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  • N Offline
    njh
    last edited by 13 Nov 2012, 22:04

    Hi folks

    The plan shown by Sonder looks fantastic! I've tried to attach the one I'm talking about.

    I'm just picking up Sketchup and Layout again after a lengthy absence and I'm hoping to adopt it as my full time design package rather than Vectorworks so I have a query about the electrical layout, fans etc on the drawing- are they part of the sketchup model or drawn "on top" of the view in layout?

    Apologies if this is explained in the thread somewhere and I've not noticed it.

    Neil

    Screen grab.pdf

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    • A Offline
      ArCAD-UK
      last edited by 13 Nov 2012, 22:29

      I take the line SU is for the 3D modelling bit and LO is for the 2D graphics and notes. Have you looked at the scrapbook facility? That is where you would start to save time if you have an office standard.

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      • P Offline
        pbacot
        last edited by 13 Nov 2012, 22:58

        @njh said:

        Hi folks

        The plan shown by Sonder looks fantastic! I've tried to attach the one I'm talking about.

        I'm just picking up Sketchup and Layout again after a lengthy absence and I'm hoping to adopt it as my full time design package rather than Vectorworks so I have a query about the electrical layout, fans etc on the drawing- are they part of the sketchup model or drawn "on top" of the view in layout?

        Apologies if this is explained in the thread somewhere and I've not noticed it.

        Neil

        [attachment=0:358rspb4]<!-- ia0 -->Screen grab.pdf<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:358rspb4]

        Curious to know why switch from VectorWorks (VW OR SU might be my options if my CAD expired--development ended).

        The electrical layout by Sonder is done in LO. http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=15911&start=255#p392706

        MacOSX MojaveSketchUp Pro v19 Twilight v2 Thea v3 PowerCADD

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        • N Offline
          njh
          last edited by 14 Nov 2012, 15:50

          Thanks for the link to the part if the post which explained about the lighting layout!

          Curious to know why switch from VectorWorks (VW OR SU might be my options if my CAD expired--development ended).

          Quick answer is I hope it will be possible to increase speed and accuracy. At the moment I draw everything in 2D in Vectorworks (I'm running architect 2013) so I draw the plans, sections, elevations etc individually. This takes time and leaves me open to errors when updating a plan and not the corresponding section / elevation (or vice-versa). Vectorworks is great but I feel like I could work a bit smarter.

          I know that I can model in full 3D in Vectorworks but the learning curve seems pretty steep and I understand from a couple of people who use Vectorworks and Sketchup that they find Sketchup and Layout the fastest way to draw. I'm pretty competent with Sketchup - if perhaps a bit rusty - and I'm beginning to feel my way around Layout.

          I'm a sole practitioner and work mainly on domestic alterations and extensions (few new-builds here and there too) but I'm beginning to get involved in larger schemes (complete internal and external re-fit of a largely square 2000m2 office block) so I'm thinking Sketchup and Layout COULD offer me some speed and accuracy improvements for the type of work I do.

          I VERY rarely need to share drawings with consultants etc so it seems worth a try?

          Neil

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          • D Offline
            dale
            last edited by 14 Nov 2012, 16:21

            njh
            I have been using Vectorworks since its very first MiniCad version, but stopped upgrading a VW 12.5 because it is so much easier to draw in SketchUp.
            Unlike you though, I was doing full 3D in VW, and although I don't remember the learning curve, it was probably because I started so early with the software (or I'm old and my mind is failing)
            Like you though, I am ready to make the jump to Layout, since I already do all my preliminary work in SketchUp, it seems a logical step. I currently still export dxf's back to Vectorworks for the final working drawings compiling.
            There are a lot of things that I see as failings with Layout, but I was at baseCamp, and I can assure you that The folks at SketchUp are really listening when it comes to Layout.
            It seems at the moment though you have to learn the workarounds, (many discussed in this thread), and accept the shortcomings, to get the job done.
            There were a lot of folks at the Layout session, who seemed to want Layout to be nothing more than another Cad program. I think this would be a mistake, as Layout offers so much more in terms of presentation potential.
            In my discussions, and my question at the session, was essentially asking if it would be possible for the Layout API to be offered to developers, much like the SketchUp API which has spawned so much Ruby brilliance.
            In my opinion, this would allow the SketchUp Layout folks to concentrate on the larger picture, while I am sure that we would see ruby developers taking care of the requests for line weights, and arrow types and other details.
            I really can't say if this is being seriously considered or not, but I am hopeful.

            Just monkeying around....like Monsanto

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            • N Offline
              njh
              last edited by 14 Nov 2012, 17:44

              Hi Dale

              Thanks for the comments and hopeful speculation about the future of the product. I'm hoping too that Trimble will pick up the ball and run with it to make it an even more useful combined drawing and presentation package.

              Like you, I started off with MiniCAD but went to AutoCAD (job change forced it) before returning to Vectorworks at 2010 but in 2D only. Beginning to learn 3D in VW2013 seems a bridge too far...

