Unexpected behavior saving styles with scenes

Msketcher

I can't get it to do that on my mac...
the scenes switch styles even if one is in update state...

Is it only when your not in the model collection? [your in the default collection in your video]
john

Perhaps Mac is different?

Regarding "In Model" vs "default", it's my understanding that as soon as you click on a style in any folder, it creates a copy, saves it in your "In Model" folder. So you're actually seeing and editing the "In Model" copy regardless.

Rich O Brien

That's a good point.

Blender has a similar issue but it dumps out unused elements on save.

If there is a reason you need that duplicate setting then you can make it a Fake User setting so it saves with the file.

I'm going off topic.

I see your point though. Your temp tweaks are becoming associated to other scenes.

Msketcher

Exactly, my temporary tweaks are being associated to other scenes. That's the point I'm trying to make.

pbacot

Yes it happens on the Mac. The thing is if the other scenes have the same style, you've not done a style change, so you still see the style which is under temporary adjustment.

Does that really happen in LO?

Rich O Brien

The only thing is that styles remember all their original settings. So toggling X-ray on causes the refresh but toggling off restores it to its original config.

In terms of explaining this behavior via a video tutorial.....it'll be like watching Inception again

Msketcher

@pbacot said:

Yes it happens on the Mac. The thing is if the other scenes have the same style, you've not done a style change, so you still see the style which is under temporary adjustment.

Does that really happen in LO?

Here are the conditions that will cause all your LayOut scenes to get messed up:

Save scenes with a specific style.
With that same style active, make some temporary style overrides. (Don't save the style)
Save your model.
Open LayOut, Update model reference. (All your viewports will show the temporary style overrides, even though you didn't save them to the style.)

I guarantee a million people have had this happen and didn't even know it. I know I have. The problem is it's an easy fix. Just open SketchUp again, click on any style, and you're all set. So it's nearly impossible to put your finger on, you think you're just going crazy.

Dave R

@msketcher said:

...you think you're just going crazy.

Are you sure you aren't?

Sorry. It was an easy opening.

I learned a long time ago with LO to make sure that my SU model shows no un-updated styles; that is, no styles which display the circular arrows over the thumbnail; before saving the file and going or returning to LO. if I make a change to a style setting, I click on the thumbnail to update the style or, I right click on the scene tab and choose Update from the context menu. If the style is different from the scene's definition, the warning box pops up asking what to do with the style. Some people do turn off that warning box and that seems to create all kinds of trouble for them.

driven

@dave r said:

...Some people do turn off that warning box and that seems to create all kinds of trouble for them.

I have my warning turned off and I can't reproduce the in SU problem...
I must be doing it wrong...
john

Dave R

John, if you make a change to the current style without updating it and then create a scene, do you have a work flow to ensure the style gets updated?

driven

@dave
doing it like that I get the warning dialog [which I'm sure was disabled]...

since I can't reproduce the issue, It's best I withdraw before I learn how to...

john

Dave R

Nah. Stay in. I'd guess the warning isn't disabled then.

driven

have you ever gotten really lost...

then some time later make the same journey...

you recall the route exactly, turn by turn, until you end up lost again...

that's me...

john

Dave R

LOL. So that was you standing next to me with the bewildered look on your face that one day a couple of months back?

pbacot

Weeell I think LO should flip through scenes and take them up not per current settings but as they were saved. What if you have a scene that is a different style? I bet it flips it back to obeying saved scene styles thereafter. Once they've set it up properly, people shouldn't have to "make sure" every step of the way of what's supposed to be an integrated system.

Msketcher

@dave r said:

@msketcher said:

...you think you're just going crazy.

Are you sure you aren't?

Sorry. It was an easy opening.

I learned a long time ago with LO to make sure that my SU model shows no un-updated styles; that is, no styles which display the circular arrows over the thumbnail; before saving the file and going or returning to LO. if I make a change to a style setting, I click on the thumbnail to update the style or, I right click on the scene tab and choose Update from the context menu. If the style is different from the scene's definition, the warning box pops up asking what to do with the style. Some people do turn off that warning box and that seems to create all kinds of trouble for them.

Dave, you might be missing the point. I DON'T want the style to update. I'm just making a temporary change to a style setting to help me while modeling. I don't want those temporary changes to affect my scenes, and I wouldn't expect them to because I never followed through and clicked "Update Style." But SketchUp pushes those temporary overrides to all scenes that are using that style.

SketchUp shouldn't change a scenes' style unless the style has been actually updated by the user.

Dave R

I did miss that. What happens if you turn off Auto Render in LO?

Msketcher

@dave r said:

I did miss that. What happens if you turn off Auto Render in LO?

Auto Render in LayOut isn't really the right answer to the problem. If you simply switch to a different style in SketchUp, or "reload" the style you're on, the temporary style changes are forgotten and you're good to go.

It's just that if you make temporary changes to the style, and save your model as-is, you'll get into trouble. It's a good trap for people who don't know what's happening. Because once you open SketchUp again to check your model, your first instinct is to go click on the style to make sure the settings are correct, and sure enough, they will be. So it's confusing.