SketchUp 2013 Gripes & Bitchin' ONLY ;)
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@mike lucey said:
@gareth said:
I'd much rather someone set a price, at least then I know I have not insulted or offended them by innocently undervaluing their work.
Gareth, I think many may feel this way and end up not supporting. The non commercial ruby developers for the most part do not do the work for big financial rewards but they do like to have their work appreciated and 'tipped'!
I think that an awful lot more than 1 in a 1000 would gladly buy TIG or ThomThom a cup of coffee or a drink if they met them out and about!
[attachment=0:913hky15]<!-- ia0 -->Support Creativity - Buy me a Coffee.jpeg<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:913hky15]
So, the simple answer is to cover them for the price of a coffee or a drink if your flush! I can guarantee they will not be in the slightest bit insulted
Good point Mike....and I'd be quite happy to provide them with a place to stay if they ever visit 'Down Under'....!!
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No amount of money, no matter how small, is an insult...
But 'Nothing' is the insult - even 'Thanks' is 'something'...I get donations ranging from ~£1 to ~£100 - but usually modest sums.
But if I get £1 from some poor student in Africa, then it is actually worth more to me that the £10 from a Western professional - who has probably saved himself hours of time/angst using one of my tools, but chooses to donate only a small fraction of his total saving... but then at least he gave something!I write 'commercial tools', often costing several thousand pounds... but you rarely see them, or perhaps you use them as part of other tools without realizing my involvement...
My 'donationware' plugins were never intended to make me rich anytime soon... but they are given in a spirit that sometimes I wish was perhaps more reciprocated that it is...
A 'Thanks' now and again is welcomed...
Occasional 'advice' is also welcome.
But the 'complaining' I can really do without
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oooops....sorry again for not bitchin'
....I guess i just can't get angry enough....!!
....I promise, I'm working on it..!
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@tig said:
No amount of money, no matter how small, is an insult...
But 'Nothing' is the insult - even 'Thanks' is 'something'...I get donations ranging from ~£1 to ~£100 - but usually modest sums.
But if I get £1 from some poor student in Africa, then it is actually worth more to me that the £10 from a Western professional - who has probably saved himself hours of time/angst using one of my tools, but chooses to donate only a small fraction of his total saving... but then at least he gave something!I write 'commercial tools', often costing several thousand pounds... but you rarely see them, or perhaps you use them as part of other tools without realizing my involvement...
My 'donationware' plugins were never intended to make me rich anytime soon... but they are given in a spirit that sometimes I wish was perhaps more reciprocated that it is...
A 'Thanks' now and again is welcomed...
Occasional 'advice' is also welcome.
But the 'complaining' I can really do withoutWell mate, the offer stands if you ever visit Oz...!
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@gareth said:
even for a very modest $10.....that would have been a nice little earner
but what is it really worth ?....much more I would suggest...!!
It depends... Some people use SketchUp and all plug-ins for professional or commercial reasons. They have benefit in having tools that makes their work easier, faster, more detailed etc.
But many SketchUp users - I dare say most of them - just use the program for fun, to play around with, to be creative. If they have to pay for plug-ins, they will probably not buy them and not use them. One group will continue using SketchUp with the limited features (without the additions of $$ plug-ins), others will see their creativity blocked or slowed down, and will stop using the program.Are some plug-ins worth more than $10? Probably. But they should be careful not to give an empty shell to "free" users, or to make people who already paid for a license pay even more for an optimal use of the program.
I think some basic plug-ins should be available for free for non-paying users, who can then buy some of the more sophisticated tools which are available for free for Pro users (since they already paid).
And why not keep it the way it is and ask developers to decide themselves if they want to make people pay, ask for contributions or give away the plugs for free?
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@mike lucey said:
Gareth, I think many may feel this way and end up not supporting. The non commercial ruby developers for the most part do not do the work for big financial rewards but they do like to have their work appreciated and 'tipped'!
Personally I always express my gratitude, when I download and use a plugin...
I have 'tipped' some of the ruby-guys (you know who you are) over time, but admit that I've failed to support others, although I do appreciate a script or two, which they've been making...I can only speak for myself, but I assume this is valid for many others as well...
'Tipping' is laborious - not much, but it is laborious... Sorry, but that's the fact...
Yes, if I met Thomthom, Tig, Fredo, Alex S., Didier, Rich, Whaat etc. I'd gladly buy a beer of a cup of coffee... No problema...!
However, whenever I donate a little to the authors for making my life a little easier, it's in the range between 10-25 EUR (depending on how much I feel the plugin is worth to me), but then I need to find how to make the donation to the author and then make the actual donation... Tiresome and laborious...
I agree, it's not a huge task, but it's laborious, hence I don't do it as often as I should...I believe that if I had to pay between 1-2 USD (or even EUR) per plugin, I'd do it...
To me the ideal plugin shop would be one, where I would need to pay an "entrance fee" and for this fee I'd get some credits which I could use to pay for the plugins I download...
Again I feel the plugin should then only cost between 1-2 EUR...
The plugins that are worth more, are already commercial, which is a different ball game...
When my credits are used, I can buy additional credits...
This way all authors would get rewarded for the precious time they spend making these gems...
But that's how I feel it should be... -
I tried bitchin once but it did not really work out, a divorce removed that particular cancer very effectively. So effectively it reduced my income for years. Does THAT count as off topic bitchin?
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I've donated to all of the ruby writers (well the 'major' ones)..
subsequently voiced a few complaints.
got the roll-eyes response.
tough spot to be in for me.anyway, certain ruby solutions NEED to be in the app itself.
then I can complain about them when they don't work right or optimumly. -
@frederik said:
Yes, if I met Thomthom, Tig, Fredo, Alex S., Didier, Rich, Whaat etc. I'd gladly buy a beer of a cup of coffee... No problema...!