              Neil

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              • A Offline
                ArCAD-UK
                last edited by 14 Nov 2012, 18:43

                Hi Neil I've got an Archicad licence. Great piece of software if you do repeat style projects and don't want to do anything that isn't in the box. I'm migrating to SU as I think it is much more focussed as a design tool. Ok it needs development of the many well discussed shortfalls but fingers crossed we should see some great progress soon.

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                • R Offline
                  rtbuild47
                  last edited by 4 Dec 2012, 17:07

                  I use LO all the time for Building Regulation and construction drawings and my only
                  gripe is that to define materials have to use colors or shades, when hatching would be so much more professional.

                  artybuild

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                  • A Offline
                    arcsurvey
                    last edited by 7 Jan 2013, 12:16

                    This is my first attempt at a construction drawing for a simple UK lean to extension. I am quite pleased with it but it took a long time to achieve though with practice maybe I can get the time cut down. I find that I get bogged down with the outliner and it takes time to manage my groups. I need to make more use of layers maybe.

                    I tried to create a hatch pattern rather than using colours to identify the brick and blockwork but it crashed each time I applied it. Not sure why that was.

                    I cannot decide whether to just model the exteriors in SKP to give the 3D and go back to CAD for the 2D plans or whether to stick with it and try to increase productivity.


                    First attempt at a section using skp and layout only

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                    • porch_unpluggedP Offline
                      porch_unplugged
                      last edited by 7 Jan 2013, 16:57

                      @arcsurvey said:

                      This is my first attempt at a construction drawing for a simple UK lean to extension. I am quite pleased with it but it took a long time to achieve though with practice maybe I can get the time cut down. I find that I get bogged down with the outliner and it takes time to manage my groups. I need to make more use of layers maybe.

                      I tried to create a hatch pattern rather than using colours to identify the brick and blockwork but it crashed each time I applied it. Not sure why that was.

                      I cannot decide whether to just model the exteriors in SKP to give the 3D and go back to CAD for the 2D plans or whether to stick with it and try to increase productivity.

                      I'm finding that you do cut the time taken down a lot as you progress. You'll find quicker ways of doing things.

                      I'd try and stick with the sketchup for the plans as well. I find that clients really respond to the textures etc. of a sketchup drawing, rather than the cold crap look of CAD.

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                      • Mike LuceyM Offline
                        Mike Lucey
                        last edited by 7 Jan 2013, 19:48

                        @arcsurvey said:

                        This is my first attempt at a construction drawing for a simple UK lean to extension. I am quite pleased with it but it took a long time to achieve though with practice maybe I can get the time cut down. I find that I get bogged down with the outliner and it takes time to manage my groups. I need to make more use of layers maybe.

                        I tried to create a hatch pattern rather than using colours to identify the brick and blockwork but it crashed each time I applied it. Not sure why that was.

                        I cannot decide whether to just model the exteriors in SKP to give the 3D and go back to CAD for the 2D plans or whether to stick with it and try to increase productivity.

                        Richard, you might check out Rich's YourTube tut, here, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rZ9-o0vTAs&hd=1

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                        • A Offline
                          arcsurvey
                          last edited by 9 Jan 2013, 10:41

                          Thank you both for your reply and the hatch plugin looks useful.

                          I have been creating a section cut slice from the competed model and then adding the detail such as cavity walls, tiles, etc. Is this generally considered the best way to do it?

                          I have found that creating 2D symbols from CAD blocks works well for doing the floor plan in 2D from the 3D section cut without adding a lot of weight to the model.

                          I have started my next project and it is going quicker already - I guess it will keep improving.

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                          • Mike LuceyM Offline
                            Mike Lucey
                            last edited by 9 Jan 2013, 12:46

                            Keep us posted on progress.

                            Support us so we can support you! Upgrade to Premium Membership!

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                            • S Offline
                              sonder
                              last edited by 9 Jan 2013, 19:35

                              @rtbuild47 said:

                              I use LO all the time for Building Regulation and construction drawings and my only
                              gripe is that to define materials have to use colors or shades, when hatching would be so much more professional.

                              artybuild

                              Hmm, I think the opposite. Hatching was developed to identify and define perameters of materials or scope, while SU and layout do this in a method to me that is more clear and direct. I would rather see CMU that looks like CMU rather than a cross hatch pattern that is referenced in a schedule telling you it is CMU.

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                              • bmikeB Offline
                                bmike
                                last edited by 9 Jan 2013, 21:04

                                @unknownuser said:

                                @rtbuild47 said:

                                I use LO all the time for Building Regulation and construction drawings and my only
                                gripe is that to define materials have to use colors or shades, when hatching would be so much more professional.

                                artybuild

                                Hmm, I think the opposite. Hatching was developed to identify and define perameters of materials or scope, while SU and layout do this in a method to me that is more clear and direct. I would rather see CMU that looks like CMU rather than a cross hatch pattern that is referenced in a schedule telling you it is CMU.

