Time to celebrate SketchUp! Revit reps walk out!

sketchydog

I'd like to check this out. As an intermediate Revit user, I am aware of the high level of complexity and very steep learning curve. I pity the one and two-person shops what are trying to implement Revit; it is not very usable right out of the box. You need to create or customize almost everything...all your walls types, tags, drafting notations, doors, windows, furniture, plumbing fixtures, etc, etc, etc. AND...for all that complexity, the Reivt model really get's you to about 75% of drawing completion/accuracy. In other words, the model has gaps and inaccuracies and lack of detail. This is normal. The last 25% of accuracy is done in detailing, manually, similar to AutoCAD but with cruder tools. It takes a long time to figure out how to put a good set together. I'm not talking about residential sets, I'm talking about large commercial and institutional projects $5 to 100 million, up to 500,000 SF.

If PlusSpec can generate tight drawings for something like that, well-documented, with tight detailing, section, detail and elevation references, etc, and complete scheduling of doors, windows, rooms, finishes, etc...I'd like to see it.

One of the things that drives me nuts in Revit is the fact that you are flipping back and froth between two section views, three elevation views, two plan views and a 3D view to figure anything out. Even the 3D view is not true perspective; it's axonometric, which is an odd/distorted way of viewing 3D. And there are a great deal of view templates and other visual filters that sometimes make it difficult to "see" what's going on. Revit has it's place for sure, but it's not easy. ADN- you add the difficulty of consultants to the mix, oh boy. Even if your office has good practices and standards, your consultants will often have no clue. We get models with electrical items, plumbing items and structural items all out of whack. sometimes we have to just completely turn off the linked structural model because it's so out-of-whack that structural elements appear wrong, missing or out-of-place in most of the views. Very, very challenging.

But having said that, you're going to have to emulate most of the intelligent features of Revit to be successful. You've got to have walls, for instance, that are highly controllable as a TYPE (or dynamic component if we are thinking in SU terms). Need to control overall wall thickness, structure (all the elements of the wll, outer skin, substrate, vapor retarder air infiltration barrier, insulation, studs/structure, inner substrate, inner finish...with thickness and specific attributes for each. You need to be able to cut a section or plan detail in any wall, or junction of walls, and see all the materials that make up that wall type. AND- you need to be able to adjust the visibility level of detail, so that in 1/8" scal eplans, you don't have all that detail trying to print and showing up as solid black, and conversely, that when you are seeing 1 1/2" details, all that detail embedded in the wall type now shows up. AND- you've got to able to effectively tweak and draft over these details as they appear on "sheets"...because the model will NEVER be detailed enough for 1 1/2" or 3" details.

Just some thoughts. I'll try and check this out soon. Good work! Nice to keep Autodesk on their toes!

Fletch

From the discussion above this sounds like a fantastic product - can't wait to try it. I am absolutely in support of anything notRevit or ACAD. I've wanted BIM strength and SketchUp agility for a very long time.

I built a tiny little clubhouse kitchen in SketchUp a few months ago, but in order to get it to be BIM-like so that I could do all the accurate take-offs there was a lot of extra effort involved in the modeling side that I would never normally do in SU. Getting it to play nice in Layout was also a big challenge. I was well reminded why I only use SU for design and presentations and never for documentation. I hope you've solved that problem.

aadbuild

Hi all, thanks for the reply, questions & suggestions.

@cadmunkey said:

Does it support UK steel section sizes? If so would it be able to do a complete take off of quantities for a full steel frame model?

We have all Australian Steel sizes complete yet we will create USA, UK and every other steel size as we get further into each country. The best thing for us is to have the manufacturers of the steel or any product involved. As Previously stated BIM's catalyst is construction and constructability yet to begin construction you first need materials that are made by manufacturers. We have received a couple of PMs in regard to actual construction companies having their products made and we are working through this now. Really what we need is all of the community to let us know what they need made to make their work easier. Things like product name , brand or even contact details will be of assistance.

@sketchydog said:

But having said that, you're going to have to emulate most of the intelligent features of Revit to be successful.

We don't plan on emulating Revit features as essentially our aim is to create virtual construction models (with in reason of course). Revit have used one method to do this and we are using another, our method is easier to understand and implement for the end user and it is faster / cheaper to communicate to the consultants in my opinion.

