Forums' Future ?
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Hi all
This Forum is just golden.
A special place and a statement of just how valuable and sacred free discourse and the sharing of ideas are.
Friedrich von Hayek noted in the "Road to Serfdom"
"The more security you get the less freedom you will have".
Just keep Trimble out of this and let them do their own thing.
The foolishness of looking to them for a few pennies is obvious.
When the camel's nose is in the tent the camel is in the tent.
Well meaning intrusion will be the ultimate result.My heartfelt thanks and respect to all herein for all that is so freely given.
dtr Architect
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To all the above comments about the value of this forum.That being said, however, it's a little unrealistic to imagine that a multi-billion dollar outfit is going to leave the customer interface for what might well prove to be the common factor that links all the disperate parts of its portfolio together, in the hands of a bunch of outsiders...however well-intentioned they are...and however passionate about the software.
Under Google's stewardship it was a no-brainer; they didn't even try. Googleplex could have ported a great website that was as user-friendly as SU itself onto a Google server, but insisted that it be crammed into the faceless and utterly unappealing format of the Google Help system. That's why we are all here...in what is, in effect, a carbon copy of the old @Last forums...albeit a little more evolved since then.
I guess what I'm saying is that invaluable though this place is, I wouldn't find it at all surprising if business imperatives dictate that a SketchUp user forum is set up on the Trimble site...and what's more (if Trimble are serious about the community aspect of SU and genuinely wish to foster that) that very real efforts are made to make that a vibrant, resource-rich community too.
Even more than that; if SU users want to have any influence on Trimble's business strategy (which will necessarily affect SU itself) then they are going to have to make contributions over there as well. John and the rest of the team may well make timely, if not frequent, visits here, but I don't think Trimble as a whole would be under any obligation to take seriously any considerations regarding their software that aren't expressed in their own forum set up for precisely that purpose.This is a difficult balancing act. It's impossible to overstate the value of Sketchucation...all the brightest and best of the coders are signed up here, most if not all of the beta team is here...many of them making the greatest contributions. Even the SU team itself finds it a more valuable sounding-box than their own forums. Not bad for a site which, at the time of the Google acquisition, was little more than Coen's personal blog.
Nevertheless, it never pays to shy away from realistic scenarios. Only by contemplating them in advance are you in a position to best deal with them if and when they finally land on your doorstep.
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Current forum membership: 119,200. Topics: over 38,000. Comments: over 383,000. If it is going away, it will be like a glacier going away. But I will stay as long as I am able.
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IDK Alan. You and I may live in a rarefied world. Those companies that have useful forums are the software companies for rendering etc. Companies probably run by geeks/artists. MOST companies, I bet, have message boards because someone said they should and probably look at them more with apprehension than a way to get ideas.
EG Autodesk with SketchBook gives very nice Geek demos and blogs, but I can't make sense of their site. Sure you might find your way to some message board answers but it is NOT a holistic experience.
There's "message boards" and "forums". SUcation is an example of mixing people from many backgrounds for a fertile exchange of ideas. The way of learning is closer to the apprentice shop than you might find in many design offices today. A master or helpful Hannah is always working at a desk(top) nearby it seems.
The media is the message--the simple and transparent format is as key as the hands-on persona of the moderation to make this "place" work. The team here is irreplaceable. (Kudos--appreciation--regards ETC.) Peter
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Agreed, Peter; but I'm not saying that Sketchucation is going away...just that in all probability it might soon have a competing/complementary space over at Trimble. True, it could be something as basic as a message board or even FAQs, but as Trimble have admitted that they 'get it' regarding SU's fiercely committed army of fans...and as the SU team will presumably have a fair degree of input as to what finally materialises over there, it would be almost worse than nothing to host some bland, meaningless board.
It doesn't have to be an either/or. Many experienced users continued to give plenty of advice over on the Google forum while still doing a great job here. I must be bad at multi-tasking, 'cos i can only handle one forum at a time...at least in any really committed way. It took me several months to migrate over here after initially trying to make a go of it at Google.
Yes, the statistics are impressive, Tim...and I might be tempted to say that they contain all the people that really matter. However, you can't get away from the fact that very few of those 120,000 actually contribute very much. A staggering 1 post in every 15 is Csaba's...10x as many as me; and I'm reasonably prolific.
Yet even if all 120,000 were to contribute something...that still only represents a paltry 4% of the total user base; and I'm pretty sure that Trimble...one way or another...would at least like to pretend that it represented all of them. -
@alan fraser said:
A staggering 1 post in every 15 is Csaba's...
Yea - gotto do something about all that spam...
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He's a loud-typer, is he? Nearly as bad as loud-talkers. There are some at the office that sound like machineguns when they type on the keyboard.
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You're almost as bad Thom...well half as bad.
At least Pete and Eric are down in the 1:50 region. -
Can I put a value on Sketucation?? You bet.
I may not have a high volume of posts, but I do have a high volume of reading posts.
