Finally gone back(i mean forward) to a PC!
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@jeff hammond said:
especially when considering that with the right software, and a few hundred bucks on a gpu, you'll get your 4hr render back in 10minutes.. and this is only going to get faster and more common.
yes, does seem to be where it's headed. I'll agree with you there.
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@andybot said:
well, I stand corrected. When I make a bazillion dollars freelancing, I'll get some goldplated mutha effin macs.
they're not that expensivei needed a new desktop last year.. (the mac pro being replaced was from 2006.. still runs fine.. just can't run newer OS`s so can't run newer apps.. ie- sketchup 2015 won't run on it)..
i also needed a new display.
i bought an additional 16GB ram from crucial for $140..so for not quite $2500, i have:
i7 quad @ 3.5GHz
nvidia w/4GB vram
24 GB ram
3TB fusion drive (which is 128GB ssd combined with 3TB spinner)
and a really nice 27" displaythis thing will be fine for at least 4 years.. (i mean, my old desktop was fine for 8 years so i'm pretty sure the iMac will last at least 4 years)..
so, that's $50/month if i replace after 4years.. i really don't understand the "oh, those things are soo expensive "... my internet service costs more than $50/month, you know?
how much is a comparable pc going to cost? (plug&play -- not frankengeek)
if it's $800 or something then yeah, you all may have a valid point.. if it's $2000 then big deal.
(but i know it can't be $800.. the display alone for a comparable setup is going to be near that)
edit- oh.. note the RFB at the front.. that stands for refurbished.. i always by refurbs from apple.. definitely some better deals to be had when doing that instead of walking into an apple store and buying off the shelf.
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weeell, actually...
Probably in the next month or two I'm going to rebuild my main workstation with an i7-5930k (6 core 3.5Ghz), and have been saving a wishlist on Newegg. So far my total is just over $1k (CPU, motherboard, 16GB RAM, heatsink), but I still need to add in a solid state drive. I bought a budget workstation with a 6 core AMD four years ago for just under $1k. I already have a nice 24" IPS monitor, so no need for a new display (hoping that lasts me many more years.)
It's just a lot easier to make a budget go farther when there's so much more choice in components, and I can keep re-using my tower and PSU, drives, etc. -
@andybot said:
weeell, actually...
Probably in the next month or two I'm going to rebuild my main workstation with an i7-5930k (6 core 3.5Ghz), and have been saving a wishlist on Newegg. So far my total is just over $1k (CPU, motherboard, 16GB RAM, heatsink), but I still need to add in a solid state drive. I bought a budget workstation with a 6 core AMD four years ago for just under $1k. I already have a nice 24" IPS monitor, so no need for a new display (hoping that lasts me many more years.)
It's just a lot easier to make a budget go farther when there's so much more choice in components, and I can keep re-using my tower and PSU, drives, etc.you're talking about upgrading an existing computer.. why people think it's not possible to upgrade mac desktops is beyond me.
also, for the build your own crowd, that comparison to a mac doesn't make sense either because you can hackintosh the thing.. the same components etc that you're saving sooo much money on will run windows or osx..
not sure why it's so difficult to get the point across that a mac is an exact computer.. just like a dell or hp.. go to dell, configure the thing, then plug it in and go to town.. that's what a macintosh is..
if you want to build your own then build your own.. install osx on it if you want.. install windows on it.. doesn't matter.. but it's not an apple branded computer just like it's not a dell or asus or hp..
do you get the point? your $1k upgrade can be a hackintosh or a computer that runs windows..
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You can't hackintosh any component you want. Only a few are compatible.
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@jiminy-billy-bob said:
You can't hackintosh any component you want. Only a few are compatible.
i think it's a lot more than 'a few' but building a hackintosh isn't the point anyway (nor would i personally ever build one)
the point is- if you're going to go on some tirade about how expensive macs are, at least make the proper comparisons..
like oli took a 6-core mac pro (which are base $3500), said he added a mouse, an extended warranty, a screen, and a bit more ram and presto, you're at $12,000
then compares this mac pro with its workstation grade components to his quad gaming rig claiming how macs are 5x more expensive??
this is just dumb.. sorry
nowhere do you see me saying apple computers are cheaper than other brands.. that's not what i'm trying to say.. what i am saying is that they're not insanely priced relatively speaking and they're actually quite competitive price wise.
maybe you guys don't realize it but it's pretty insulting when you sit around insinuating mac users are a bunch of rich assholes buying stupid shiny toys while anyone serious about using a computer or needing to get any real work done is obviously using the much much cheaper and much more powerful windows computer.. it's lame and it's false.
and hey, i don't have much of the problem with the insults themselves.. especially because they're not even true.. my griping is more about pointing out if you're going to make a bunch of idiotic comparisons (or lies even) or misconceptions, at least understand it for what it is (an idiotic comparison)
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Jeff I give in. I am going to buy a mac.
Then burn it.
FYI it was actually Rich who changed the thread title.
Don't take it so personally man, I've been using Apple for years and finally gave up. My money my choice. Simples.
They don't call it the PC Master Race for nothing you know?
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You can now run Verve!
Have happy painting!
And flowers power for all systems!
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@jeff hammond said:
do you get the point? your $1k upgrade can be a hackintosh or a computer that runs windows..
