Is this guy serious?!
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Have tried to stay objective......but.....
"During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!"
You are an idiot! you really are! plain and simple!
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Hey Steve, cool you jets there cheif!! You read that first sentence of the post that says "this is part of an email that made it to my inbox"? All I know for sure about the Japanese is that after the start of it all my grandfather ended up in POW camp for many many months.
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This information is pretty much accurate. However, it is misleading. The UK doesn't have guns and they only had 1.2 murders per 100,000. Australia doesn't have guns and they had 1.0, China probably doesn't have guns and they had 1.0, Canada had 1.6 and Monaco had 0. Monaco probably doesn't have a 100,000 people? None of these countries are on the list, at least I didn't see them. At any rate, the list was designed to be misleading.
From the World Health Organization:
The latest Murder Statistics for the world:
Murders per 100,000 citizens
Honduras 91.6El Salvador 69.2
Cote d'lvoire 56.9
Jamaica 52.2
enezuela 45.1
Belize 41.4
US Virgin Islands 39.2
Guatemala 38.5
Saint Kits and Nevis 38.2
Zambia 38.0
Uganda 36.3
Malawi 36.0
Lesotho 35.2
Trinidad and Tobago 35.2
Colombia 33.4
South Africa 31.8
Congo 30.8
Central African Republic 29.3
Bahamas 27.4
Puerto Rico 26.2
Saint Lucia 25.2
Dominican Republic 25.0
Tanzania 24.5
Sudan 24.2
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 22.9
Ethiopia 22.5
Guinea 22.5
Dominica 22.1
Burundi 21.7
Democratic Republic of the Congo 21.7
Panama 21.6
Brazil 21.0
Equatorial Guinea 20.7
Guinea-Bissau 20.2
Kenya 20.1
Kyrgyzstan 20.1
Cameroon 19.7
Montserrat 19.7
Greenland 19.2
Angola 19.0
Guyana 18.6
Burkina Faso 18.0
Eritrea 17.8
Namibia 17.2
Rwanda 17.1
Mexico 16.9
Chad 15.8
Ghana 15.7
Ecuador 15.2
North Korea 15.2
Benin 15.1
Sierra Leone 14.9
Mauritania 14.7
Botswana 14.5
Zimbabwe 14.3
Gabon 13.8
Nicaragua 13.6
French Guiana 13.3
Papua New Guinea 13.0
Swaziland 12.9
Bermuda 12.3
Comoros 12.2
Nigeria 12.2
Cape Verde 11.6
Grenada 11.5
Paraguay 11.5
Barbados 11.3
Togo 10.9
Gambia 10.8
Peru 10.8
Myanmar 10.2
Russia 10.2
Liberia 10.1
Costa Rica 10.0
Nauru 9.8
Bolivia 8.9
Mozambique 8.8
Kazakhstan 8.8
Senegal 8.7
Turks and Caicos Islands 8.7
Mongolia 8.7
British Virgin Islands 8.6
Cayman Islands 8.4
Seychelles 8.3
Madagascar 8.1
Indonesia 8.1
Mali 8.0
Pakistan 7.8
Moldova 7.5
Kiribati 7.3
Guadeloupe 7.0
Haiti 6.9
Timor-Leste 6.9
Anguilla 6.8
Antigua and Barbuda 6.8
Lithuania 6.6
Uruguay 5.9
Philippines 5.4
Ukraine 5.2
Estonia 5.2
Cuba 5.0
Belarus 4.9
Thailand 4.8
Suriname 4.6
Laos 4.6
Georgia 4.3
Martinique 4.2
And
United States 4.2
NOTE: ALL of the countries above America have 100% gun bans
or are close to it. -
Please show source.
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Were those stats gun deaths, machete, knives? What is the context of those stats. Most of those countries do not have functional Governments.
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I think this is where that list came from.
http://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/crime/Homicide_statistics2012.xls
Hey guys I just want to say I am not trolling or trying to get folks who do not like others point of view, or thoughts, in a uproar.
Just trying to say/show there are two sides to everything, and throwing some info I thought would be pertinent to the subject.
And that gun control done by banning anything is not the way I feel gun control should be handled.
And since Solo may ask, how I think it should be handled. I do not know.
I will shut up, forget about this thread if everyone just thinks I am some kind of crazy, and just trying to get people in an uproar. -
Steve, it does not matter if it was a gun or knife. Supposedly all those countries have 100% gun bans or darn close to it.
Just shows if the info is any good that banning/gun control for the most part does not do much good.
No matter how functional or nonfunctional the government.
Once again I am not saying anything is fact or truth. Just something I thought was interesting info when I seen it. -
@solo said:
Are you saying that you need guns to defend yourself from your own government? if yes then why do you always vote for politicians that want to increase military spending?
pete, i'm thinking you've been in this country long enough to realize we are given two 'choices' for presidents... and they both always have surprisingly similar agendas.. (i guess it's not that surprising when you consider they're being funded by the same people.. i.e.-JP.Morgan gives lots of money to both candidates etc)..
but they all increase military spending.. regardless of what's said/implied during campaigning.. (remember, obama was going to stop the wars going on.. make some real changes... not!)