Hvor i Danmark er du?
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@frederik said:
To me the ideal plugin shop would be one, where I would need to pay an "entrance fee" and for this fee I'd get some credits which I could use to pay for the plugins I download...
Again I feel the plugin should then only cost between 1-2 EUR...
The plugins that are worth more, are already commercial, which is a different ball game...
When my credits are used, I can buy additional credits...
This way all authors would get rewarded for the precious time they spend making these gems...Frederik, that is a lovely idea -- hopefully one that can be implemented somehow.
I had purchased a handful of commercial plugins (from Smustard) a few years back -- but then decided to hold off on purchasing more in light of how SketchUp was developing.
Likewise, I was on track to begin supporting my favorite free plugin authors (via donations) when news of the Trimble acquisition broke. Shortly thereafter came the final decision (on my part) to leave SketchUp behind (due to conversations had with "darling")... once I made that decision I uninstalled all non-commercial plugins from my system and began downloading demos/betas from competing software companies.
So I have not used any "free" plugins for awhile now... and I've barely used SketchUp in that time. Examples of commercial plugins I passed up due to this situation are Artisan(I already own SS), SketchUV, Vertex Tools, Instant Roof, Instant Fence and Railing, Tgi3D Amorph... and a couple more I can't remember right now.
So in a real sense plugin authors have already lost money as a result of the decisions made by "darling" -- even if I am only one person.
I most definitely appreciate the value added by the free plugin authors, but it is simply not enough for me to justify the cost of SketchUp... and commercial plugins only add to that cost.
If I were a non-commercial user of "Make" (ugh) then the situation would be entirely different.
Best,
Jason. -
I don't deserve to be on that list. I bastardize others code until it doesn't work then hassle them to fix it for me.....
That said I am learning Ruby and by the time I get even mildly proficient it'll be v2020...
Though keep on eye on the PluginStore for CloudUp
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OT: Sorry
@Jason
Instant Fence and Railing
Where did you find this? -
@bob james said:
OT: Sorry
@Jason
Instant Fence and Railing
Where did you find this?http://www.valiarchitects.com/subscription_scripts/instant-fence-and-railing
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Thanks, Pete
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@bob james said:
OT: Sorry
@Jason
Instant Fence and Railing
Where did you find this?Yeah where?
I use InstantWall by ValiArchitects and it can knock many fences and railings in seconds. Once you've customized a style you can use it later. There's room for additions and refinements, but the time and tedium saved is fab.
Hey I wonder is "bitchin'" sexist? I remember a period when that word was an adjective for really "cool" (or hot). Even a girl could be "bitchin'". Yeah, I'm older than dirt--or getting near.
(See how I worked that in?)
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My final input.
What's keeping people with SU is that there is no real competition.
AutoDesSys, Inc. has all the tools but they are not interested.
One good year of aggresive pricing and they would capture a bigger market share.
They haven't updated their newsletter since 2009.
Blog user bitch about it not being 64 bit (Bonzai3D). Sound familiar?
No layout type add-on. Limited Render choices.
Some changes, a few updates & SU price increase, they would win big (IMO).
Also, all the time the talented people here that dedicated all that time & effort to Ruby would find it hard to leave it. -
@solo said:
@bob james said:
OT: Sorry
@Jason
Instant Fence and Railing
Where did you find this?http://www.valiarchitects.com/subscription_scripts/instant-fence-and-railing
How its license work? 1 year only + constant internet connection?
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@rv1974 said:
How its license work? 1 year only + constant internet connection?
As far as internet connection I would much prefer he use something like the iLok -- I already have one that I use for VST (audio) plugins. That is the standard in the audio business and it works well for people who cannot have their DAW online.
I am even less thrilled about the idea of a year subscription fee -- this type of tactic really leaves a terrible taste in my mouth. I've not yet subscribed to anything priced like this, and that is definitely an issue for me as well.
Best,
Jason. -
@jpalm32 said:
My final input.
What's keeping people with SU is that there is no real competition.
AutoDesSys, Inc. has all the tools but they are not interested.
One good year of aggresive pricing and they would capture a bigger market share.
They haven't updated their newsletter since 2009.
Blog user bitch about it not being 64 bit (Bonzai3D). Sound familiar?
No layout type add-on. Limited Render choices.
Some changes, a few updates & SU price increase, they would win big (IMO).
Also, all the time the talented people here that dedicated all that time & effort to Ruby would find it hard to leave it.IMO bonzai3d is in a strange place -- it is not 64-bit, and I think that is largely due to the fact that it is made to compete with SketchUp which is also not available in 64-bit. I imagine if SketchUp were to go 64-bit (unlikely) then bonzai3d would immediately follow suit.
The reason I say it is in a strange place is: all the functionality for bonzai3d to be a monster software is already in place (inside form.z), so they could easily compete with SketchUp whenever they felt pressured to do so. Therefore, one can only conclude if a feature does not currently exist in bonzai3d it is only due the fact that they don't feel it is necessary due to SketchUp being such weak competition.
That said, all you have to do is look at the communities contribution to SketchUp and you see what bonzai3d is lacking -- namely, the user base is much smaller and not remotely as involved.
The reality with AutoDesSys is that form.z is where all the action is -- with bonzai3d being the "entry level" version... the fact that they consider their entry level software to be sufficient competition for SketchUp should speak volumes about how highly SketchUp is (not) regarded.
Best,
Jason. -
Another quiet gripe from me, stop sending me emails thanking me for downloading and then others telling me to download it because I can't live without it. I think I'm on my fifth gibbering email. The most recent one signed personally from my good mate John.
I alluded to this in my post way back in the first thread, but I say it now, the Marketing department of Trimble should all be fired.
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