@sketchydog said:

You've got to have walls, for instance, that are highly controllable as a TYPE (or dynamic component if we are thinking in SU terms). Need to control overall wall thickness, structure (all the elements of the wall, outer skin, substrate, vapour retarder air infiltration barrier, insulation, studs/structure, inner substrate, inner finish...with thickness and specific attributes for each. You need to be able to cut a section or plan detail in any wall, or junction of walls, and see all the materials that make up that wall type. AND- you need to be able to adjust the visibility level of detail, so that in 1/8" scale plans, you don't have all that detail trying to print and showing up as solid black, and conversely, that when you are seeing 1 1/2" details, all that detail embedded in the wall type now shows up. AND- you've got to able to effectively tweak and draft over these details as they appear on "sheets"...because the model will NEVER be detailed enough for 1 1/2" or 3" details.

I agree 100% I think we have covered this well and with the next version we'll have a solution for all countries. Level of detail has been covered yet assigning materials in the section has been something we have been talking to the guys at Skalp about as those guys have done a fantastic job in this space. Level of detail (LOD) is something Revit struggles with especially in the time taken to attribute actuals. I am quietly confident our solution is better, only time will tell.

All in all PlusSpec makes design, collaboration and building faster and easier, PlusSpec also makes Sketchup much more powerful. As a result we have a more efficient work flow and therefore industry.
I am looking forward to hearing your feedback positive and negative. Thanks for your responses.

Krisidious

@sketchydog said:

You've got to have walls, for instance, that are highly controllable as a TYPE (or dynamic component if we are thinking in SU terms).

They have it... It's awesome. And it's just what the doctor ordered. If they add custom wall types... It's a done deal.

JQL

@aadbuild said:

I agree 100% I think we have covered this well and with the next version we'll have a solution for all countries. Level of detail has been covered yet assigning materials in the section has been something we have been talking to the guys at Skalp about as those guys have done a fantastic job in this space. Level of detail (LOD) is something Revit struggles with especially in the time taken to attribute actuals. I am quietly confident our solution is better, only time will tell.

This is good news!

When you guys integrate yourself with each other, I'm definetely going to try.

I'm just suspicious of a couple of things:

Heavy models - With all those multilayered walls Skalp will need for sections.
Corner details - As those multilayered walls will need a lot of detail on junctions with windows, different structural elements, other walls and design variations.
Window/door configurations - Frame/no frame, insertion on multilayered walls, editability and configurations on details.

For me BIM really imposes on you wich is the opposite of sketchup wich releases your design ideas.

I simply hate standards... will I work fine on Plusspec?

aadbuild

@jql said:

I'm just suspicious of a couple of things:

Heavy models - With all those multilayered walls Skalp will need for sections.

Corner details - As those multilayered walls will need a lot of detail on junctions with windows, different structural elements, other walls and design variations.

Window/door configurations - Frame/no frame, insertion on multilayered walls, editability and configurations on details.

For me BIM really imposes on you wich is the opposite of sketchup wich releases your design ideas.

I simply hate standards... will I work fine on Plusspec?

I could not have written a better reply to the post if I tried.

Heavy models - not on your life. We have nailed this down to a tee.
Corner details -done and done
Window/door configurations- We build windows to manufacturers requirements, yet you will find that most windows all use a similar set of rules, therefore allowing you to configure easily. We are making videos on this now and they will be associated with the full version. we are looking for manufacturers in each country and or state.

The industry needs to work to standarsds yet there is no "standard" standard. Omni class, Uni Class, Natspec and the list goes on. We have worked to a typical naming convention that is pragmatic & customisable. We do have improvements to make yet I am sure you will find the freedom second to none.
Logic is where Plusspec excels, yes there is work flow logic to adhere to yet is very flexible.

I don't like to hear architects, builders, designers or engineers snigger about the pitfalls of Sketchup. I have not heard one do it after they have seen PlusSpec. Imagine what they will say when we release our full version.

JQL, we can bang on about this for hours mate, do yourself a favour and use the free trial. Yes we are still making improvements, yet what we have already is more than enough to answer all of your question and some. BIM does not have to be time consuming or difficult if you have the right tools.