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@ccbiggs said:
Steve, it does not matter if it was a gun or knife. Supposedly all those countries have 100% gun bans or darn close to it.
Just shows if the info is any good that banning/gun control for the most part does not do much good.
No matter how functional or nonfunctional the government.
Once again I am not saying anything is fact or truth. Just something I thought was interesting info when I seen it.It does matter if it is a gun or a knife! If the school massacre had been done with a knife wielding murderer the deaths would have been much less, and more manageable by the staff, but it was carried out with an assault weapon ......What do you not get about that
Really exactly do you not get about that
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@ccbiggs said:
Hey guys I just want to say I am not trolling or trying to get folks who do not like others point of view, or thoughts, in a uproar.
nah.. it's cool. I (for one) don't see you as trolling.. and i hope you don't stop posting for fear of being attacked by people that disagree with you..
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@steved said:
@ccbiggs said:
Steve, it does not matter if it was a gun or knife. Supposedly all those countries have 100% gun bans or darn close to it.
Just shows if the info is any good that banning/gun control for the most part does not do much good.
No matter how functional or nonfunctional the government.
Once again I am not saying anything is fact or truth. Just something I thought was interesting info when I seen it.It does matter if it is a gun or a knife! If the school massacre had been done with a knife wielding murderer the deaths would have been much less, and more manageable by the staff, but it was carried out with an assault weapon ......What do you not get about that
Really exactly do you not get about that'Bump' gotcha Jeff
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@ccbiggs said:
This information is pretty much accurate. However, it is misleading. The UK doesn't have guns and they only had 1.2 murders per 100,000. Australia doesn't have guns and they had 1.0, China probably doesn't have guns and they had 1.0, Canada had 1.6 and Monaco had 0. Monaco probably doesn't have a 100,000 people? None of these countries are on the list, at least I didn't see them. At any rate, the list was designed to be misleading.
From the World Health Organization:
The latest Murder Statistics for the world:
Murders per 100,000 citizens
Honduras 91.6El Salvador 69.2
Cote d'lvoire 56.9
Jamaica 52.2
enezuela 45.1
Belize 41.4
US Virgin Islands 39.2
Guatemala 38.5
Saint Kits and Nevis 38.2
Zambia 38.0
Uganda 36.3
Malawi 36.0
Lesotho 35.2
Trinidad and Tobago 35.2
Colombia 33.4
South Africa 31.8
Congo 30.8
Central African Republic 29.3
Bahamas 27.4
Puerto Rico 26.2
Saint Lucia 25.2
Dominican Republic 25.0
Tanzania 24.5
Sudan 24.2
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 22.9
Ethiopia 22.5
Guinea 22.5
Dominica 22.1
Burundi 21.7
Democratic Republic of the Congo 21.7
Panama 21.6
Brazil 21.0
Equatorial Guinea 20.7
Guinea-Bissau 20.2
Kenya 20.1
Kyrgyzstan 20.1
Cameroon 19.7
Montserrat 19.7
Greenland 19.2
Angola 19.0
Guyana 18.6
Burkina Faso 18.0
Eritrea 17.8
Namibia 17.2
Rwanda 17.1
Mexico 16.9
Chad 15.8
Ghana 15.7
Ecuador 15.2
North Korea 15.2
Benin 15.1
Sierra Leone 14.9
Mauritania 14.7
Botswana 14.5
Zimbabwe 14.3
Gabon 13.8
Nicaragua 13.6
French Guiana 13.3
Papua New Guinea 13.0
Swaziland 12.9
Bermuda 12.3
Comoros 12.2
Nigeria 12.2
Cape Verde 11.6
Grenada 11.5
Paraguay 11.5
Barbados 11.3
Togo 10.9
Gambia 10.8
Peru 10.8
Myanmar 10.2
Russia 10.2
Liberia 10.1
Costa Rica 10.0
Nauru 9.8
Bolivia 8.9
Mozambique 8.8
Kazakhstan 8.8
Senegal 8.7
Turks and Caicos Islands 8.7
Mongolia 8.7
British Virgin Islands 8.6
Cayman Islands 8.4
Seychelles 8.3
Madagascar 8.1
Indonesia 8.1
Mali 8.0
Pakistan 7.8
Moldova 7.5
Kiribati 7.3
Guadeloupe 7.0
Haiti 6.9
Timor-Leste 6.9
Anguilla 6.8
Antigua and Barbuda 6.8
Lithuania 6.6
Uruguay 5.9
Philippines 5.4
Ukraine 5.2
Estonia 5.2
Cuba 5.0
Belarus 4.9
Thailand 4.8
Suriname 4.6
Laos 4.6
Georgia 4.3
Martinique 4.2
And
United States 4.2
NOTE: ALL of the countries above America have 100% gun bans
or are close to it.Most of those countries above are very poor, as far as developed nations go you cant really compare the US to Haiti Sudan and Congo! And most of those countries do not have gun bans - not even close. Half of them probably dont even have a functioning government at least five are dictatorships. Last year I went to Estonia and a few guys in my group went on a tour organised by the hotel to shoot shotguns, pistols, AK47 (automatic).
http://www.topguntours.co.uk/shooting-tallinn..html
This is the blurb:"Shoot 9 police type guns including some specially kitted out with all the latest tactical gizmos like laser sights, built in flashlights, and high capacity magazines. You will get to shoot the American M16, the Russian AK47, the Glock police pistol, a genuine "Dirty Harry" .44 Magnum, and the awesomely powerful Pump-action shotgun. Highly recommended!"