                                I also suspect that hatching was a product of the times - plotters and printers that handled lines, and PCs that did the same.

                                mike beganyi design + consulting llc

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                                • S Offline
                                  sonder
                                  last edited by 9 Jan 2013, 23:59

                                  @bmike said:

                                  @unknownuser said:

                                  @rtbuild47 said:

                                  I use LO all the time for Building Regulation and construction drawings and my only
                                  gripe is that to define materials have to use colors or shades, when hatching would be so much more professional.

                                  artybuild

                                  Hmm, I think the opposite. Hatching was developed to identify and define perameters of materials or scope, while SU and layout do this in a method to me that is more clear and direct. I would rather see CMU that looks like CMU rather than a cross hatch pattern that is referenced in a schedule telling you it is CMU.

                                  I also suspect that hatching was a product of the times - plotters and printers that handled lines, and PCs that did the same.

                                  Actually those plotters and printers were the hand and pencil days. Ouch I'm getting old. I graduated architectural school in 1987, so hand drawing was still the main course, with ACAD just really starting to move in the industry.

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                                  • bmikeB Offline
                                    bmike
                                    last edited by 10 Jan 2013, 02:37

                                    @unknownuser said:

                                    @bmike said:

                                    @unknownuser said:

                                    @rtbuild47 said:

                                    I use LO all the time for Building Regulation and construction drawings and my only
                                    gripe is that to define materials have to use colors or shades, when hatching would be so much more professional.

                                    artybuild

                                    Hmm, I think the opposite. Hatching was developed to identify and define perameters of materials or scope, while SU and layout do this in a method to me that is more clear and direct. I would rather see CMU that looks like CMU rather than a cross hatch pattern that is referenced in a schedule telling you it is CMU.

                                    I also suspect that hatching was a product of the times - plotters and printers that handled lines, and PCs that did the same.

                                    Actually those plotters and printers were the hand and pencil days. Ouch I'm getting old. I graduated architectural school in 1987, so hand drawing was still the main course, with ACAD just really starting to move in the industry.

                                    for sure. i was on the transition period when i dropped out. school was leaning towards a paperless studio for the 3rd year grads, but the first 2 years did a mix of traditional modeling, drawing, 3d, and bullshitting, i mean, critiquing. my prof in school was aghast that i wanted to learn autocad. guess he didn't have to work to put himself through school...

                                    prior to grad school i came from an art school with a renaissance style traditional foundation program - so lots of life drawing - both human figure (i was marginal at it) and from observation - still life, landscape, architecture, etc.
                                    lots of emphasis in design and painting coursework on sketching. i still have alot of my sketchbooks. flip through them every now and again...

                                    mike beganyi design + consulting llc

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                                    • S Offline
                                      sonder
                                      last edited by 10 Jan 2013, 03:17

                                      Mike, where did you go to school. Sounds a lot like my school - RISD.

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                                      • bmikeB Offline
                                        bmike
                                        last edited by 10 Jan 2013, 03:37

                                        @unknownuser said:

                                        Mike, where did you go to school. Sounds a lot like my school - RISD.

                                        Cleveland Institute of Art, BFA Sculpture, but I spent time in ID, Graphics, and lots of time working for carpenters and woodworkers.

                                        Then to Columbia for Grad school in Architecture. Burned out after a year. Too much $$$$ for living in the city and going to school, and lots of folks who didn't seem to care about the art of actually building...

                                        Had a good friend go to RISD for furniture. This would have been in mid 90s. Spent some time there hanging out, fun town. Will be there in 2 weeks visiting and engineer I work with and doing some warranty research on a project I designed a few years ago.

                                        Also know a prof down at RISD via some artists I worked for as an assistant in NYC and a by way of a project that I worked on in Jamestown.

                                        Small world.

                                        mike beganyi design + consulting llc

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                                        • P Offline
                                          pbacot
                                          last edited by 10 Jan 2013, 04:06

                                          @unknownuser said:

                                          @rtbuild47 said:

                                          I use LO all the time for Building Regulation and construction drawings and my only
                                          gripe is that to define materials have to use colors or shades, when hatching would be so much more professional.

                                          artybuild

                                          Hmm, I think the opposite. Hatching was developed to identify and define perameters of materials or scope, while SU and layout do this in a method to me that is more clear and direct. I would rather see CMU that looks like CMU rather than a cross hatch pattern that is referenced in a schedule telling you it is CMU.

                                          Yeah, but in office work there is such a thing as standardization and efficiency. Hatches developed over time to have the consistent look and are easily identified (basic ones like wood, conc., earth anyway). And, of course it's something when done by hand you need the interns to learn, so it has to be easily defined and copied. It doesn't take an artist.

                                          Nowadays we don't really want the "make-work"-let the computer do it. So eventually someone who has developed some nice detail textures will lead the way forward and set the standard. 😠

                                          MacOSX MojaveSketchUp Pro v19 Twilight v2 Thea v3 PowerCADD

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