Forums' Future ?
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@alan fraser said:
Not forgetting that the Boulderados will then maybe have the option to design their own website again...as in @Last days, instead of having it shoehorned into some bland corporate house style where you couldn't actually find anything.
God! I hope Trimble don't impose their own present web style. That would be a disaster.Ditto! I hope for a whole new website that present the whole environment of SketchUp, with it's resources (materials, components tutorials) and extensions ( render-engines, plugins ). Build their blogs into their website so the information doesn't appear to be so scattered.
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So...Whats next? Trimble SketchUp "back to square" 1? or it will continue with 9? any news about the latest version guys?
As a new + unexperienced + not so often SU user, it is hard for me to understand the essence of this discussion but it "smells" serious
I think I'll just ride the wave...all the best to SU and SCF
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I wasn't thinking of forum ... but that's me personally. I spend all too much time here already. Don't have time for another.
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- This forum is also a treasure to Trimble, they get ton of feedbacks for free. Without going out and do much researches, all SketchUp veteran come here and pour their wisdom in freely. Both positive/negative feedbacks are from people who love, care and understand SketchUp.
- I do monitored this forum long before registered, but I've been to those official Google group just 3-4 times for a few minutes. I suspected there're a lot of people like me. Official or not is not important,they are the people, contents and activities that matter. I almost never post anything becuase my english is not up to standard, I go to my local forum for that.
- Trimble should sponsored this forum in transparent manner, such as rewards for competitions in categories like components, models, techniques, Ruby plugin which will be 'free' to download as usual with no string attached. And that should be a good amount of money, not softwares only. Trimble should always raise up the standard for free plugins/contents to help raise the bar of SketchUp. And official plugins should do better or combine them and improved as 'distributions', so people see the values and happy to buy. It's a bit like open-source world like a CMS called http://Drupal.org, they are open-source and have ten thousands of modules developed for freely use, even for commercial purposes. And companies who founded by project owner later combined,developed and maintain them as distributions, caters for specific website uses, and give it out freely again being called Drupal Commons, Acquia Drupal, OpenScholar, OpenPublish, Conference Organization http://www.acquia.com/downloads#commons, then they provided add-on services for even convenient use. And no one can stop the user to install/modified the distribution further, any modules in Drupal ecology can also added later. And there're many more companies using this model based on Drupal. And most of them even paid/sponsors these module writers to develop more and more, and that's always in 1,000-10,000s $ ranges. And they always develop new modules for their own use and give it for free to Drupal ecology too. But one thing they never do is 'prohibited or killed those free content/plugins', contrary they 100 percent support and help them grow business. It's the right way companies can synergy with open, independent developers. I see many companies successfully grow by help their user grow, extend and push the platform to the limited. If SketchUp will be a platform, this is one of that proved successful. SketchUp can't grow if they prohibited free plugin or those Artisan, 1001Bits, Smustard, Formfonts, Maxwell, V-Ray or etc. They are Apps, and Trimble's SketchUp is iOS/app store. And Trimble being in the same position of Apple, the owner.
And to me, the most expensive asset of this SketchUp acquisition is user base. Software easiness can be copied eventually, try Bonzai3d or FormZ 7. But No 3D software can do this, BIG user based which have somewhat related to 3D modeling and it's not Google core/competant business. If it is, they will know what to do with it, acquisition would never happened for sure. I believe trimble, at least know the way to engineers/AEC pros/students. But what about average people, how they can monetize it. We should help them figure out in some way, so things can go win-win situation.
I understand Trimble need profits to answers questions from shareholders, but if realized that's not just applied to itself. There're ways to make convincing answers and give new and promising perspective. Their user need to pay bills and making money too, keep those 30 millions (or more) free users and let them grow and built business on SketchUp too. SketchUp have the potential to be the biggest 3D software in term of user base. Can Trimble make 3D modeling grow to 100 millions ? It's up to their decisions. And even Dassault will be afraid of that.
I'll know the direction of Trimble by seeing what it would do with this forum:
- If they positive about it, they will find many ways to support and see this independent forum as an valuable assets (And sure to assign/paid someone to monitor it). This user forum already bias a lot to SketchUp
. They'll love it if they don't planning to do something wrong. - If they feel somewhat unsure, fear or don't understand the value of this forum, they will leave it as is or with support that don't help raise the bar. Then it's mean they don't really understand SketchUp and don't have clear vision how to grow it. We know SketchUp Developments will be the sam as an Google age.
