Regarding Lurkers...
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In September's CatchUp Coen wrote about 'Lurkers'. I thought we could have this thread to discuss the topic more.
I agree with the things Coen wrote. To them I'd suggest one thing about forum life that contributes to lurking is a resistance to intrude upon what is clearly an established group of friends. A lurker can feel they are an 'outsider'. In threads they see a group of people (the active participants) who appear very familiar & buddy-buddy with one another. That familiarity expresses itself in friendly quips, obvious knowledge of one another's backgrounds/lives, "insider" comments, and non-critical support of each other's postings.
To the person who feels themselves a bit of an outsider to this social network, there is a reluctance to join in. Why? It appears the strongest factor is a fear of rejection. Posting those first posts can take someone out of a comfort zone -- it can feel like it puts them 'out there' - vulnerable. They can fear being ignored, ridiculed, or not welcomed. Posting your work in the Gallery for the first time I imagine is very difficult for many people. Doing so not only exposes you on a social level but can also seem like you are putting your creative/professional life up for scrutiny. I have been involved in graphics-oriented forums as a moderator since the early days of the Internet. What I've learned is most people who post their work seek affirmation. They want others to appreciate it. Our egos can be very fragile things and that fragility is usually very guarded. Posting work and then having it ignored or glossed over can be a big blow to one's ego. It makes sense that many just don't accept the risk. What the 'lurkers' might not realize is that risk is there for all of us -- even the regulars. Almost all of us have made postings that did not get any or got very little response and it does feel bad like a stubbed toe. What the regulars realize is that maybe the timing was wrong or others were preoccupied with other topics. We try not to let the sore toe fester and make us lame. You put the 'pain' behind you and move on. Perhaps our next posting will spark a good discussion...
By the way weekends are the worst time to post anything. Most of the regular participants seem to stay away on weekends so many weekend postings are noticably slower to get responses.
For any 'lurkers' reading this please understand you really are welcome to join in. While it may seem like the regulars are a tight-knit group we are really a diverse group of people very open to the participation of others. We are real people - not just Internet personalities. Note that many of us post here with our real names and info about where we live etc. We do that because we know we are welcome to just be ourselves -- warts & all. You are welcome too. Using your own name certainly isn't required so do what makes you comfortable. We can all learn from one another. We can learn SketchUp related stuff but also learn things as diverse as this group is.
The fact that we come from so many different countries & cultures is one of the great things about these forums. So is our range of our ages, socioeconomic backgrounds, and the diversity of our life experiences. With regards to the interest in SketchUp that brings us together, we have a wide range of SketchUp skills. We all can learn from one another. The participant who has been using SketchUp for two days and wants to model a macaroni noodle really can help a SketchUp power user learn new things. The power users haven't forgotten being 'noobies' either so there is no contempt for people just getting starting with SketchUp.
Please do participate and help keep this community strong by sharing your opinions and inspiring us all with your work.
Regards, Ross
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These are very warm, welcoming and encouraging words, Ross, Thank you very much!
There aren't too many things I could add to this other than re-assuring any "lurkers" or "newbies" to bravely participate, ask questions or even just hop into already existing threads either by comments or questions.
We have established our "Newbie" forum particularly for those who might feel a little bit uncomfortable to post their questions in forums where - as Ross said - "very familiar & buddy-buddy with one another" kind of people post their (often just seemingly) experienced thoughts about things.
I myself keep learning from others every day. -
Good comments Ross, it seems that in the really quite short history of SU some of the most enlightening developments have been made by people who realised that they could apply SU to their own particular obscure area of design. Remember the model of a circumcision machine on Sketchup.com? Bizarre use but it tackled shortcomings in SU3 and achieved workarounds.
However AutoCAD has made the CAD and modelling world a very elitist world. AutoCAD biggest failure is it's unreasonable cost and industry elitism that excludes people who just want to experiment. Sketchup will develop into a much more rounded product that in my opinion already leaves AutoCAD in the dark ages because 1)It is available for free, 2) The users. We all help each other, no need for outrageously expensive training, 3) There is no elitism, if you don't know you ask, you find out. Sketchup does not make excuses for what it can't do (which isn't much) unlike Autodesk that try to sell you something else.
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Ross,
Thanks for starting this thread. I read Coen's words yesterday morning in Catchup, and thought about them considerably as I worked in the yard all day. With just 3 posts in the time I have been a member - I qualified myself as one of the "lurkers" the article was referring to. I have a few comments regarding the benefits of those that view but don't often participate in the newsgroups.
First let me say that Coen's initiative to develop this amazing place and these wonderful forums has been a gift to us all. For many of the same reasons that countless others have already sited - I feel this is a far better place to be than the old Sketchup forums. And with the recent changes and additions (especially a separate “politics” forum) that have been made and are still coming (attachment improvements) this place is becoming even more useful.
Best of all, this place is like one big multi-national family. Complete with crazy aunts/uncles, distant cousins you rarely see, and even some you know about (lurkers) but never have met. Just like any family there sometimes are arguments, and on occasion it is dysfunctional. But when you need them – there they are to support you and help you with your problems.
I think Coen is correct in identifying the benefit of having lurkers. I for one have discovered and benefited from the talents of this extended family. From the many images, ruby scripts, and content they have generously shared. In the future I will make an effort to participate more, and hopefully I can become a more productive member of the “family”.
Thanks to Coen for his guidance and all his hard work, and wishes for continued success under Gaieus’ administration!
Dean
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Get over it and get used to it - lurking is human nature - an integral part of the human condition. Go to an auction - how many people are actually bidding? Go to a Court room - the public gallery always has people and is often full - but not with victims. People lurk in real life - don't be surprised if they do it online.
[swfsta]
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I was a "lurker on the old forum. I signed up when I bought the software, and posted when i had a (single) question. I got an answer and I was OK. I bought SU because I was told I could import cad 3d into and texture. Well it worked but I wasnt trying to do that everyday. My bubble was burst about a year ago when I was trying to export the biggest house I have ever drawn into SU and it wouldnt go. I couldnt use SU in any other method.
Somehow I learned that SU was ridiculous at working with cad stuff, and it worked alot better just starting off in SU. About 2 months, (march) before the other forum was disrupted I had started using SU on a daily basis, It was gradual at first, but with all the practice, now instead of booting cad in the morniings, I boot SU. It has been quite a transformation... and you guys have been awesome getting me off the ground. I know there are alot of cad-ologists back at the old cad forum who have SU but dont spend alot of time with it. They haven't been bitten yet!
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Nice swfsta, you got balls!!
The word "lurker" has a slightly negative connotation; hence some possible negative feeling from "single digit" people...
But then again, i was a 'single digiter' myself when i started, infact; everbody was!!!
be back later,
Andrew
Veteran Lurker... -
Regarding "get over it", I thought that's exactly what Coen was saying. He has gotten over his earlier concerns and now sees some positive things about 'lurkers'. We all know 'lurking' is a reality. Most of us aren't bothered by it because, as they say, its no skin off our noses. But if for a moment you think from the perspective of a non-commercial website owner like Coen, then you'll see the reasons why 'lurkers' can have a negative connotation. No doubt about it -- lurkers are using Coens bandwidth and he's the one paying for it. If 50% of the visitors to this site are lurkers then almost 50% of Coen's costs are attributable to people who don't participate. Its no wonder many website owners don't appreciate lurkers. That Coen is able to see positives says a lot about him.
Regards, Ross
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ross,
your post shows why this is a special place, a place where people care enough for the others (mostly strangers) as to go through the effort of trying to make everyone feel confortable, lurker or not.
regards.
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