[REQ/Q?] Flattening and exporting scenes as skp files.

srx

It would be very useful. However, the real thing would be to integrate this in Layout, so not to loose hotlink between the model and 2D. When model (or scene) changes, "refresh" command in Layout would flatten it again. What was drawn in Layout would stay on different layer. Just thinking loud.

juju

IIRC there already exists a plugin that can flatten to 2D (I don't think it does textures as well), not sure if t is one of D. Bur's gems...

JQL

@srx said:

It would be very useful. However, the real thing would be to integrate this in Layout, so not to loose hotlink between the model and 2D. When model (or scene) changes, "refresh" command in Layout would flatten it again. What was drawn in Layout would stay on different layer. Just thinking loud.

If you'd export the scene from sketchup to a folder you could always reexport it from sketchup.

Probably you could choose to export 1 scene, a selection of scenes or all scenes.

If you'd like to edit the exported skp files, probably your best option would be:

Export Scene to Skp file (I'll call this file 2D.skp);
Import 2D.skp into a new Sketchup file.
2D.skp now is a component inside this new file and you can reload it at any moment.
You can make editions in the new file (I'll call it 2Deditable.skp) without affecting 2D.skp;
Make your editions in 2deditable.skp WITHOUT touching the xrefed 2D.skp component;
You can even lock the imported 2D.skp component inside 2Deditable.skp;
Instead of inserting 2D.skp in Layout, you can insert 2Deditable.skp in Layout instead;
Now if you update 3D model, you can re export 2D.skp, and you can reload it inside 2Deditable.skp and finally reload it inside Layout.

Of course, if you don't intend on using Sketchup to draft, and you only need to do that in Layout, all this process isn't needed at all.

You still retain the VERY useful benefits of:

Working in Layout much faster!!!;
Having a lot easier workflow inside Layout if you want to do something similar to draft or just plain linework.

JQL

@juju said:

IIRC there already exists a plugin that can flatten to 2D (I don't think it does textures as well), not sure if t is one of D. Bur's gems...

I'm going to check on that. Thanks!

JQL

I haven't found anything that would flatten scenes and export them.

The closest thing is export to dxf, but that would require importing to skp as dxf, and then import the skp to layout and that adds a new step where workflow and probably a lot of info is lost.

juju

I saw this on the Extension Warehouse a few minutes ago.

http://extensions.sketchup.com/en/content/skema-2d-projection

Also take a look at these:
Projections, Didier Bur: http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=167471#p167471
Flatten to Plane, TIG: http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=281320#p281320
Projection Builder, monkeybanjo: http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=460115#p460115

TIG

My Flatten-to-Plane http://sketchucation.com/pluginstore?pln=FlattenToPlane used in combination with my WorkPlane http://sketchucation.com/pluginstore?pln=WorkPlane allows you to project selected objects onto a work-plane.
However, intervening faces are ignored, so all selected edges get projected.
You either need to select them intelligently first or do some manual editing...

JQL

Thanks Tig,

I've seen your plugin, but there's a lot of setting up to do.

What you suggest would be possible though as there is a select only visible edges plugin, but I'd have to explode all my groups and components and that would defeat the initial purpose wich is speeding up the whole workflow.

It would be faster to work on Layout but a lot slower to work on sketchup. Let's see what happens in the near future though

pbacot

How is this scheme a different result than exploding the model port in LayOut?

Because you want to "draft" 2d in SketchUp? It would have been easier if LayOut were more like SketchUp (which everyone wanted).

JQL

Well pbacot, that's the real question here: why?

Exploding the model in layout breaks the connection between sketchup and layout.

