SketchUp 2018

baz · 15 Nov 2017, 11:15

I was badly disappointed when Google made SketchUp free. I understand why, but I think it seriously undermined the adoption of 3D by professionals. "What, that free program?" was the reaction I often got when trying to sell my services to clients. You still hear it even now.

So Trimble moving away for support from 'Make' doesn't defrost my Kelvinator.

As for SU2018, the release notes seem to show many improvements which will improve my experience with Su.
Release notes here:
https://help.sketchup.com/en/article/141303
This is a long list, I expect to spend at least a couple of hours checking it all out.

I am frankly getting very tired of the naysayers who want bla de bla de bla ad nauseum.
Sketchup is primarily a design/drawing program. That suits me fine.
It has always from the beginning at @Last days applied the KISS principal and continues to deliver on that premise.

If it doesn't suit, please use Blender or something else and stop whinging. (Course you might have to pay for it.

derei · 15 Nov 2017, 11:43

I think they focused on the sector that is most likely to pay for their software: architects and builders. If their job brings a lot of money, they will most likely want to pay.
So, that kind of explains why they try to turn SU in an architect's tool and take off anything that @Last meant for this software when they created it.
While this makes perfect sense in terms of business, it damages a lot in terms of other values. But we live in a world of capitalism, so there isn't much to say now.
I said it from the beginning, after Trimble acquired SU, that the fact they raised the license price just after they basically changed the application's icon, was a bad omen...

Rich O Brien · 15 Nov 2017, 12:01

SketchUp is a PAAS (Platform as a service). You tailor to your needs via the extension ecosystem. You are free to make SketchUp do whatever you want via the API.

If it doesn't have a toolset then you can program one. If the API limits what you can make then pesters the devs to expose more functions.

I don't think you'll ever see a version where everyone says 'Wow!'. As Baz says, it's a concept visualising app for the AEC sector with presentation tools. One that is easy for anyone to learn 3D design.

As for this release, there are more SDK goodies exposed that remove the need for hacks and workarounds. This obviously introduces breaks with older extensions. Not ideal but definite progress.

The loss of Make, I'm sure is sad news for anyone that uses it. But the my.sketchup.com and older releases can be still used.

I remember SketchUp releases under Google where we got things like Building Maker and other useless stuff. Now every year we get a better platform to extend.

My only craving is a roadmap of sorts so devs can at least know where to throw resources to extend. Not knowing if SketchUp will tackle a problem you intend to tackle via the API can mean you spend time on something worthless.

Now, who's gonna get the 2019 wishlist going?

Rich O Brien · 15 Nov 2017, 12:12

@rv1974 said:

They updated cursors for the Circle and Polygon tools! How can you keep on (I'm so agree with baz) whining after that?

Quality of life improvements

rv1974 · 15 Nov 2017, 12:13

And besides, they updated cursors for the Circle and Polygon tools! How can you keep on (I'm so agree with baz) whining after that?

Dave R · 15 Nov 2017, 12:13

@derei said:

I think they focused on the sector that is most likely to pay for their software: architects and builders. If their job brings a lot of money, they will most likely want to pay.
So, that kind of explains why they try to turn SU in an architect's tool and take off anything that @Last meant for this software when they created it.

Architects were the primary focus of SketchUp when @Last began development of it. They aren't just now turning into a tool for architects.

SketchUp Make users are no worse off than they were two days ago. They haven't lost the the use of SketchUp and it's not going to hurt their wallets.

function · 15 Nov 2017, 12:17

It's a real shame they won't be continuing with make. the online 'free' is clearly not a replacement for the desktop version. I started sketchup with the free version and found the tools I needed through the plugins, now new users won't be able to do that.

Dave R · 15 Nov 2017, 12:21

@function said:

It's a real shame they won't be continuing with make. the online 'free' is clearly not a replacement for the desktop version. I started sketchup with the free version and found the tools I needed through the plugins, now new users won't be able to do that.

Sure they will. SketchUp 2017 Make will still be available as are several older versions. And the extensions will continue to work as they have.

function · 15 Nov 2017, 12:32

@dave r said:

@function said:

It's a real shame they won't be continuing with make. the online 'free' is clearly not a replacement for the desktop version. I started sketchup with the free version and found the tools I needed through the plugins, now new users won't be able to do that.

Sure they will. SketchUp 2017 Make will still be available as are several older versions. And the extensions will continue to work as they have.

They've ceased development on it, and replaced it with an inferior product bound to the web. New users won't get to experience all the plugins developed throughout the years, without backlogging to get an older product - which may be problematic on newer machines. It's just a real bummer, man.

derei · 15 Nov 2017, 12:32

@dave r said:

Architects were the primary focus of SketchUp when @Last began development of it. They aren't just now turning into a tool for architects.

SketchUp Make users are no worse off than they were two days ago. They haven't lost the the use of SketchUp and it's not going to hurt their wallets.

The Wikipedia page says

@unknownuser said:

@Last Software[edit]
SketchUp was developed by startup company @Last Software of Boulder, Colorado, co-founded in 1999 by Brad Schell and Joe Esch.[7][8]

SketchUp debuted in August 2000 as a general-purpose 3D content creation tool and was envisioned as a software program "that would allow design professionals to draw the way they want by emulating the feel and freedom of working with pen and paper in a simple and elegant interface, that would be fun to use and easy to learn and that would be used by designers to play with their designs in a way that is not possible with traditional design software. It also has user friendly buttons to make it easier to use."[3]

So, I couldn't say it was focused towards architects, but I can understand how an architect may see it that way. It's called biased vision. It is the same way I see that SketchUp would benefit of better uv-mapping - when I will be sent to Blender by some users. It is understandable that each of us see things in our personal way. Still, what's clear is that SketchUp was intended for people who wanted to draw (anything) in a less rigid manner.
Pushing active development in very specific areas of SketchUp clearly shows raised interest on a very specific category of those people who want to draw: the builders and the architects.
And yes, SU power comes from plugins, but when Trimble takes plugins functionality and makes it embedded in their program, seems more like indirectly screwing-over a plugin dev. I'm talking about Skalp here. While Skalp is certainly offering much more than SU does, I still consider that putting effort in making a redundant tool is not the way to support a flexible platform, grown by devs.

