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    Geodesic roof help

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    • TaffGochT Offline
      TaffGoch
      last edited by

      disturbed13,

      Is the perimeter a regular hexagon?

      You indicate that the roof profile is 4' high, but the other dimensions you provided are unclear (as to which entities they apply.)

      -Taff

      "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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      • TaffGochT Offline
        TaffGoch
        last edited by

        Perhaps, providing the SketchUp model of what you've done, so far, is in order.

        -Taff

        "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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        • D Offline
          disturbed13
          last edited by

          @taffgoch said:

          Perhaps, providing the SketchUp model of what you've done, so far, is in order.

          -Taff

          okay
          i have some other parts in the model on other layers
          i have all of my second floor on there
          and im trying to cover the center room roof in windows

          oops....
          my file is 15 MB
          ill try to pm or email it to you

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          • D Offline
            disturbed13
            last edited by

            so yeah that didnt work either
            so i got pdf views
            they are virtually printed on A1 paper
            so they are kinda big


            roof 4ft archmk1a.pdf


            roof 4ft archmk1right.pdf

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            • TaffGochT Offline
              TaffGoch
              last edited by

              Uhmmm, jpegs & pdfs don't help.

              I suggested uploading your model, so that I could measure & build upon geometry that is fixed and shouldn't change.

              You can save the model, using a NEW name, then edit the new model to delete everything but the subject geometry. The resulting model will be MUCH smaller.

              I don't really need to know anything about the remaining geometry of the house.

              "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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              • D Offline
                disturbed13
                last edited by

                okay lets see if this works
                so its 15MB still
                but i got a dropbox account
                https://www.dropbox.com/sh/y12qr2i8su78eln/HSvVqZssz8
                and you should be able to go there and download it from there
                i hope

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                • TaffGochT Offline
                  TaffGoch
                  last edited by

                  disturbed13,

                  Good download, of the 15Mb file.

                  I immediately opened it, purged unused geometry, and got a file size of 74.5Kb
                  %(#8000BF)[


                  From Goggle:
                  Open the SketchUp file, and click "Window" > "Model Info" > "Statistics" > "Purge Unused."


                  From "SketchUp Sage":
                  https://sites.google.com/site/sketchupsage/faster/purge


                  ]
                  Back to the model - I'll take a look at the roof geometry tomorrow.

                  I already have questions about the curved lines of the roof and tops of walls. It is unclear whether these arcs are "fixed" geometry of your design, and should not be modified/deleted. (Regarding "Component#91") How were they established, and should they not be edited?

                  -Taff


                  Geodesic roof iso.png

                  "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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                  • D Offline
                    disturbed13
                    last edited by

                    you are correct on all accounts
                    'component 91' is the for lack of a better term
                    outline of the roof geometry
                    my roof is 6" thick for now
                    ill deal with structure later (and i 100% expect dimensions to change when i add structure)
                    'component 91' is the temporary outline for the room below
                    there is no point to put any windows outside that since it will be over a wall
                    the odd shape to the top of the image is where i had to add another surface to give an overhang on the back of the house
                    if i didnt there would be a water fall running down windows
                    which causes the roof geometry to be more complicated 😞
                    but just incase i havent said this enough
                    THANK YOU! for looking

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                    • TIGT Offline
                      TIG Moderator
                      last edited by

                      You have discovered that making a 'part' that you try to 'tile' over s complex roof shape is a nightmare.
                      Here's another approach...


                      ccc.PNG

                      TIG

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                      • D Offline
                        disturbed13
                        last edited by

                        very nice reply
                        i might have to try that
                        so far ive been useing one single component, the triangle
                        and turning it and copying the snot out of it with a dose of rotate to make it fit the arc of the roof
                        you way is far easier

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                        • pilouP Offline
                          pilou
                          last edited by

                          @unknownuser said:

                          is a nightmare

                          Yes if you want same triangle windows !