Virtually all the pluggins I have installed, or are pending installation, have emanated from my asking (or somebody else asking) here in SCF how to solve a problem, and 90% of the answers were to get a pluggin that has already solved that problem.
I would hazard to guess that SU would not be anywhere as useful to ANYBODY without this forum.
SU and SCF are integral in my opinion.
The RUBY API makes that possible. Second to SU itself, that has been Googles best idea yet. Funny how Goggle itself makes almost zero use of it.
The RUBY Wizards among us are the real SU developers, beyond the core SU app.
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I considered this place are mostly used by best SketchUp users.
A lot many may find they don't want to say much because when they want answers, they found it almost the time already.
At least I feel I don't know much, and feel I'm not good enough when look at those expert answers and resources
It's funny SketchUp have the same problem as many Open-source project contributions.
Those few user percents contributed most, the 'longtail' also applied here.
And there're a few chinese site that have very nice galleries, but it's quite pity that language is barrier.I think the new SketchUp site should aim to make the other 96 percents get involved in some way. And make life easier for the 4 percents that are here/ Not aim competing with this forum, because I think no one can
. Aiming to collected the scattered SketchUp infos from around the world and make it easy to see the big pictures and updates is nice, there're so many resources you have to dig into these day. SketchUp planet would be very nice There're many local websites, forum, facebook, twitter and blogs that need loves. Trimble should make them able to work together, it would be synergy on the world scale we should take advantage.
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He,he the time we talk about Trimble is worth every penny they paid. That's marketing! Who was Trimble before Sketchup?
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I suspect that Trimble paid a tidy sum for SketchUp. Google may have had no more use for it, but I'm sure they were well aware of its value in the broader market. That's why it's the only asset they have ever sold, rather than simply killing-off.
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@unknownuser said:
I would hazard to guess that SU would not be anywhere as useful to ANYBODY without this forum.
SU and SCF are integral in my opinion.
@unknownuser said:
The RUBY API makes that possible. Second to SU itself, that has been Googles best idea yet.
The RUBY Wizards among us are the real SU developers, beyond the core SU app.
I agree 100% on both points.
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@jgb said:
The RUBY API makes that possible. Second to SU itself, that has been Googles best idea yet.
The Ruby API was added in version 4 - before Google acquired SketchUp...
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I dont understand the licensing or legality side but SKETCHUP works as well as it does free or professional because of the great work you plugin artists do. Sketchup will continue to live and grow as long as a forum like this exists, a free version 8.xxx exists and great programmers continue to support it. Having said that, lets hope Trimble make it even better.
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Hi folks.
THat the official SU forum be here at SketchUcation or at the Trimble site do not worry me a bit.
I regularly visit SketchUcation and the SketchUp Help Group at Google and I was also visiting the Forum at Abvent's site for a while but it has so little activity that I have neglected it since more than a year or two.
IMHO the official site shall be, and I think it is logical, at Trimble, like now it is at Google.
This written, I also think that these companies, Google and Trimble offer so many softwares that they cannot focus enough on any one of them to offer an excellent forum with all the required functionnalites like adding files to post, fancy formatting, using icons, emoticons, etc.
On the other hand, SketchUcation only focus is SketchUp. We have proven that it works since we have many more members than the Google Help group. We have a very complete depository of plugins and also offer quite a lot more in the form of tutorial, mini publications, SketchUp Books, CatchUp, etc.
This is normal since a lot of contributors here do that for free since they have a passion while programmers at Google or Trimble have a job that is not necessarily passionate.
My idea is that if Trimble open a forum dedicated to SketchUp, I only hope it is not too boring and will offer the tools that we take from granted here and that were difficult to get at Google like, among a few, the capability to add files to our posts.
Then, I will frequent it as well as SketchUcation, just to keep contact with as many users and colleagues helpers and to help as many beginners as I can, like I do now.
Just ideas.
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@jean lemire said:
Hi folks.
My idea is that if Trimble open a forum dedicated to SketchUp, I only hope it is not too boring and will offer the tools that we take from granted here and that were difficult to get at Google like, among a few, the capability to add files to our posts.
Then, I will frequent it as well as SketchUcation, just to keep contact with as many users and colleagues helpers and to help as many beginners as I can, like I do now.
Just ideas.
From your lips to Trimble's ear. They should PROMOTE the software by (shamelessly) showing off all the best work performed on it gleaned from all the resources now available, including Sketchucation. Should also allow upload of files to forums to make them both useful and attractive to browsing users.
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What if Trimble said.......
SketchUcation would be THE Trimble forum for SU, rather than create an in-house rendition. And Trimble would assign one or two or more SU developers to dutifully monitor and respond to questions and suggestions from our membership, as would Tom or Gaius or any one of us would. I know John does, but far too infrequently.The advantage to Trimble is having a no-cost experienced enthusiastic support website already in operation. That would save Trimble $$$$$$$, staffing and time.
In return, Trimble could offer to support the cost of operating SCF, cheap compared to setting up a parallel in-house support team.
Oh, and a promise to maintain SU Free as well.
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^ LOL
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