Problem I can't really describe in subject line
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As the subject suggests, this is a problem that I can't describe in the subject title that would mean anything to anybody.
Picture this - you have a shape you've created, just one plane with some lines drawn on it
(the model I'm using as an example for this is NOT one that exhibited this problem, it's just something I made to illustrate what I'm talking about, so attaching it would do no good)
Then, for no particular reason (sometimes even just saving the model would cause it) the "holes" get filled in, and nothing you can do will let you select any of them to delete them again.
Sometimes you can draw some lines and be able to delete some sections of it, but nothing will let you select the areas you want to delete.
This is a greatly simplified example, the last one that this happened to me was much more complicated, many curves and whatnot, got so frustrated I just deleted the dang thing and started over. And it was absolutely fine until I saved it, then this crap happened.
Don't know if I'm explaining this very well, probably not, but it's something that has driven me (more) insane more times than I care to count.
Any suggestions? -
@s shepherd said:
Do you have the automatically fix my model box checked. I'm guessing you might.
I could be that there are small errors in your model and the autofix is causing this behavior
ShepYes, I do have it checked. But, if it is doing this, why wouldn't I get the message about "Don't panic, some problems were detected in your model....." (or something like that) that I always get when it's doing it's thing?
Oh wait, no, I do not have that one checked, only the "Automatically check model for problems"
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Most of the times an intersection of the face and the lines will separate them again. (Make sure that the scale of the model isn't too small)
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When this sort of problem happens to me I use "generate faces" from context menu (I have a shortcut for it), selecting all lines and that makes every face deleteable again. The thing is you have to do that and you shouldn't. I can't believe the pissed I'd to have to redo that to my faces everytime I'd load a model.
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@cotty said:
Most of the times an intersection of the face and the lines will separate them again. (Make sure that the scale of the model isn't too small)
Yes, I know that sometimes that will work, but I'm talking about the times when nothing works. When you intersect shapes frequently the face intersected cannot be selected but most of the time just drawing along one of the lines fixes that. But there was no intersecting in the situation I'm talking about. Nothing but drawing lines and curves on a planar face, and up to a point you can select faces just fine, but then suddenly none of the faces can be selected. And this last time it was working just fine, I had already erased the faces I needed to erase, but when I saved it all of the erased faces came back and could not be selected no matter what I tried (both on the model still open and the saved model).
And yes, I always make my models extra large to maximize their workability.
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@jql said:
When this sort of problem happens to me I use "generate faces" from context menu (I have a shortcut for it), selecting all lines and that makes every face deleteable again. The thing is you have to do that and you shouldn't. I can't believe the pissed I'd to have to redo that to my faces everytime I'd load a model.
Must be a plugin (or extension, whatever) I can't find it anywhere within SU 2015. Are you referring to one of these two plugins (although they don't say "generate" faces, only "create" or "make" faces.
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I've used TIGs Add Faces plugin for this.
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@hellnbak said:
@jql said:
When this sort of problem happens to me I use "generate faces" from context menu (I have a shortcut for it), selecting all lines and that makes every face deleteable again. The thing is you have to do that and you shouldn't. I can't believe the pissed I'd to have to redo that to my faces everytime I'd load a model.
Must be a plugin (or extension, whatever) I can't find it anywhere within SU 2015.
"Generate faces" is an item added in the context menu by Fredo's "Tools on surface" plugin.
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@massimo said:
"Generate faces" is an item added in the context menu by Fredo's "Tools on surface" plugin.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I can't seem to find "Generate Faces" anywhere in Fredo's "Tools On Surface" menu
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@massimo said:
@hellnbak said:
@jql said:
When this sort of problem happens to me I use "generate faces" from context menu (I have a shortcut for it), selecting all lines and that makes every face deleteable again. The thing is you have to do that and you shouldn't. I can't believe the pissed I'd to have to redo that to my faces everytime I'd load a model.
Must be a plugin (or extension, whatever) I can't find it anywhere within SU 2015.
