Sketchup is broken
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First off, I agree that these are things that should not be able to break. No matter how many plugins there are installed, it should not grey out menu items.
BUT, since we know it does, maybe we need to put pressure on the plugin writers to not put stuff into the right click context menu? If we eliminated all right click contect plugins, would that solve the issue?
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@khai said:
I'm beginning to wonder... problems on 64bit OS? on the laptop with the same Ruby's etc, SU is faster more responsive etc than the better specced 64bit machine.
I can't test it for certain.. but if someone else could..
A good observation! I still have a removable HDD with contains XP sp3, Since SU is not a 64 bit application, perhaps it will do better under the older OS. I will give it try.
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@chris fullmer said:
BUT, since we know it does, maybe we need to put pressure on the plugin writers to not put stuff into the right click context menu? If we eliminated all right click contect plugins, would that solve the issue?
good point! but then again maybe the Ruby API has some leaks in its current version?
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If indeed SU runs better with an older OS and lower spec rig then Google has a serious problem and need to get their product in line with today's technology.
I have bitched about it's poly limits endless times, now we are having bigger issues, IMO SU is becoming 'Etchasketch' of 3D modeling and either needs to catch up to basic standards or we need to migrate over to Bonsai.
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no no
not older OS. I meant 32bit vs 64bit. with my work here I found Win7 32bit was better than 64bit. but that's just one sample... I think tho it's something that should be looked at and discounted if it's just a fluke with the scene I was working on. -
Well there are a number of issues. Not the lest of which is the number of addons both commercial and free that are being written for SU. I have already found one culprit. With still no definitive answer.
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@thomthom said:
I moved all my plugins to a temp folder. And my menus are back to normal now. I'm adding them back as I need them one at a time.
What you will find is a plugin that start some type of bad behavior and will think you have the problem solved. However if you redo the exercise, changing the order of testing plugins, you will find out that particular plugin may not be causing the problem. Now some other plugin will cause the problem.
So just removing or not installing that plugin, which may work OK all other times is not really the problem. I have tried your method and I have never found a reliable source of the problems. You however, are much more in-tune and knowledgeable with script writing and you may be able to spot a problem.
What I know is that there seems to be no problem with any plugin that have a toolbar icon. Therefore, to me the problem is in the contents, edit or plugin drop down menu.
I would pay good money for some script writer, like TIG or CADFATHER, if they would take some plugins, with the author's permission, and make toolbar icons. Getting rid of the script in the context, edit and plugin menus selection and just allowing the toolbar icon to select and use the plugin. And the toolbar author would split the cost with the script writer. This way everyone make some money.
I don't want to cheat anyone, but the plugins have destoyed a very simple and useful program.
If you look at some plugins, they come up in the contents menu, the plugin menu and maybe some other menu, like the draw or tools. Plugin don’t have to be in all these different areas to be functional.
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@unknownuser said:
@thomthom said:
I moved all my plugins to a temp folder. And my menus are back to normal now. I'm adding them back as I need them one at a time.
What you will find is a plugin that start some type of bad behavior and will think you have the problem solved. However if you redo the exercise, changing the order of testing plugins, you will find out that particular plugin may not be causing the problem. Now some other plugin will cause the problem.
So just removing or not installing that plugin, which may work OK all other times is not really the problem. I have tried your method and I have never found a reliable source of the problems. You however, are much more in-tune and knowledgeable with script writing and you may be able to spot a problem.
What I know is that there seems to be no problem with any plugin that have a toolbar icon. Therefore, to me the problem is in the contents, edit or plugin drop down menu.
I would pay good money for some script writer, like TIG or CADFATHER, if they would take some plugins, with the author's permission, and make toolbar icons. Getting rid of the script in the context, edit and plugin menus selection and just allowing the toolbar icon to select and use the plugin. And the toolbar author would split the cost with the script writer. This way everyone make some money.
I don't want to cheat anyone, but the plugins have destoyed a very simple and useful program.
If you look at some plug ins, they come up in the contents menu, the plug-in menu and maybe some other menu, like the draw or tools. Plug-ins don’t have to be in all these different areas to be functional.
I'd like to see a plug-in to load and unload plug-ins. Kind of a plug-in Manager. Because sometimes I need to use the plug-in but not the other one, and vice versa. I have noticed with more plug-ins added to my computer the longer it takes SU to load and/or do certain things.
And as was mentioned, I think there are some plug-ins which break other plug-ins (not on purpose). If you have 50 plug-ins, trying to find the culprit can take a long time. Plus it might even be a combination of plug-ins.
So that is why I think a plug-in manager would be beneficial. I'll step off my soapboax.
Rick
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@unknownuser said:
What you will find is a plugin that start some type of bad behavior and will think you have the problem solved. However if you redo the exercise, changing the order of testing plugins, you will find out that particular plugin may not be causing the problem. Now some other plugin will cause the problem.
