Hi Rich Thank you very much for your advice to try Curiloft - Fredo is a genius. I have tried to find a text user manual for Curviloft without avail as I am learning to use the plugin from various video samle tutorials which are two fast for me. Do you know if a pdf manual exists even if it for earlier versions of the plugin. Also is it possuble to enlarge the tool bar - I have my tool bar setting on Large Toolbar but I could do with it being larger. Many thanks for your prompt resonse to my initial topic & I am sure I will get a great deal of help & information from SketchuCation. Regards Old Swinger