"Generate faces" is an item added in the context menu by Fredo's "Tools on surface" plugin.
Sorry I was meaning to say that but forgot. Thanks Massimo
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It's not on the tool menu. You have to select some edges on the model and right click on it.
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@jql said:
It's not on the tool menu. You have to select some edges on the model and right click on it.
Oh. Unless there's still more information that I need to use this feature correctly, but don't have, this will not be of use to me. If I have to click on each edge, I'll just use weld, but the last model that had this problem had a huge number of edges that would need to be selected. Simpler to just start over.
Thanks for the suggestions. Just another SU quirk to add to my ever-growing list
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I can reproduce what you are getting but scaling a square by 100, moving one corner up on the blue by 1mm then scaling down again. This means the face is not coplaner by only 100th of a mm so SU puts the face back but it is out by enough for the edges not to intersect the face correctly.
So my guess is it is tiny inaccuracies in your model, you do such precise work and nudge vertices around a lot, so perhaps in this case you are working at too large a scale. -
Do you have the automatically fix my model box checked. I'm guessing you might.
It could be that there are small errors in your model and the autofix is causing this behavior
Shep
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@box said:
I can reproduce what you are getting but scaling a square by 100, moving one corner up on the blue by 1mm then scaling down again. This means the face is not coplaner by only 100th of a mm so SU puts the face back but it is out by enough for the edges not to intersect the face correctly.
So my guess is it is tiny inaccuracies in your model, you do such precise work and nudge vertices around a lot, so perhaps in this case you are working at too large a scale.I think I understand what you are saying, but not sure it would apply to my modeling techniques. Yes, I do use a large scale with my models, but I don't scale them back down again as you seem to be suggesting. They are large to begin with and they stay that way. And sure I know that if I move a corner up by even the tiniest bit it will no longer be coplaner, but, again, that is not something I would do.
In the case of this last instance, everything was fine, I had deleted all the areas I wanted to, no problems. But as soon as I clicked on Save the deleted areas became undeleted and unselectable. On both the open model and the one I had saved. There was no going back, it was done and nothing could undo it.
I think when this happens again I had better just walk away from it for a while, a long while, and when I've run out of new cusswords and my blood pressure has dropped to a reasonable level I'll come back and work on another model for a while. And hopefully that one will progress the way it should, without something weird and inexplicable happening to it.
Yeah, I know Sketchup is free and all that, and problems are going to occur with any program. I just want them to be problems that I can solve. Not have to grit my teeth and somehow live with.
Things were so much simpler before technology took over the world.
I have thought long and hard about the possibility of just getting rid of my computers, making a clean break of it. And I could live with that, except for one thing - information. I am so used to finding any sort of information I want almost instantly, I just don't think I could go back to actually using a library and phone books and all those archaic stone-age sources of information I used before the dang internet.
Oh well. I'm gonna take a nap.
I long for the 60's, they were fun.
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Is there any possibility there is hidden geometry floating about that is creating havoc.
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@box said:
Is there any possibility there is hidden geometry floating about that is creating havoc.
No, I'm certain that was not the case.
The next time it happens I will post the model here. Until then life goes on.
I truly appreciate your efforts
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Hmmm, it does seem like there is an issue with a simple surface intersect.
This is flat and average size and it still forms strange cuts and overlapping faces.
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@box said:
Hmmm, it does seem like there is an issue with a simple surface intersect.
This is flat and average size and it still forms strange cuts and overlapping faces.I can reproduce your example ...
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@box said:
Hmmm, it does seem like there is an issue with a simple surface intersect.
This is flat and average size and it still forms strange cuts and overlapping faces.I tried reproducing your model and it did all the weird things yours did except it kept deleting the center diamond face. The big difference between this and the problems I have had is that this one (at least for me) is easily correctable by drawing over some of the lines. Was that your experience?
How did you come upon this, just tried different things until you hit upon this one? What (if anything) does it tell you about what is happening, and why?
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