- If they feel negative with it forum, independent developers or even slow down Ruby API. That's also means they will leave free, things that don't generate income for them and frugal users behind. They are in for $$$ only. We all know the future won't be bright anymore.
There're a lot things Tekla or softwares in Trimble PortFolios can take benefit from SketchUp developments, both internally and independent developers. If they see the other way, I'm going somwhere else for sure. The world is moving on, I can't get stuck too long. If even Trimble failed to acknowledge from core devs meetings, so they'll also don't understand current users.
IMO This forum and core SketchUp developer reaction are the two best indicators of SketchUp health. We all know what they think, if they try to censor or not do good supports to any of them
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@thomthom said:
@alan fraser said:
Not forgetting that the Boulderados will then maybe have the option to design their own website again...as in @Last days, instead of having it shoehorned into some bland corporate house style where you couldn't actually find anything.
God! I hope Trimble don't impose their own present web style. That would be a disaster.Ditto! I hope for a whole new website that present the whole environment of SketchUp, with it's resources (materials, components tutorials) and extensions ( render-engines, plugins ). Build their blogs into their website so the information doesn't appear to be so scattered.
That's the only way they could have the official websites that people actually use
.
I think if they do really well, most people will feel very welcome to go there too.
And in fact, they can provide a place that facilitated forum, wall, downloads better than what ever available in SketchUp ecology. And place it in android market, and app store or Ruby plugin -
@hussel hann said:
So...Whats next? Trimble SketchUp "back to square" 1? or it will continue with 9? any news about the latest version guys?
i would bet money on it continuing with the current numbering system..
@unknownuser said:
As a new + unexperienced + not so often SU user, it is hard for me to understand the essence of this discussion but it "smells" serious
yeah, see, regarding the things i've said in this thread... i think have this bad habit of exaggerating things in order to make a point.. if i'm speaking to someone in person and do that, it works..
i'm not so sure if it works out so well in print.. -
I don't see them "buying out" SketchUcation -- there are too many practical roadblocks for that to occur.
Financial support (in the form of advertising) would certainly be an option and Trimble has a large array of products that could be advertised here to spread the word on its other offerings. This serves two purposes:
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Educates the users on what other Trimble products might benefit them -- this can be a good way of taking advantage of the "purchase" of the SketchUp user base... we are much more interested to learn more about Trimble products now.
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Shows they are interested in us as existing customers and community.
This is something that can and should be done ASAP.
Best,
Jason. -
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The way I see it, if it wasn't for this forum Sketchup wouldn't have survived and/or thrived. I couldn't imagine using Sketchup in its native vanilla form without all the amazing techniques, plugins and styles posted here. I see the transfer to Trimble as a possibility for new life for Sketchup as everyone well knows that Google seems to have let the project get stagnant on their end. With Trimble coming on board perhaps they will bleed new light into the project and use the undeniable resources here to update Sketchup to the software it really should be.
I mean, if Google hasn't alienated Sketchup users by lack of interest in moving it forward, Trimble won't be able to either.
I would just like to thank each and every contributor to this forum, be it by Plugin, Texture, Technique, Model or just a kind word of encouragement, you have all made this the true SketchUp forum, no matter whose ownership title is on the box.
Rob
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@rspierenburg said:
The way I see it, if it wasn't for this forum Sketchup wouldn't have survived and/or thrived. I couldn't imagine using Sketchup in its native vanilla form without all the amazing techniques, plugins and styles posted here. I see the transfer to Trimble as a possibility for new life for Sketchup as everyone well knows that Google seems to have let the project get stagnant on their end. With Trimble coming on board perhaps they will bleed new light into the project and use the undeniable resources here to update Sketchup to the software it really should be.
I mean, if Google hasn't alienated Sketchup users by lack of interest in moving it forward, Trimble won't be able to either.
I would just like to thank each and every contributor to this forum, be it by Plugin, Texture, Technique, Model or just a kind word of encouragement, you have all made this the true SketchUp forum, no matter whose ownership title is on the box.
Rob
I could NOT disagree with any word you said.
My real concern with a takeover by anybody, not just Trimble, whom I know nothing about, is from a business point of view. Most of that was mentioned in my previous post, but one aspect (unmentioned) needs to be highlighted.
Google was flu$h enough that it didn't really matter if SU made or lost $$$. I think they kept it going for the technology aspect, not the bottom line, else they would not have been so altruistic with a near fully functional free version, and very few paid options offered.