I understand the notion for rifles (low caliber with small box magazine or bolt action) for recreation and hunting but fully automatic and semi automatic military style rifles need to go. There is no logical excuse to own one in any sense.
Getting guns off the streets in the US would be very difficult but the first logical step is to start banning high powered weapons. Then massive investment would be needed to have some sort of collection enforcement, probably also have to reimburse owners etc the list goes on.
I dont know how the problem could be solved easily but I know its stupid to keep going the way it is. This isn't aimed at you btw biggs just in general.
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Steve, do you not read? Or do just have trouble retaining what you do?
When speaking in context to that list which is what we/I was discussing. There is no difference between a gun or a knife. When guns are banned in these countries and a list shows that homicide's are not zero, then my take on it is the gun ban/control did nothing. Except make it safer for the criminals to be criminals.
When or where do you see that I said a single thing about the school.
If you want to follow up on what I post, read what I posted.
And do not put words in my mouth!
There is nothing "I do not get about" what could have been. And the difference between that psycho having a rifle or knife that day in that school. Yes it more than likely would have been better for most everyone in the school that day if he only had a knife.
But on the other hand he could have had nothing but the clothes on his back, stole a bus and drove the damn thing straight through the place and done even more damage. -
@ccbiggs said:
Steve, do you not read? Or do just have trouble retaining what you do?
When speaking in context to that list which is what we/I was discussing. There is no difference between a gun or a knife. When guns are banned in these countries and a list shows that homicide's are not zero, then my take on it is the gun ban/control did nothing. Except make it safer for the criminals to be criminals.
When or where do you see that I said a single thing about the school.
If you want to follow up on what I post, read what I posted.
And do not put words in my mouth!
There is nothing "I do not get about" what could have been. And the difference between that psycho having a rifle or knife that day in that school. Yes it more than likely would have been better for most everyone in the school that day if he only had a knife.
But on the other hand he could have had nothing but the clothes on his back, stole a bus and drove the damn thing straight through the place and done even more damage.Well this whole thread was created as a response to the school massacre or did i miss something?
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What words did I put in your mouth?
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Ok maybe not putting words in my mouth. But apparently you think you are cute though, using what I posted, taking it totally out of context and attaching it to something else. You was talking about that list, I was talking about that list. Then the next post from you"I do not get something about the school"
Just to bust my chops or to try and get a rise out of me.
Play dumb if you like.
But I am done with it for awhile.
Like I said I was just trying to get people to look at the big picture of "gun control/banning"
But I suppose there is no point trying to get you or others who live where they have already taken your gun rights, to look at anything any different.
Have a good day fellas.
Talk at you all later. -
@unknownuser said:
gun rights
This discussion is really hard to understand from an outside perspective.
How can citizens have a right for a tool to kill? (I would have expected the opposite, people would need to gain a license for guns, like a driver license and proof their skills and responsibility.)
How can you compare politically unstable (and some anarchic) countries with your own? The US is not a banana republic! In Europe we have been living well for a long time with a very low amount of weapons (I don't know anyone who has one). I don't miss anything (that's what makes this all hard to comprehend).
Whether there is official gun control, gun confiscation, legally "encouraged" gun disposal or voluntary gun disposal... wouldn't matter if people hadn't bought the guns in the first place. If it works voluntary, that's nice!
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ccbiggs/cory, let me show you how your post reads, I'll chop a section out of the middle just to make it shorter.
@ccbiggs said:
Just part of an email that ended up in my inbox.
EMAIL
**A LITTLE GUN HISTORYIn 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
.
.
.
.
.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
------------------------------**
Your Conclusion%(#4040FF)[Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!]
I'm aware now that this isn't what you meant, but that is how it comes across at first reading, so you might be able to see how it could lead to some strong reactions and some confusion over the next posts.
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@box said:
ccbiggs/cory, let me show you how your post reads, I'll chop a section out of the middle just to make it shorter.
@ccbiggs said:
Just part of an email that ended up in my inbox.
EMAIL
**A LITTLE GUN HISTORYIn 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
.
.
.
.
.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
------------------------------**
Your Conclusion%(#4040FF)[Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!]
I'm aware now that this isn't what you meant, but that is how it comes across at first reading, so you might be able to see how it could lead to some strong reactions and some confusion over the next posts.
I think he was just quoting an email not actually writing that himself - just to clarify.
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