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    Geodesic roof help

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    • D Offline
      disturbed13
      last edited by

      so yeah that didnt work either
      so i got pdf views
      they are virtually printed on A1 paper
      so they are kinda big


      roof 4ft archmk1a.pdf


      roof 4ft archmk1right.pdf

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      • TaffGochT Offline
        TaffGoch
        last edited by

        Uhmmm, jpegs & pdfs don't help.

        I suggested uploading your model, so that I could measure & build upon geometry that is fixed and shouldn't change.

        You can save the model, using a NEW name, then edit the new model to delete everything but the subject geometry. The resulting model will be MUCH smaller.

        I don't really need to know anything about the remaining geometry of the house.

        "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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        • D Offline
          disturbed13
          last edited by

          okay lets see if this works
          so its 15MB still
          but i got a dropbox account
          https://www.dropbox.com/sh/y12qr2i8su78eln/HSvVqZssz8
          and you should be able to go there and download it from there
          i hope

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          • TaffGochT Offline
            TaffGoch
            last edited by

            disturbed13,

            Good download, of the 15Mb file.

            I immediately opened it, purged unused geometry, and got a file size of 74.5Kb
            %(#8000BF)[


            From Goggle:
            Open the SketchUp file, and click "Window" > "Model Info" > "Statistics" > "Purge Unused."


            From "SketchUp Sage":
            https://sites.google.com/site/sketchupsage/faster/purge


            ]
            Back to the model - I'll take a look at the roof geometry tomorrow.

            I already have questions about the curved lines of the roof and tops of walls. It is unclear whether these arcs are "fixed" geometry of your design, and should not be modified/deleted. (Regarding "Component#91") How were they established, and should they not be edited?

            -Taff


            Geodesic roof iso.png

            "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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            • D Offline
              disturbed13
              last edited by

              you are correct on all accounts
              'component 91' is the for lack of a better term
              outline of the roof geometry
              my roof is 6" thick for now
              ill deal with structure later (and i 100% expect dimensions to change when i add structure)
              'component 91' is the temporary outline for the room below
              there is no point to put any windows outside that since it will be over a wall
              the odd shape to the top of the image is where i had to add another surface to give an overhang on the back of the house
              if i didnt there would be a water fall running down windows
              which causes the roof geometry to be more complicated 😞
              but just incase i havent said this enough
              THANK YOU! for looking

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              • TIGT Offline
                TIG Moderator
                last edited by

                You have discovered that making a 'part' that you try to 'tile' over s complex roof shape is a nightmare.
                Here's another approach...


                ccc.PNG

                TIG

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                • D Offline
                  disturbed13
                  last edited by

                  very nice reply
                  i might have to try that
                  so far ive been useing one single component, the triangle
                  and turning it and copying the snot out of it with a dose of rotate to make it fit the arc of the roof
                  you way is far easier

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                  • pilouP Offline
                    pilou
                    last edited by

                    @unknownuser said:

                    is a nightmare

                    Yes if you want same triangle windows !

                    Frenchy Pilou
                    Is beautiful that please without concept!
                    My Little site :)

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                    • pilouP Offline
                      pilou
                      last edited by

                      Another approach 😉

                      http://forums.polyloop.net/picture.php?albumid=23&pictureid=655

                      Frenchy Pilou
                      Is beautiful that please without concept!
                      My Little site :)

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                      • TaffGochT Offline
                        TaffGoch
                        last edited by

                        disturbed13,

                        The roof sections that are in your model are referred to as "barrel vaults."
                        Barrel vault roof sections
                        The problem, which you've demonstratively-realized, is that equilateral triangles can not be tiled to fit a 135° "bend" in the barrel-vault curved roof.
                        135° barrel-vault intersection
                        Even if the intersection was 120°, which would, at "first blush," fit the equilateral triangle edge, can NOT be tiled with equilateral triangles. The reason is that, on a cylinder, tiled equilateral triangle edges follow a helix, not the planar intersection line between two adjacent cylindrical roof sections. In the image below, you can see the spiral helix path traced by the equilateral triangle edges.
                        120° barrel-vault intersection
                        If you wanted to employ equilateral triangles, making all the windows the same, it can not be done. There's no way to get around the mathematical facts of the intersection of cylindrical barrel-vaulted roofs. (Actually, even if they were NOT cylindrical, you can't get a planar-intersection arc to fit equilateral triangles.)