Exporting scenes from sketchup to an outer file will not:

You can work on a 3D model;
Export your scenes as 2D;
Insert your scenes in Layout or into another Sketchup File (See Note 1);
Work in Layout VERY fast as the models are 2D, and with better LAYOUT inferences as the model is 2D;
Or work with the other Sketchup file and draft in Sketchup (See Note 2);
Then you can insert this sketchup file in Layout as before and work VERY fast as it's 2D and, with better Layout inferencing as it is 2D;
And you can go back at the original model and work with it;
And you can export the model scenes again, overwriting the previous ones;
And you can simply reload them in the 2D drafting Sketchup file or in Layout (Or in the 2D drafting Sketchup and then in Layout.)

Note 1: Inserting into another sketchup file, makes a Sketchup model referenced. Sketchup get's a link with that file and if it get's replaced or edited, it can be reloaded at any time. The same thing happens with Layout, of course.

Note 2: It's only useful to insert in Sketchup if you want to design 2D stuff into those scenes without changing them. As a new export will overwrite them you'd loose your changes to them. Inserting them in sketchup allows for references in note 1 and you can be using sketchup as a sort of a drafting tool instead of Layout, as it's hard to draw with Layout and it's a breeze to draw with sketchup.

NOTE3: Of course Sketchup could benefit from true line styles for drafting.

NOTE4: Of course Layout could be faster and have better drafting tools.

NOTE5: Of course if Layout would flatten 3D models instead of rendering them as true 3D, it would be much faster and this wouldn't be needed.

NOTE6: But note 3 to 5 aren't there now, nor in the foreseeable future... Unfortunatelly, so this is another area where plugin developers can make our life easier by circumventing frustrating issues.

pbacot

You could ovewrite just the same. I'd keep the original "live" SketchUp ports in place. This way you avoid all the positioning and scaling (unless you've worked that out in process.

Unless you can automate a lot of this, there are so many steps. Every little update can cause time and room for errors. I find enough of that just in the regulars SU-LO flow.

BTW my SU-LO flow almost always ends up with a pdf in PowerCADD and I do my secondary drafting in there. So I've added some steps myself to avoid working in LayOut. What I'd want is PowerCADD to reference LayOut files directly.

JQL

@pbacot said:

You could ovewrite just the same. I'd keep the original "live" SketchUp ports in place. This way you avoid all the positioning and scaling (unless you've worked that out in process.

I'm not sure of what you're saying here, but I think you're talking about the idea of inserting the 2D exported files into a new file and the probability of editing them in the new file.

If that's the case, then I can see almost no flaws in the process. It's the same process I use for Xrefing Sketchup components:

I have a model;
I export components from that model into a folder.
I never work directly on the components on that folder.
I import those components (all of them) into a new Sketchup file;
I work on that sketchup file without modifying inserted components (I lock them if I must);
I reload those components as I need to;
I insert this new file in Layout and reload it as I need to.

The main flaw is that you can't edit the components directly or you'll loose your editions with reloading. It really doesn't matter to me, as There's a zillion ways of doing all kinds of drafting without ever touching those components.

Another flaw I see is that it's kind of stupid to setup all scenes in sketchup and then don't use them directly in Layout. That's true, but the problem is that Layout takes so much time loading those, that we really can't work with it if we have to be constantly reloading heavy stuff.

I'm having a hard time and I have a Titan X GPU and an Overclocked 5820K processor. There are better than these, but these are certainly better than the majority of laptops used to work with LO.

@unknownuser said:

Unless you can automate a lot of this, there are so many steps. Every little update can cause time and room for errors. I find enough of that just in the regulars SU-LO flow.

That is true, definetelly, but it's something that I setup one time only.

It's just the same with Layout. The hardest time I have is setting up my sheets and viewports. Then it's a matter of working with sketchup and reloading.

It sounds simple enough, but the reloading part is incredible. It just takes ages on complex projects! I literally get distracted while waiting and often start doing something else.

Usually that happens and I find something I must fix and so it starts all over again.

With my suggestion the process of seting up has an extra level of complexity, but I'm counting on less reloading times between all apps and a lot more speed on the drafting workflow.