Jeff, hackintosh, really? Now you're stretching
For all that I'd just install Linux -
@andybot said:
@jeff hammond said:
do you get the point? your $1k upgrade can be a hackintosh or a computer that runs windows..
Jeff, hackintosh, really? Now you're stretching
For all that I'd just install Linux stretching what?
I'm just wondering how much a similarly spec'd hp vs mac costs.
hp is the hottest seller pc, right?
surely someone can tell me how much money I'd of saved if buying my config from them instead of apple..the way you all keep talking, seems like not only would I have saved all my cash, hp would have given me some money along with my free computer.
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no, my point being there's a cost to buying apple products that is not purely justified by base line performance.
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@olishea said:
Jeff I give in. I am going to buy a mac.
Then burn it.
FYI it was actually Rich who changed the thread title.
Don't take it so personally man, I've been using Apple for years and finally gave up. My money my choice. Simples.
They don't call it the PC Master Race for nothing you know?
Yes and our holy prophet (profit?) Saint Jobs told us all about the PC Master Race way back in '84.
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@andybot said:
no, my point being there's a cost to buying apple products that is not purely justified by base line performance.
well i decided to see myself and i think just going to the apple site vs trying to navigate hp's site is worth any extra cost of the computers
it doesn't seem like you can spec out one of their all in ones as a cad machine (2.2ghz was the fastest cpu offered in those).. so the desktop which is similarly configured as my iMac is this:
it's entirely arguable what a similar display would be as the iMac but i think this one is probably similar a 27" 2560x1440.. not the cheapest and not the priciest:
i'm pretty sure this is a fair comparison, component wise - agree?
so it's ~$2300 for the pc setup vs the ~$2450 i spent on my iMac..**
maybe i'm not thrifty enough but i really don't see much of a difference there.. but maybe that's just me..
regardless, for the third time (i'll just copy/paste this time)--
"""nowhere do you see me saying apple computers are cheaper than other brands.. that's not what i'm trying to say.. what i am saying is that they're not insanely priced relatively speaking and they're actually quite competitive price wise."""
**granted, i'm comparing a refurb mac to a full price hp.. i saved around $500 off normal price with the refurb.
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since this is the corner bar, I'll keep going. You still are missing the point. I'm willing to trade the convenience of a one-stop-shop for the reduced cost of building my own boxes. I can get a much more powerful (and overclockable) computer for significantly less cost. It would be just as pointless for me to shop on the HP site as it would be for me to shop at the apple site.
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@andybot said:
since this is the corner bar, I'll keep going. You still are missing the point. I'm willing to trade the convenience of a one-stop-shop for the reduced cost of building my own boxes. I can get a much more powerful (and overclockable) computer for significantly less cost. It would be just as pointless for me to shop on the HP site as it would be for me to shop at the apple site.
i really don't think i'm missing your point.. just that i'm talking to a larger crowd. (as in -- nowhere do i think i've even hinted at macs being competitively priced against a build-ur-own box.)
or- your argument isn't necessarily mac vs. pc pricing... it's mac AND pc vs. build your own.
thing is.. if only a handful of people are using macs... then only a handful of that handful are building their own computers.. most people, by far, are buying their computers pre-built / brand names and that's what i'm talking about..
but of course you can bypass the manufacturers and build/support/maintain it yourself.. that's an argument in itself of whether or not it's worth the saving$ vs. time&know-how to do it yourself but statistics wise, i'm thinking you'll find around 95% of people prefer to pay for convenience.
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OK. You have £1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.
Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.
Click render.
Which one will be quicker?
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@olishea said:
OK. You have £1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.
Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.
Click render.
Which one will be quicker?
quicker at what?
you could go buy a mac or pc, plug it in, install the rendering software, and complete a render-faster than-
going to buy all the individual parts, assembling them, then plugging in/installing/rendering.
that said, if the above scenario is your criteria for choosing a computer then we're just different.. different enough that i don't think either of us would change the other's mind.
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@olishea said:
No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.
Apple Store refurbs have the same warranty as new Macs: 14 day return / 90 day support / 1 yr warranty / Apple Care available. So no reason to exclude them from consideration.
That said, I don't think Jeff or anyone else thinks that you can't get more rendering power for less cash in a build-your-own scenario than any other.
The actual cost comparison should include the soft costs (including the value of the many hours spent researching/purchasing/assembling/loading OS & Drivers etc...). For most if us, we want to use the tool to get work done, not work to get the tool done.
For me, the f.ck-around factor —and hours spent trouble-shooting things that should work but don't (incompatible components/driver issues etc..)— isn't worth the cash saved.
If it is for you, great! Happy that you like your new box as much as I like my new Mac.
No doubt we each bought something —as did Jeff— that meets our current needs well. -
@unknownuser said:
Buy a PC. Build a PC.
Click render.
Which one will be quicker?
Mine, a ~ six years old dual xeon macpro. You gonna bet? ( a pc ~ 1500 euros, right?)
Click render. A CPU based render, right?
GPU renders are depended on the GPU card and nothing else. I can install any commercial GPU you like. -
@michaliszissiou said:
Any advices about a new decent mouse? A decent desktop mouse, not these gamer's mice with 40 buttons, I mean.
I just got this one a few months ago, and it works awesome ($11): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IAM78WS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8%26amp;psc=1
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