Trimble, I would assume, is a "for profit" company dealing in like technology. SU is probably a good fit to their product line, and SU's technology potential is most likely the main reason it bought it from Google. Not to kill it per-se.
But, as a for-profit company it has to justify the acquisition and maintenance cost to the bottom line in a reasonable time. If in fact the improvements to their core products from SU technology does in fact pay those costs down, then we have nothing to fear, as there will be no real need to kill SU, Free or Pro.
My biggest fear is that today, too many MBA's are calling the shots, and they have the training and dedication to ONLY improve the corporate bottom line. So if SU as a standalone product, does not pay for itself, there will be no compunction on their part to save it, and bye-bye SU
.But the technology will live on within Trimbles core products, and assuming any one of them can replace SU in function, then many of us may convert, if it isn't priced beyond reasonable.
I, for one, have been looking covetously at Solid Works, but at $3,500 a seat, plus add-on$$, it is totally unaffordable for what I do. So, I may probably stay with SU-8 (or 9) forever, much like I keep Wordperfect 8 as my prime word-processor.
I truly look forward to some senior Trimble exec to come forward here and explain the rational for acquiring SU and what plans they have for its future.
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@unknownuser said:
The way I see it, if it wasn't for this forum Sketchup wouldn't have survived and/or thrived. I couldn't imagine using Sketchup in its native vanilla form without all the amazing techniques, plugins and styles posted here.
I totally agree Rob.
SCF is the conduit for these amazing and generous guys to share their talents and hard work, without these additions Sketchup would be just another 3D app. I hope Trimble realizes what they have with SCF.
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I just Googled "Trimble" and read this following post. Interesting to say the least, and maybe, just maybe a ray of hope for the future of SU.
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Did all the author here patent their plugins?
Or it cannot be patent at all... -
@solo said:
@unknownuser said:
The way I see it, if it wasn't for this forum Sketchup wouldn't have survived and/or thrived. I couldn't imagine using Sketchup in its native vanilla form without all the amazing techniques, plugins and styles posted here.
I totally agree Rob.
SCF is the conduit for these amazing and generous guys to share their talents and hard work, without these additions Sketchup would be just another 3D app. I hope Trimble realizes what they have with SCF.
I am sure they do or will be made aware of it very soon especially with John B. and others on the SU team being involved here.
I anticipate good times ahead.
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I don't know what to make of this... I just noticed TIG's thread here and had to look up what the "changes" were...
Trimble?
Wasn't that a Star Trek episode? "The trouble with Trimbles"? (I know... Tribbles)
I'm by no mean in any loop (except maybe the occasional mobius time loop), but I never heard of them.
I checked out their website and it didn't reassure me any... maybe it is the globe logo... if science fiction has taught me anything, it is- companies with globe logos tend to create homicidal robots that run amok in the near future, or they "accidentally" awaken equally homicidal aliens that have been buried in Antarctica for millennia...
I'm probably the only one worried about that part though...
I hate change.
Not that I think change is bad... it is just that for the most part humans have an inherent way of taking something good or something that works and "reimagining" it or trying to fix, as the saying goes "what aint broke"...
Oh well... just shocked and worried... (horrible visions of TruSpace and Microsoft, ya know)...I'm not even sure if this is relevant to the OP, but as far as I'm concerned these forums... SketchUcation... IS SketchUp's forums.
I don't know how I found this place, but back a few years ago (my joined date is wrong) when I first came here I just assumed this was Google's SketchUp forum... it took about a year to realize this place is independent of Google (I'm not too bright, what can I say).
SketchUcation is great... an amazing mix of professional, semi professional, and newbies... I have learned so much from this place...
I can't think of where to go from there though... anything more might sound mushy... or crazy, but I have huge gratitude and admiration for the creators,staff, mods, crew and all the helpful generous forumites out there...I suppose, obviously if Tribble runs SketchUp into the ground that would spell an eventual end to this place... but can they cause change here? They can't stop the ruby coders from making scripts... they can't remove posts or effect TOS here? Could they?
The OP really worries me... maybe because TIG wrote it and he is pretty sane... TIG sounds worried... that worries me...I'm not even sure what my point is anymore...
If anyone from Trimble happens to read this post...
Please do your best to relate this to whomever (or whatever... see,I've got an open mind) makes the decisions regarding SketchUp...
