A true dynamic connection between Sketchup and Layout

Edson · 19 Apr 2013, 13:28

so far most of us have been producing construction documents with Layout by way of creating 2D linework in Sketchup and moving it to Layout (it does not really matter if it gets there through copy/pasting or through scenes).

as we have seen in the videos done by nick sonder and in many docs posted here this method allows for the creation of great-looking documentation.

however, its weak point is that there is no true dynamic relationship between the model and the 2D docs: if one changes the model the 2D in Layout does not change automatically. one has to go back to Sketchup and change the linework or even produce a new section cut to include the changes.

now someone has come up with a way that seems to provide that longed for dynamic relation. his name is Michael Brightman and he is the author of a just released book called "The SketchUp Workflow for Architecture: Modeling Buildings, Visualizing Design, and Creating Construction Documents with SketchUp Pro and LayOut". I was a reviewer when his book was been evaluated for publication and it impressed me a lot when I read the book summary.

in short, what he does is the creation of 3 scenes: one for the walls, one for the openings, furniture, fixtures and the like and a third one for the hatches/fills, the appearance of all of them being controlled by styles.

there are six videos related to the book. the ones that deal with the topic discussed here ate numbers 3, 4 and 5. the exact way in which the walls get hatched/fill is not totally clear in the videos. for that I think one must get the book.

Dave R · 19 Apr 2013, 15:35

Edson, I watched videos 3 and 4. I've been using his trick of getting multiple line weights via separate SU scenes for some time but I'm intrigued by his use of a watermark to create the hatching. I'd love to know more about that.

Edson · 19 Apr 2013, 17:10

@dave r said:

Edson, I watched videos 3 and 4. I've been using his trick of getting multiple line weights via separate SU scenes for some time but I'm intrigued by his use of a watermark to create the hatching. I'd love to know more about that.

dave,

could you explain how you do it?

Dave R · 19 Apr 2013, 17:25

I do something similar to what he does. I create different scenes in SketchUp from the same camera position but with different layers on and off. Then I set up overlapping viewports in LayOut for those scenes and change the weight setting. One thing I do differently is I put the viewports on different layers so I can more easily access one or the other if I need to without moving one of them. I made a forum post awhile back showing that method. I tried to locate it but didn't find it in a quick scan through the list.

Another thing I have done in some cases is extend this process a little to create dashed and/or colored lines. I'll set up a scene in SketchUp showing only the edges I want to change, set up that scene as a viewport over the other viewport and then explode it in LO so I can modify the lines using the Shape Style inspector. This works quite well and saves a lot of time drawing dashed lines in LO but you want to be certain you won't need to change the lines because exploding the viewport breaks the link back to the SketchUp scene.

ArCAD-UK · 19 Apr 2013, 22:19

Thanks for posting Edson, always happy to learn but I'm not sure some of the video #3 methods are that efficient. Surely creating a layer to hide lines is a bit unnecessary when you can hide and control their visibility without creating a layer.

One method I used to highlight areas of work is to create a "ghost" scene showing the whole model floor plan which can be set to a very fine pen in LO and then create scenes showing just the relevant features e.g. walls, doors etc which can then be overlaid on the first scene on a higher layer in LO and set to a heavier pen.

The watermark hatching made me curious but on balance I think it is less effective than just assigning a jpeg hatch and even less so if you have multiple materials to hatch. It is also always tied to exposed back faces and flat to screen e.g. it doesn't rotate with the model.

Edson · 19 Apr 2013, 22:33

I have not tried his system myself. what attracts me to it is the possibilility of updating plans and sections without too much redrawing.

Dave R · 19 Apr 2013, 22:36

Yes. that's a good thing. I do little drawing in LO--mostly a few dashed lines that I can move around or replace pretty quickly if needed. By setting up scenes in SU for all my views, I don't need to do much in LO other than add annotation and dimensions.

Richard · 22 Apr 2013, 02:13

Not having watched the videos I'm flying a little blind BUT it seems at present we are still talking about "workarounds"!

When I read the post heading I though wow this is cool! For me a true dynamic connection between SU and LO goes both ways - ie: we can drag components from the scrapbook and then export of Layout file as SKP and have a 3D model from our 2D layout!

My thinking is this link SU > LO > SU > LO is still someway off!

BTW not pooh poohing this great workaround!!!

Krisidious · 22 Apr 2013, 02:39

I have to agree that true dynamic connection does not exist. When revisions come time I'm hating life. Having copy and pasted vector lines on top of updating graphics is a pain.

Box · 22 Apr 2013, 08:33

@dave r said:

I made a forum post awhile back showing that method. I tried to locate it but didn't find it in a quick scan through the list.

I'm pretty sure you mean this one http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=79&t=51852#p468602

ArCAD-UK · 22 Apr 2013, 09:48

I'm not so sure that this is a "workaround" it seems more like a question of defining a common work flow that is generally accepted by the SU community.

One of the main reasons we end up with line work is because SU isn't a true solid modeller and the need to add or hide back faces whilst adding detail. TIG's "section cut face" plug is a solution to the hiding aspect but it is also something that should be automatic to the section tool rather than leaving us with the "create group from slice" which lacks faces and more stupidly is left hidden by the section cut!

The other aspect is vector hatching for faces for me it should be added to SU for others LO so maybe the SU Team should make it available in both.

swasacase · 25 Apr 2013, 02:01

What works for me is to apply a "hatch" material to the insides of the walls. Sort of a striped poche. Any changes to my walls, my hatch fill will update.

13-4-24 Sample.pdf

sonder · 25 Apr 2013, 02:37

@krisidious said:

I have to agree that true dynamic connection does not exist. When revisions come time I'm hating life. Having copy and pasted vector lines on top of updating graphics is a pain.

Save the line work in scenes. It is much, much faster. I stopped using the copy paste method for anything that can change. For site work items like property lines and setbacks I still use this method, but for everything else it is a saved scene in SU.

Krisidious · 25 Apr 2013, 09:08

@unknownuser said:

Save the line work in scenes. It is much, much faster. I stopped using the copy paste method for anything that can change. For site work items like property lines and setbacks I still use this method, but for everything else it is a saved scene in SU.

You saved what as a scene? the section cut as in the special section of the current geometry on another layer and scene? or just the section view as a scene? I guess what I'm saying is are you recutting section vectors when doing modifications? I'm using "section cutface" to make the vectors that I dimension and hatch.

Edson · 25 Apr 2013, 11:55

@krisidious said:

@unknownuser said:

Save the line work in scenes. It is much, much faster. I stopped using the copy paste method for anything that can change. For site work items like property lines and setbacks I still use this method, but for everything else it is a saved scene in SU.

You saved what as a scene? the section cut as in the special section of the current geometry on another layer and scene? or just the section view as a scene? I guess what I'm saying is are you recutting section vectors when doing modifications? I'm using "section cutface" to make the vectors that I dimension and hatch.

I think nick means one must save a scene showing just the linework. in this way you can assign it to a layer in LO and place it above the one that shows the cut view of the building.

Edson · 25 Apr 2013, 11:57

@swasacase said:

What works for me is to apply a "hatch" material to the insides of the walls. Sort of a striped poche. Any changes to my walls, my hatch fill will update.

I have tried this long ago. it works but not always: if your walls have a surface below them you can never be sure the hatch will show. for this workflow to work one must make sure there is nothing touching the walls.

jolran · 29 Apr 2013, 08:48

I have not watched the tutorials mentioned here, but there is another valid solution perhaps?

http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=323&t=38637&p=341462#p341462

Create hatched lines in Sketchup and hide outlined edges.