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SketchUp is not a NURBS modeler because...

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  • J Offline
    jeff hammond
    last edited by 24 Sept 2010, 20:34

    i think that image might be confusing unless you look at it very closely.. notice the blue surface isn't actually being created by those lines as it would be in sketchup.. the control points are influencing the surface but not defining it's boundaries.. those control points aren't the same thing as a vertex in sketchup

    dotdotdot

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    • D Offline
      d12dozr
      last edited by 24 Sept 2010, 20:50

      Link Preview Image
      T-Splines for Rhino

      Moving surfaces around like he's shaping the Universe, Josh Mings gets to grips with a surface modeling add-on for Rhino which offers designers and engineers unrivalled control over their freeform creations

      favicon

      DEVELOP3D (develop3d.com)

      This article has a good part about NURBS vs. polygons.

      3D Printing with SketchUp Book
      http://goo.gl/f7ooYh

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      • J Offline
        jeff hammond
        last edited by 24 Sept 2010, 21:27

        fwiw, nurbs like behavior isn't impossible in sketchup and we've already seen a few ventures into it..
        BezierSpline.rb is a good example and curviloft as well. (especially when looking at the various spline methods fredo has used and the edibility of surfaces).. i'm thinking fredo has a bunch of SUnurbs experiments going on at the moment and we'll eventually see even more nurbs style plugins.

        dotdotdot

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        • J Offline
          jeff hammond
          last edited by 24 Sept 2010, 21:57

          this may or may not help but an example of something that's possible with rhino but isn't with sketchup is this drawing..

          here's a surface that would be possible to mimic in sketchup (just a revolved spline) notice how it's mellower towards the bottom and tightening up as it nears the top..
          extendSurface1.jpg

          but, in rhino, since that surface is mathematically defined and not just a collection of vertices that aren't aware of one another (my simplistic definition of a polygon surface ๐Ÿ˜„), i can extend that surface very easily and you'll see that it continues tightening as the existing surface was doing.
          extendSurface2.jpg

          dotdotdot

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          • P Offline
            pilou
            last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 08:05

            and the funny of the thing is at least in final on your screen Su or Rhino are bother "triangles" from the graphic card for be possible to visible render ๐Ÿ˜‰
            (in my simplistic definition) ๐Ÿ˜„

            Frenchy Pilou
            Is beautiful that please without concept!
            My Little site :)

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            • T Offline
              thomthom
              last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 09:19

              Interesting... just last night I was revisiting my BezierPatch plugin I experimented on about a year ago...

              Thomas Thomassen โ€” SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
              List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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              • M Offline
                mitcorb
                last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 14:23

                It seems that every ruby extension created for Sketchup is analogous to features native to other modeling apps. That is simply because the needs are the same in Sketchup.

                I take the slow, deliberate approach in my aimless wandering.

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                • T Offline
                  thomthom
                  last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 14:54

                  @mitcorb said:

                  It seems that every ruby extension created for Sketchup is analogous to features native to other modeling apps. That is simply because the needs are the same in Sketchup.

                  hm...
                  One do not always need NURBS. Some times you do, some times you don't.
                  Nor do one always need every feature any other modelling application has.
                  If it had - then we'd have a big bloating beast.

                  But - SketchUp has a platform where you can make it fit your own specialised needs.

                  Thomas Thomassen โ€” SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                  List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                  • M Offline
                    mitcorb
                    last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 17:01

                    @ThomThom:
                    Yes. You are right about the beast. As we know the SU developers wanted to keep the app compact.

                    I take the slow, deliberate approach in my aimless wandering.