                          Frenchy Pilou
                          Is beautiful that please without concept!
                          My Little site :)

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                          • pilouP Offline
                            pilou
                            last edited by

                            Another approach πŸ˜‰

                            http://forums.polyloop.net/picture.php?albumid=23&pictureid=655

                            Frenchy Pilou
                            Is beautiful that please without concept!
                            My Little site :)

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • TaffGochT Offline
                              TaffGoch
                              last edited by

                              disturbed13,

                              The roof sections that are in your model are referred to as "barrel vaults."
                              Barrel vault roof sections
                              The problem, which you've demonstratively-realized, is that equilateral triangles can not be tiled to fit a 135Β° "bend" in the barrel-vault curved roof.
                              135Β° barrel-vault intersection
                              Even if the intersection was 120Β°, which would, at "first blush," fit the equilateral triangle edge, can NOT be tiled with equilateral triangles. The reason is that, on a cylinder, tiled equilateral triangle edges follow a helix, not the planar intersection line between two adjacent cylindrical roof sections. In the image below, you can see the spiral helix path traced by the equilateral triangle edges.
                              120Β° barrel-vault intersection
                              If you wanted to employ equilateral triangles, making all the windows the same, it can not be done. There's no way to get around the mathematical facts of the intersection of cylindrical barrel-vaulted roofs. (Actually, even if they were NOT cylindrical, you can't get a planar-intersection arc to fit equilateral triangles.)

                              Did you want to proceed with triangles that are not equilateral?

                              Isosceles triangles might/should work, where windows in each ROW share the same specs.

                              -Taff

                              "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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                              • D Offline
                                disturbed13
                                last edited by

                                i had a hunch
                                i call it a variable pitch roof
                                from the edge to the center the pitch is as follows
                                1/3 > 1/4 > 1/5 > 1/9

                                i would really like to know the math/method that is used to figure out how to do it
                                as i have several more roofs to draw
                                and other parts of my design might get the triangle treatment

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                                • D Offline
                                  disturbed13
                                  last edited by

                                  the whole point was to use as much of the same shape as possible to keep $ down
                                  i welcome any guidance you can offer

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                                  • TIGT Offline
                                    TIG Moderator
                                    last edited by

                                    If the roof is a simple barrel-vault with equal length segments in its arc, then for a simple form you only need two main component 'panels' that are 'isosceles triangles' - one with it's point up-slope [designed in profile to let water run off its low-point 'sill'] and the other with its point down-slope [designed to let water run off its low-point apex].
                                    These frames are then arranged radially in section, around the cross-section arc's nodes.
                                    Purpose made cover flashings weatherproof the roof at the panels' junctions.
                                    How the frames are supported or are made self-supporting is a major issue not yet addressed.

                                    As well as the two 'standard panels' you'll need to consider how you terminate any verges, and junctions...
                                    At each 'verge' you'll need '1/2' frames of the two main-types used in alternating rows, the opposite 'verge' will need a 'half' frame made from a handed version of the first verge's 1/2 frames, all depending how the pattern works across the eaves.
                                    At junctions between barrels or barrels and abutments etc things become complicated !
                                    Unless you contrive the roof so that where two 'barrels' intersect so that the angles are neatly formed at the diagonals of the panels' junctions you'll doom yourself to have to make many variants of infill part-panels...
                                    At least with a geodesic dome you repeat most panels and only get convoluted where it's cut at the ground, doorways are added etc - and geodesic spheres are even simpler, especially if you only omit sets of whole panels to allow access etc...


                                    Capture.PNG

                                    TIG

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                                    • D Offline
                                      disturbed13
                                      last edited by

                                      well i figured it out

                                      http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m294/hedoe/roof4ftarchmk1_zpsdaeb0a94.jpg

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                                      • olisheaO Offline
                                        olishea
                                        last edited by

                                        @unknownuser said:

                                        Another approach πŸ˜‰

                                        http://forums.polyloop.net/picture.php?albumid=23&pictureid=655

                                        how i made this a long time ago!

                                        http://i654.photobucket.com/albums/uu269/olishea/speed2.jpg

                                        oli

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                                        • D Offline
                                          disturbed13
                                          last edited by

                                          and the finished product

                                          http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m294/hedoe/buildmk3with4ftarchedroof_zps25093787.jpg

                                          i have 57 solar panels up top as well
                                          the passive solar shades are turned at a 30 degree
                                          and when compaired to the vertical
                                          they provide 61% more shade on the house

                                          if anyone wants ill post a thread on how to make the windows in that area

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                                          • TaffGochT Offline
                                            TaffGoch
                                            last edited by

                                            That triangular-windowed roof makes a grand addition to the design.

                                            It could, just as easily, have been composed of rectangular windows, with triangular windows at the intersections.

                                            Have you compared the appearance of triangular vs. rectangular?

                                            -Taff

                                            (Make no mistake, I'm a fan of triangulated constructs.)

                                            "Information is not knowledge." -- Albert Einstein

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