Please treat SketchUp well... it may just be another acquisition to you, just some software platform, but to many, many people in the world it is far more... It is a tool like no other, that allows people... many of whom do not have the opportunity, time or money to learn other more complicated and prohibitively expensive software, to immediately begin to visualize their dreams, fluidly and intuitively.
SketchUp is more than just a tool... it enables the imagination and inspires the mind to follow the better part of the human spirit and create.
Please treat SketchUp well... you never know what great idea it will help take form or what young child it will inspire to to become more then their means allow.
This is more than software... it is something precious, with great potential... you are it's caretakers now.That and try not to unleash any homicidal aliens or robots in the near future... if thats okay... probably just me worrying about that though...
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I think we should sum up what this forum mean to SketchUp in a few minutes. To make sure Trimble people informed about the value. How about forum showreel?
To me, just one-two aspects is crazy enough.
A high speed showreel of ruby plugin magics in actions and images/videos produced from disciplines can make the whole world jaw drop, and anyone would realized the value of those plugin created by users.
http://youtu.be/G06gIBl8c9g
http://youtu.be/APEerQNvDd8
http://designreform.net/2009/09/sketchup-7-tools-plugins-and-scripts-similar-to-rhino-max-maya-and-revitAlso, I just realized I never seen any Official SketchUp showreel that really show what it can really do!!!
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I don't visit as offen as I'd like this forum, but i think it is full of great and talented people.
Congratulations for it guys.
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@earthmover said:
Indeed. This forum is far more than just a "forum". It is a hub. It's a repository of supercharged techniques, upgrades and modifications to take sketchup from a basic, border line mediocre tool and turn it into a tailor made heavyweight contender. So much so that Sketchup users can be divided into two groups, those who SCF and those who don't. This forum is home to free thinkers, artists and altruists. A place where national borders melt away and common ground is found in the shared desired to be creative. I hope this place stays exactly as it is. Independent and largely uncensored.
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Hi all
This Forum is just golden.
A special place and a statement of just how valuable and sacred free discourse and the sharing of ideas are.
Friedrich von Hayek noted in the "Road to Serfdom"
"The more security you get the less freedom you will have".
Just keep Trimble out of this and let them do their own thing.
The foolishness of looking to them for a few pennies is obvious.
When the camel's nose is in the tent the camel is in the tent.
Well meaning intrusion will be the ultimate result.My heartfelt thanks and respect to all herein for all that is so freely given.
dtr Architect
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To all the above comments about the value of this forum.That being said, however, it's a little unrealistic to imagine that a multi-billion dollar outfit is going to leave the customer interface for what might well prove to be the common factor that links all the disperate parts of its portfolio together, in the hands of a bunch of outsiders...however well-intentioned they are...and however passionate about the software.
Under Google's stewardship it was a no-brainer; they didn't even try. Googleplex could have ported a great website that was as user-friendly as SU itself onto a Google server, but insisted that it be crammed into the faceless and utterly unappealing format of the Google Help system. That's why we are all here...in what is, in effect, a carbon copy of the old @Last forums...albeit a little more evolved since then.
I guess what I'm saying is that invaluable though this place is, I wouldn't find it at all surprising if business imperatives dictate that a SketchUp user forum is set up on the Trimble site...and what's more (if Trimble are serious about the community aspect of SU and genuinely wish to foster that) that very real efforts are made to make that a vibrant, resource-rich community too.
Even more than that; if SU users want to have any influence on Trimble's business strategy (which will necessarily affect SU itself) then they are going to have to make contributions over there as well. John and the rest of the team may well make timely, if not frequent, visits here, but I don't think Trimble as a whole would be under any obligation to take seriously any considerations regarding their software that aren't expressed in their own forum set up for precisely that purpose.This is a difficult balancing act. It's impossible to overstate the value of Sketchucation...all the brightest and best of the coders are signed up here, most if not all of the beta team is here...many of them making the greatest contributions. Even the SU team itself finds it a more valuable sounding-box than their own forums. Not bad for a site which, at the time of the Google acquisition, was little more than Coen's personal blog.
Nevertheless, it never pays to shy away from realistic scenarios. Only by contemplating them in advance are you in a position to best deal with them if and when they finally land on your doorstep.
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Current forum membership: 119,200. Topics: over 38,000. Comments: over 383,000. If it is going away, it will be like a glacier going away. But I will stay as long as I am able.
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