?
Unless there is any reason to assign a canceling to ENTER key.

By the way... "before" JPP wasn't behaving like this. It's like this change was introduced recently...couldn't tell which release.

Thank you very much, Fredo

fredo6

I will have a look.

The latest version of JPP is dated 9 Jan 15, so it's not recent, unless there is a side effect from LibFredo6.

Did the problem happens when you are extruding a few faces or a lot of faces (with many faces, you have a preview mode)?

Fredo

Dave R

I just did some quick testing and I'm not seeing any weird behavior with the Enter key. When I type a JPP distance and hit Enter, it makes the adjustment just like the native Push/Pull tool does. Maybe there's something else causing a conflict?

FWIW, I updated LibFredo and the other extensions that got recent updates and according to the Plugin Store and LibFredo, everything is up to date.

derei

I tried to reproduce it now, Couldn't. Will keep an eye on it, as it happened many times while working.

derei

UNDO issue ...
sometimes when I cancel JPP it lets the geometry with missing faces. Then I undo to get it back to its previous state...the problem is that i have to hit A LOT of UNDOs.
Maybe the undo function should be reviewed and pack multiple phases in a single undo command.

Ciacnorris

Hi, I tried to install it on my PC, and I think it doesn't work on Windows 8.1.

Are you gonna make it work on Windows 8.1 too?

Really wanna try your plugin!

peterromao

Hail to a very reliable extension which I have used countless times so far to give thickness to my sheets! Good Job!

Today is the first time that I found an error with it.

For some reason I cannot give this form a thickness.

The ruby error I get is the following:

Date: 07-Aug-15 19:49:31
An error occurred in Joint Push Pull
Error in generation of the geometry

reference to deleted Entity

JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 1027 -- entityID
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 1027 -- block in geometry_coplanar_edges_overhang
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 1025 -- each
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 1025 -- geometry_coplanar_edges_overhang
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 354 -- block in geometry_robot_erase_coplanar_edges
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 352 -- each
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 352 -- geometry_robot_erase_coplanar_edges
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 214 -- robot_call_action
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 177 -- geometry_robot_exec
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 160 -- geometry_robot
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 75 -- block in geometry_execute
Lib6Operation.rb: 325 -- call
Lib6Operation.rb: 325 -- step_geometry
Lib6Operation.rb: 367 -- start_execution
JointPushPullGeometry.rb: 75 -- geometry_execute
JointPushPullTool.rb: 891 -- go_preview_or_geom
JointPushPullTool.rb: 697 -- dragging_stop
JointPushPullTool.rb: 1319 -- onLButtonUp

I have attached the object.

Single sheet with openings.

TIG

If you JPP OUTWARDS it works OK.
Extruding INWARDS will fail.

This is because you have some tiny geometry in the surface - e.g. the segmented edges around the slotted holes semi-circular ends.

When extruding 'inwards', SketchUp's tolerance of 1/1000" can cause some tiny edges to be omitted - their start/end points are deemed coincident - then the faces relying on those also fail to be created.
But all is not lost...

You can JPP INWARDS if you do the following...

Make your group into a component.
Make a copy of it and Scale that x100.
Edit that instance and Preselect its surface.
Activate JPP - making x100 allowance in the offset value.
It will now extrude successfully.
Exit the edit and delete the scaled version.
The real size version will also show the JPP changes.
Tiny geometry can exist but it cannot be created directly in SketchUp.
The "Scale up a copy of a component" trick is a well known workaround for these kinds of issues...

peterromao

Hello TIG,

Awesome!!!!

That was an excellent reply. It worked. Thanks for the heads up. I recall doing something of the sort in the very distant past but if it weren't for your reminder I would have never gotten there!

Thanks again!
Peter

JQL

Fredo,

We are able to push pull by vector keeping original face orientation or by creating the ending faces as normal to the push pull vector. This is great!

Do you think it would be possible to pick any face in the project as the ending faces plane?

Thanks and best regards,

João

fredo6

Joao,

This is technically feasible, but more a matter of UI, which is already complex for users, as you know.

I'll see what I can do when I refresh the plugin.

Fredo

JQL

@fredo6 said:

Joao,

This is technically feasible, but more a matter of UI, which is already complex for users, as you know.

I'll see what I can do when I refresh the plugin.

Fredo

I understand perfectly.

It's also something that would be good to have but that can be achieved manually. I hope you find the time to include it someday.

Thanks again,

João

derei

Two changes would be great for this plugin, as it works somehow against "intuition":

-first would be Press RETURN to exit (that's the ENTER key, and usually is used to CONFIRM a action, not to cancel it) - best would be to use ESC Key

-second would be the obligation of inserting push value with (-) AFTER the push action was initialized. It is great to let the option there, in case the user really needs to revert the direction, but it would be better that once a number was introduced, to take "by default" the pushing direction already initialized by the user.

Another thing is that AFTER doing a JPP operation, I must be very careful what tool or key I press, or I risk to have my operation canceled... this is extremely frustrating, as there is no intuitive action. As I said before, I am tempted to press ENTER - but guess what? I cancel my work. If I press Space Bar (to go to select tool) it happens the same, if I click on screen I also cancel the operation... every time is "lucky guess". In my opinion should be clear: ESC= Abort, ENTER=Commit. Nothing around. To not exit from operation until ESC or ENTER was pressed. This way there is no chance of mistake.

I hope this suggestions make sense.
Thank you.

fredo6

Do you have a model where this happens? It must be related to the Preview mode, when you have a lot of faces.

Enter / Return is used to perform the Push Pull, so that you don't even need to drag the faces. The cursor must be still on one face, since when the cursor is in the empty space, it is used to exit the tool.
Escape does Abort when in interactive mode
Spacebar functions as in any Sketchup tool. If you did not commit beforehands, it simply exits with doing nothing.

Fredo

derei

yes, I had many faces in the model (organic modelling)...
But why there are 2 different uses for ENTER (when cursor on face, or not on face?) Is possible that is why I miss it many times... because i move the cursor around. I am not used to pay attention to it when i don't actively use it to manipulate geometry. Do you think this behavior is actually useful?

Thanks for all explanations

JQL

Fredo,

Would it be easy to have normal push pull Taper with an angle or a offset distance instead of exclusivelly by ratio? It would be a nice feature to have for chanfering faces outside their plane with a double click. (I love this double click through groups/components)