Dave R · 15 Nov 2017, 13:06

@derei said:

@dave r said:

So, I couldn't say it was focused towards architects, but I can understand how an architect may see it that way. It's called biased vision.

The original vision for SketchUp was to be a digital version of sketching on a napkin. It was marketed to architects. The original logo was a house and a pencil.

That's not biased vision on my part. I'm not an architect, either.

Rich O Brien · 15 Nov 2017, 13:07

@dave r said:

I don't have biased vision. I'm not an architect.

Do you have bionic vision like Steve Austin?

juju · 15 Nov 2017, 13:13

I'm sure dropping the Make version only came as there are MANY (note, not all, before I get flamed) Make users who abused the license (to which they agreed when installing the software).

Personally, I don't like online only software, in this case the added handicap of not being able to run plugins / extensions is problematic. But then I have Pro, and will be renewing my maintenance towards the end of the month, so this isn't an issue to me.

Some of the features / improvements they noted is almost like they did this especially for me, how well it has been implemented I'll have to see still.

jiminy-billy-bob · 15 Nov 2017, 13:39

@derei said:

So, I couldn't say it was focused towards architects

Layout, sun, sections, dimensions, Position Camera/Walk/Look Around, Geo Location, Match Photo, Two-point Perspective, IFC, etc...
To me, all these tools and features were created with architects in mind.
Not to mention the original logo, and the icons with buildings. Also the built-in materials categories: concrete, brick, cladding, carpets, roofing, stone, tiles, window, etc.

SketchUp has been aiming at architects since the beginning. But it doesn't mean it can't be used in other domains.

Glenn at home · 15 Nov 2017, 14:01

@pixero said:

Sure do hope this is fake. If this is true it's even worse than expected.

SketchUp only gets advanced attributes as a new feature???
IFC export/import we have already and sections we already have with the Skalp extension.

Looks to have been pretty much on the money.

derei · 15 Nov 2017, 14:03

@jiminy-billy-bob said:

@derei said:

So, I couldn't say it was focused towards architects

Layout, sun, sections, dimensions, Position Camera/Walk/Look Around, Geo Location, Match Photo, Two-point Perspective, IFC, etc...
To me, all these tools and features were created with architects in mind.
Not to mention the original logo, and the icons with buildings. Also the built-in materials categories: concrete, brick, cladding, carpets, roofing, stone, tiles, window, etc.

SketchUp has been aiming at architects since the beginning. But it doesn't mean it can't be used in other domains.

Those tools were added by Google in their attempt to make a world full of 3d modelled buildings in google earth. That was a initiative to involve people in 3d modelling their cities. That was before they realized is less effective and turned on to automated (satellite) mapping.
Ad for layout, that was a tool to incentivise the pro version, a presentation layout, because natively sketchup has little formatting capabilities (will output window size, instead of paper size).
Trying to cling on features like "icon was a house" is equal to saying that I was born architect because I was drawing houses on napkins when I was a kid.
Also, textures are clearly general-purpose textures with focus on whatever you find around you.
I see many of this replies as emotional, making a lot of effort to justify SketchUp as an architect's tool. But ask yourself, what architect would use SketchUp without the plugins? None. Because it would be a pain as a professional architect to work in bare sketchup. But, as you said earlier, it can be used for anything, that's why the plugin development was so much encouraged. So, again - if it was targeted from the beginning to a specific sector, then the efforts would have been towards that sector only!

juju · 15 Nov 2017, 14:14

@derei

Your profile states you're using SketchUp2015 Make, for product design.

Please clarify how the product design would not be a breach of the Make license?

Apart from your obvious disheartened replies here about the new release, what does SketchUp have to offer you that has you keep on using it?

jiminy-billy-bob · 15 Nov 2017, 14:16

@derei said:

Those tools were added by Google

That's the case for Geo Location and Match Photo, sure. But what else?

@derei said:

Ad for layout, that was a tool to incentivise the pro version

Layout was first released during the Google days, but its development actually started 2 years before Google acquired SketchUp. There was no Pro version at that time, because there was no Free version.
Plus, Google didn't care much about making money with SketchUp. If development hadn't already started, they wouldn't have created Layout.
I'm not making this up, I actually discussed this with the SketchUp team at DevCamp a few weeks ago.

@derei said:

But ask yourself, what architect would use SketchUp without the plugins? None.

I know many architects who don't use plugins at all. The few that do, actually learned about them through me
I agree that I myself can't imagine using SketchUp without plugins, but it seems that for many architects it's enough.

function · 15 Nov 2017, 14:19

for all future versions - all the plugins developed by the community over the years are now essentially behind a trimble pay wall. zoink

whitelock · 15 Nov 2017, 14:21

anybody know if there is more detailed info on the updates and how they work (tutorial video perhaps) been having a play this morning, can't see what use the new layout functions perform just by reading the little blurb they put out on the release notes.

Also any way to know if the plugins that i had previously from plugin warehouse will work with 2018.

I just hope this version is not a glitch filled monster like 2017 was.