JQL

Hi aadbuild,

Yes it's true. I'm just being afraid of changing the "almost" perfect way sketchup works for me. It could be faster, better, less handmade, but it is a very good workflow I have here.

You've evangelized me though and, as I admited before, I will try your Plusspec... as soon as I have some time!

Thanks for your patience,

João

pilou

Does it work only with imperial units ?

solo

@unknownuser said:

Does it work only with imperial units ?

No, both imperial and metric, remember the USA are the only ~~idiots~~ people still using imperial.

Studio Aware

I am a soon-to-be registered architect, and I am an intermediate/advanced Revit user, and an intermediate ArchiCad user. I use these programs on a daily basis.

However, I have been 100% converted to PlusSpec. PlusSpec will change your life! It is revolutionary - and it has turned SketchUp into a beast! If you are an architect, designer, builder, engineer, estimator, or simply like to tinker - do yourself a favour and download the trial (and watch the tutorials). You will not regret it. I cannot wait for the full release.

Revit, ArchiCad, Bentley, AutoCad (and all of the others) should be shaking in their boots! I take my hat off to Andrew Dwight and the PlusSpec team. Go to the PlusSpec forum and leave a comment. I have never seen a company that is so interested and proactive in what their community has to say.

utiler

@studio aware said:

I am a soon-to-be registered architect, and I am an intermediate/advanced Revit user, and an intermediate ArchiCad user. I use these programs on a daily basis.

However, I have been 100% converted to PlusSpec. PlusSpec will change your life! It is revolutionary - and it has turned SketchUp into a beast! If you are an architect, designer, builder, engineer, estimator, or simply like to tinker - do yourself a favour and download the trial (and watch the tutorials). You will not regret it. I cannot wait for the full release.

Revit, ArchiCad, Bentley, AutoCad (and all of the others) should be shaking in their boots! I take my hat off to Andrew Dwight and the PlusSpec team. Go to the PlusSpec forum and leave a comment. I have never seen a company that is so interested and proactive in what their community has to say.

Could not have said it better myself, Drew. [except I've never used ArchiCAD, Bentley or Revit]

@AndrewD - mate, I'll be buying shares when you float!!

davesec

i'm interested in something like this. i'll give it a shot asap and get back to you with any feedback i have!

aadbuild

Dave check out tutorial 0 in help on the first screen. It is the best way to get the basics. We are running training in Sydney Australia and we are looking for trainers all the way around the world now.
Anyone interested in getting involved let us know.

Pixero

Am I the only one who cannot get Plusspec to run?
I've installed on two different PCs and all I get is a error message at startup.
I haven't had support come back with a solution other than to reinstall which I did.
Same thing happens.
Not a good start not being able to make it run...

Bruce Watt

@pixero said:

Am I the only one who cannot get Plusspec to run?
I've installed on two different PCs and all I get is a error message at startup.
I haven't had support come back with a solution other than to reinstall which I did.
Same thing happens.
Not a good start not being able to make it run...

It install ok for me.

tomot

2 issues:

I get the following when I go through Firefox to get to your site

This Connection is Untrusted
You have asked Firefox to connect securely to http://www.plusspec.com, but we can't confirm that your connection is secure.

Looking at your videos. You have the 2 lines indicating the hinge location of the opening window reversed.

ccaponigro

@solo said:

@unknownuser said:

Does it work only with imperial units ?

No, both imperial and metric, remember the USA are the only ~~idiots~~ people still using imperial.

For a global monitor that is a pretty cheesy comment.

solo

@ccaponigro said:

@solo said:

@unknownuser said:

Does it work only with imperial units ?

No, both imperial and metric, remember the USA are the only ~~idiots~~ people still using imperial.

For a global monitor that is a pretty cheesy comment.

Grow a chin, I'm a Texan and I think it's time we get with it and dump this silly archaic system.

Krisidious

Go ahead and pay the BILLIONS of dollars in retooling, retraining and restructuring of the largest construction market in the world. It's happening, but it will take time. Thank Britain for starting us down this road.

solo

@unknownuser said:

largest construction market in the world

That would be China at moment, just saying.