Yea - I'm pretty sure there is no single plugin that causes the diabled menus. The disabled menus can be reproduced without any installed. But having a number of plugins makes the situation worse. That's why I'm now rebuilding my collection by adding strictly what I use - not having loads of nice-to-have plugins.
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Well let me add myself to the list as well. I have also noticed this in the last few weeks. It's not every time I start SU but it is happening. I am on WinXP SP3, dual-core AMD based system with an nVidia GF8600GT card.
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@ Rick,
That would be a great idea, but until the wandering plugin menus problem gets fixed, it wouldn't be worth it. Every time you'd enable something you'd be chasing menus again.
Add me to the list as well of grayed-out plugin menus. I haven't updated to the most recent build of SU, but the problem seems to be worse with folks who have. That, or as they've updated, the number of plugins has increased as well and is part of the problem. Anyway, sometimes it happens very quickly ~ 5 minutes after SU start, and other times it'll take a half hour before the menus go grey. I wonder if it has anything to do with a particular operation happening simultaneously with auto-save? Quick way to figure that out would be to disable auto-save.
Win7 64 bit, Nvidia 9800 GTX+, Core Duo processor.
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You people are making me nervous.
I use sketchup pro current release.
I spend, on average, about 6 hours a day working with it.
I have never experienced any of the issues being discussed here.
"knock on wood"
I use less than five plugins.Is the over riding consensus that the plugins are the issue?
Have the issues been reported by anybody using a "clean" install
of su?
If it is a plug-in issue, is it Sketchups responsibility to adapt
their program to (for lack of a better term) home made scripts or is
it the script writers responsibility to make them work with su?The answer is probably...both.
I do feel a need to have an official su representative comment on
this and put fears to rest.Who are the official su people...are they part of this forum?
Paul
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@pmolson said:
If it is a plug-in issue, is it Sketchups responsibility to adapt
their program to (for lack of a better term) home made scripts or is
it the script writers responsibility to make them work with su?How on earth do you adapt to this? (spoken as a plugin writer)
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to thomthom,
How on earth would we do that?....That is the big question isn't it.I hope I did not come across as laying blame. That was not my intent.
I know nothing about writing plug-ins and I am very appreciative of
those of you who share your hard work.From what I can gather from reading this post, it sounds like
plug-ins are conflicting with an su update. Can we say that?If we can't definitely answer that question, then there is no
starting point for fixing it.I think anything can be fixed with the correct questions and good
communication with the people in a position to answer them.So, who are the Google sketchup people and how does one access them?
I really don't have a clue, are they just a ghostly presence moving in
& out of the forums dimension or...where are they?It is hard to believe that sketchup is broken. I do not want to believe it
Google Su official people, please come to this forumn and put these fears to rest!
p
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@thomthom said:
@unknownuser said:
What you will find is a plugin that start some type of bad behavior and will think you have the problem solved. However if you redo the exercise, changing the order of testing plugins, you will find out that particular plugin may not be causing the problem. Now some other plugin will cause the problem.
Yea - I'm pretty sure there is no single plugin that causes the diabled menus. The disabled menus can be reproduced without any installed. But having a number of plugins makes the situation worse. That's why I'm now rebuilding my collection by adding strictly what I use - not having loads of nice-to-have plugins.
i still don't understand why plugins can't be loaded on demand? all the menu's and such loaded but the code not executed unless called on during that session. or am i missing something?
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The disabled menus can be reproduces without any plugins. That indicate that the root of the problem is within SU itself. However, it does appear that having a great number of plugins makes the situation worse. But the does not seem to be any particular plugin that worsen it. Because of this the situation is very difficult to handle.
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Odd, I have 115 .rb files and their accompanying folders in my Plugin folder and I don't experience any such problems (Knock on Wood_Cherry_Original).
I also have a few more on my home machine and again, no problems. -
@xrok1 said:
@thomthom said:
@unknownuser said:
What you will find is a plugin that start some type of bad behavior and will think you have the problem solved. However if you redo the exercise, changing the order of testing plugins, you will find out that particular plugin may not be causing the problem. Now some other plugin will cause the problem.
Yea - I'm pretty sure there is no single plugin that causes the diabled menus. The disabled menus can be reproduced without any installed. But having a number of plugins makes the situation worse. That's why I'm now rebuilding my collection by adding strictly what I use - not having loads of nice-to-have plugins.
i still don't understand why plugins can't be loaded on demand? all the menu's and such loaded but the code not executed unless called on during that session. or am i missing something?
You can load plugins on demand - simply rename them from
.rbto.txtand then later useload "ruby.txt"- manually or in a 'tool' - BUT the rub is you can't 'unload' them ??? -
@unknownuser said:
You can load plugins on demand - simply rename them from .rb to .txt and then later use load "ruby.txt" - manually or in a 'tool' - BUT the rub is you can't 'unload' them ???
yes but the toolbars and menu's won't be there right? (and i suppose toolbar hell would happen
)i wouldn't mind it staying active per session anyway. -
And people wonder why I stick with Version 6.
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