@unknownuser said:

BTW my SU-LO flow almost always ends up with a pdf in PowerCADD and I do my secondary drafting in there. So I've added some steps myself to avoid working in LayOut. What I'd want is PowerCADD to reference LayOut files directly.

That's what I'm trying to avoid. I do a lot of drafting in sketchup right now. It's much faster to do it here than anywhere else and I can use materials and styles to create striking and clear presentations. Even if I lack linestyles... wich, to put simply, we should have!)

If I wanted to use CAD, I'd probably be using Skalp to do this in dxf. But I hate CAD. I can't work with it anymore!

What I wanted was someway to use Layout and Sketchup to definetelly don't miss CAD anymore.

My Layout could have a set of 2D scenes mixed with 3D scenes that came directly from model and nothing would beat it! Now I want to beat in it most of the times!

pbacot

Yeah. but I always liked PowerCADD. Only thing it is really just a 2d graphic program with CAD precision and a lot of tools.

I think you have more to deal with in terms of LayOut (like SU) being unable to handle large projects. My projects are smaller, the ways I use LO limited, and with 2016 LO, it's almost fast enough for what I do to be bearable.

JQL

I wish I'd like CAD!

I love SU though!

glro

i probably don't understand everything that is written here, and this probably too simple for you, but what about:

setting the camera in the sky downwards for each scene
making a screenshot of each scene

this would give you pictures you could import in sketchup or layout (i am not sure for Layout), and you could draw on them

JQL

The issue is a bit more complicated than that.

Architects using sketchup need an easy workflow to convert their 3d models into accurate drawings, to represent buildings and to share with consultants.

The workflow involves 3d modelling of the most important parts, 2d drawing that is extracted from 3d,and 2d drawings that complement those and are still accurate

usually the later are done in cad, but I do them in layout or sketchup.

I want to streamline that workflow as sketchup is great at 2d drawing too if complemented with layout for text, lifestyles dimensipning and pagination.

the issues that arise from working with layout, are also less evident when you work with 2d sketchup models/drawings.

glro

@jql said:

The issue is a bit more complicated than that.

Architects using sketchup need an easy workflow to convert their 3d models into accurate drawings, to represent buildings and to share with consultants.

The workflow involves 3d modelling of the most important parts, 2d drawing that is extracted from 3d,and 2d drawings that complement those and are still accurate

usually the later are done in cad, but I do them in layout or sketchup.

I want to streamline that workflow as sketchup is great at 2d drawing too if complemented with layout for text, lifestyles dimensipning and pagination.

the issues that arise from working with layout, are also less evident when you work with 2d sketchup models/drawings.

I tried something: here is a scaffolding model

i made a component out of it,selected it, and applied these lines of code

model = Sketchup.active_model # Open model
entities = model.entities # All entities in model
selection = model.selection # Current selection

for e in selection
echelle = Geom;;Transformation.scaling [0,0,0],1,1,0.00001
e.transform!(echelle)
end

and this is what i get
flat

is it something like this you are asking for?

JQL

Apparently it is. I'm not in my pc though... Would that work with a section?

jiminy-billy-bob

That scales the model on the Z axis to something close to 0 (actually 0.00001). So make sure to run in a few times to be sure that any vertical dimension gets smaller than Sketchup's tolerance.

JQL

If that scales to close to 0 it means it will have all the geometry between 0 and 0.00001 right?

It will still be 3D not 2D, it looks exactly like what I want it even get's textures.

But isn't that, exactly the same 3D model with the same amount of information? Won't it probably give Layout the same amount of work on 3D calculations?

Also as it isn't 2D it will be hard to export to CAD in a later stage when sharing with people that need dwg or dxf. Or it might give us errors when drawing in the 2D sketchup file.

Also, as Jiminy pointed out, it's working in Z axis only, though that would probably be easy to make it work in any axis (I'm personally interested in a section plane's normal direction.).

It's a shame though, as it is really looking exactly as the ideal 2D output would look.

Thanks for your input glro and Jiminy!