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                    • J Offline
                      jeff hammond
                      last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 17:03

                      @unknownuser said:

                      and the funny of the thing is at least in final on your screen Su or Rhino are bother "triangles" from the graphic card for be possible to visible render ๐Ÿ˜‰
                      (in my simplistic definition) ๐Ÿ˜„

                      yeah, in nurbs modelers we only see a representation of the surface via a render mesh and it's not accurate (well, it's 100% accurate if you take measurements from it or export to cnc production etc..). i think it's impossible to show a true nurbs surface on our current monitor technologies in the same way we can't truly see a circle on our screens.. (a bunch of square pixels can't display a true curve)

                      here's a closeup view of a rhino surface.. the wires are what you have to pay attention to and trust them but the surfaces will often to appear segmented (well, because they are meshes just like in SU)

                      click pic for larger

                      the one thing i don't really like about rhino is their nurbs to mesh technique and i don't think they're nearly as clean as they could be.. i hear moi is much better at this.. hopefully, rhino v5 (which will also be the 1st official iRhino release) will change this.

                      dotdotdot

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                      • P Offline
                        pilou
                        last edited by 25 Sept 2010, 17:20

                        yes in Moi you can regulate for have a "perfect fit" of the curve on the surfaces
                        But it's only for the screen and that can slowdown all if you have a very big file!
                        It's just for pleasure of the eyes ๐Ÿ˜‰
                        But for normal file size that is very cool ๐Ÿ˜Ž

                        Frenchy Pilou
                        Is beautiful that please without concept!
                        My Little site :)

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                        • P Offline
                          Pixero
                          last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 06:27

                          I've worked a lot with Nurbs in Maya and they are good for some things and polygons are better for some.
                          What is needed if ever someone makes a nurbs/spline patch ruby is that it keeps the editing capabilities all the time. Meaning it makes it possible to change the "subdivision" to polys even after editing and just crank it up when its time to render.

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                          • T Offline
                            thomthom
                            last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 10:29

                            @unknownuser said:

                            yeah, in nurbs modelers we only see a representation of the surface via a render mesh and it's not accurate (well, it's 100% accurate if you take measurements from it or export to cnc production etc..). i think it's impossible to show a true nurbs surface on our current monitor technologies in the same way we can't truly see a circle on our screens.. (a bunch of square pixels can't display a true curve)

                            mhm.. NURBS modellers will have to refine the mesh to the point where a edge segment is <= 1px

                            Thomas Thomassen โ€” SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                            List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                            • T Offline
                              thomthom
                              last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 10:30

                              @pixero said:

                              I've worked a lot with Nurbs in Maya and they are good for some things and polygons are better for some.
                              What is needed if ever someone makes a nurbs/spline patch ruby is that it keeps the editing capabilities all the time. Meaning it makes it possible to change the "subdivision" to polys even after editing and just crank it up when its time to render.

                              Something like this:
                              Experimental Prototype

                              ๐Ÿ˜‰

                              Thomas Thomassen โ€” SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                              List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                              • J Offline
                                jason_maranto
                                last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 12:47

                                Wow... a picture really is worth a thousand words. I can't wait to try that plugin ๐Ÿ˜ฒ

                                Best,
                                Jason.

                                I create video tutorial series about several 2D & 3D graphics programs.

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                                • P Offline
                                  pilou
                                  last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 14:13

                                  In these moments Scripts' conceptors are out burst! ๐Ÿ˜ฒ ๐Ÿ˜Ž
                                  Users can't follow the flux ๐Ÿ’š

                                  Frenchy Pilou
                                  Is beautiful that please without concept!
                                  My Little site :)

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                                  • T Offline
                                    thomthom
                                    last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 15:43

                                    And the plus side of these patches are that they are easy to UV map. ๐Ÿ˜‰

                                    Thomas Thomassen โ€” SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                                    List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                                    • D Offline
                                      dale
                                      last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 15:58

                                      UV mapping ๐Ÿ˜ฎ Please go on ๐Ÿ‘

                                      Just monkeying around....like Monsanto

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                                      • T Offline
                                        thomthom
                                        last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 16:02

                                        Patches generate regular geometry which is much easier to map as you know the full structure of the mesh.

                                        Thomas Thomassen โ€” SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                                        List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                                        • P Offline
                                          Pixero
                                          last edited by 26 Sept 2010, 16:57

                                          @thomthom said:

                                          Something like this:
                                          ๐Ÿ˜‰

                                          ๐Ÿ‘ ๐Ÿ˜„ Absolutly!

                                          Is it Nurbs or splines or what?

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