                        Did you want to proceed with triangles that are not equilateral?

                        Isosceles triangles might/should work, where windows in each ROW share the same specs.

                        -Taff

                        "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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                        • D Offline
                          disturbed13
                          last edited by

                          i had a hunch
                          i call it a variable pitch roof
                          from the edge to the center the pitch is as follows
                          1/3 > 1/4 > 1/5 > 1/9

                          i would really like to know the math/method that is used to figure out how to do it
                          as i have several more roofs to draw
                          and other parts of my design might get the triangle treatment

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                          • D Offline
                            disturbed13
                            last edited by

                            the whole point was to use as much of the same shape as possible to keep $ down
                            i welcome any guidance you can offer

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                            • TIGT Offline
                              TIG Moderator
                              last edited by

                              If the roof is a simple barrel-vault with equal length segments in its arc, then for a simple form you only need two main component 'panels' that are 'isosceles triangles' - one with it's point up-slope [designed in profile to let water run off its low-point 'sill'] and the other with its point down-slope [designed to let water run off its low-point apex].
                              These frames are then arranged radially in section, around the cross-section arc's nodes.
                              Purpose made cover flashings weatherproof the roof at the panels' junctions.
                              How the frames are supported or are made self-supporting is a major issue not yet addressed.

                              As well as the two 'standard panels' you'll need to consider how you terminate any verges, and junctions...
                              At each 'verge' you'll need '1/2' frames of the two main-types used in alternating rows, the opposite 'verge' will need a 'half' frame made from a handed version of the first verge's 1/2 frames, all depending how the pattern works across the eaves.
                              At junctions between barrels or barrels and abutments etc things become complicated !
                              Unless you contrive the roof so that where two 'barrels' intersect so that the angles are neatly formed at the diagonals of the panels' junctions you'll doom yourself to have to make many variants of infill part-panels...
                              At least with a geodesic dome you repeat most panels and only get convoluted where it's cut at the ground, doorways are added etc - and geodesic spheres are even simpler, especially if you only omit sets of whole panels to allow access etc...


                              Capture.PNG

                              TIG

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                              • D Offline
                                disturbed13
                                last edited by

                                well i figured it out

                                http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m294/hedoe/roof4ftarchmk1_zpsdaeb0a94.jpg

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                                • olisheaO Offline
                                  olishea
                                  last edited by

                                  @unknownuser said:

                                  Another approach 😉

                                  http://forums.polyloop.net/picture.php?albumid=23&pictureid=655

                                  how i made this a long time ago!

                                  http://i654.photobucket.com/albums/uu269/olishea/speed2.jpg

                                  oli

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                                  • D Offline
                                    disturbed13
                                    last edited by

                                    and the finished product

                                    http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m294/hedoe/buildmk3with4ftarchedroof_zps25093787.jpg

                                    i have 57 solar panels up top as well
                                    the passive solar shades are turned at a 30 degree
                                    and when compaired to the vertical
                                    they provide 61% more shade on the house

                                    if anyone wants ill post a thread on how to make the windows in that area

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                                    • TaffGochT Offline
                                      TaffGoch
                                      last edited by

                                      That triangular-windowed roof makes a grand addition to the design.

                                      It could, just as easily, have been composed of rectangular windows, with triangular windows at the intersections.

                                      Have you compared the appearance of triangular vs. rectangular?

                                      -Taff

                                      (Make no mistake, I'm a fan of triangulated constructs.)

                                      "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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                                      • jeff hammondJ Offline
                                        jeff hammond
                                        last edited by

                                        @disturbed13 said:

                                        well i figured it out

                                        nice
                                        good job 👍

                                        dotdotdot

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                                        • D Offline
                                          disturbed13
                                          last edited by

                                          @taffgoch said:

                                          That triangular-windowed roof makes a grand addition to the design.

                                          It could, just as easily, have been composed of rectangular windows, with triangular windows at the intersections.

                                          Have you compared the appearance of triangular vs. rectangular?

                                          -Taff

                                          (Make no mistake, I'm a fan of triangulated constructs.)

                                          it would seem like rectangles would make the number of different parts increase
                                          which would cause the cost to rise as well
                                          i might take a look at it later
                                          but for now im happy with the triangles

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