What will SketchUp Free and Pro look like in 2013?
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Hi All,
I've been discussing what might, should, possibly happen to SketchUp free in 2013 when the next version release of SketchUp Pro comes out.
When Google purchased @Last / SketchUp (there was no free or Pro then
) some years ago and introduced the 'Google' SketchUp free version, there where a lot of existing @Last SketchUp users that where a bit taken aback as they felt that their investment had in some way been belittled, for the want of a better word. We often see topics here on SketchUcation where users are experiencing 'snobbery' by client that a free application is being used for professional work which they may well be paying good fees for.Google, it appears, wanted SketchUp to be used to populate Google Earth and in turn generate advertising revenue, fair play, they paid their money and called the shots! The main shot being the launch of SketchUp free which was nearly the full blown SketchUp Pro with the exception of import / export, Layout and a few other minor enough items.
Further development of SketchUp also IMO appeared to be directed at enhancing its use for Google Earth expansion. Again fair play, its was their baby ad they could do with it as they pleased.
It appears to me that a time came when Google realized SketchUp was not delivering population of Google Earth quick enough and there were quicker and more accurate ways to achieve this objective. It looks that when this 'penny dropped', SketchUp was sold to Trimble. Part of the deal appears that a free SketchUp version must remain in place. I can see why Google required this ..... what is their motto .... 'Do no evil' or something to this effect. I think it might have been more a case of not being accused of leaving free users 'high and dry'
We are now at the point where Trimble SketchUp is to launch a new version(s) on SketchUp Pr at least in 2013. This time-line was announced at 3D Base Camp. It was also advised that a free SketchUp version will remain available however no further details were given, for example, if the free version would be the Pro version minus imports / export option and Layout etc.
Trimble IMO is a 'bottom line' company when it comes to its products. The products have to make money to keep the show on the road, pay staff and investors. Google was somewhat different as SketchUp appeared to be used as a vehicle to leverage advertising revenue.
I am now wondering if the current situation can continue. Its quite possible for professionals to use the free version of SketchUp with some work-arounds to achieve much of what SketchUp Pro is capable of producing. The question I am asking myself (and you) is how is SketchUp to advance and further develop if Pro sales are not being achieved to high levels. Companies can't exist on fresh air alone!
The main reason I am bouncing this topic is because I feel Trimble SketchUp may well have to widen the gap between SketchUp Free and Pro and maybe even strip out SketchUp Free to some extent in order to bring in the professional users to the Pro version.
If this was done, what would be considered essential to remain in the free version so that it would remain to be a viable tool for semi-professionals and hobbyists etc. Also what new features would professionals users wish to see being added to the Pro version and if they would be prepared to pay more than the $100 upgrade figure.
Maybe if we discuss this topic at this point in time there won't be too many shocks in 2013 as what may happen might seem logical for the further development of SketchUp Pro.
Mike
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I think its naive to believe that stripping out features from the free version will convince free users pay up, especially if the price will be increased from ~$500. I'm all for a bigger and better Sketchup, and am willing to pay the upgrade (I want the SU team to eat too!), but how will taking away features that are already there benefit anybody?
I used SU free for about a year until I needed Layout, when I happily purchased. I am grateful for the (nearly) full use of the program and may never have learned and eventually purchased it if not for the opportunity. If the program is going to be crippled by taking features away, new users may just migrate to other free alternatives (of which there are many!)
So IMO: add features, increase price some if necessary, but don't take anything away from the free version.
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Well, my thoughts about it :
I think that Trimble bought SketchUp to give its customers a new and brilliant interface for their products .
In that sense thus , the development costs of SketchUp itself does not relay in the SketchUp_Pro version only but in all the other products altogether .
So , rising the price of the updating that we have been used to , would be very surprising to me unless it really shows a great improvement .
What it will be like ? No idea .
About the free version I guess they will keep it as it is now . -
Hi Marcus. I agree that stripping out features from SU Free probably would not make sense as the current version is in place. But if Trimble SketchUp were to be non operable on older OS systems this might then be a possibility.
Many I have talked to feel the Google move in launching the free version was both good and bad for SketchUp. It brought it to a very wide audience but at the same time reduced development revenue.
Still, we have what we have and I would not be surprised if the gap between free and Pro did in fact widen quite a bit making free not a proposition for professional users.
I think we may have to realise that its the Pro version that must currently subsidize the free version and all that its continuation entails. This might have been acceptable to Google but I doubt this is the case with Trimble!
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I'd hope they are able to add enough power and features to make the Pro version that much more desirable, without hurting the free version. Otherwise we'd have to wonder if there will ever be progress to the program as a whole. I'd hope both versions could be made reasonably stable.
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@mike lucey said:
...But if Trimble SketchUp were to be non operable on older OS systems this might then be a possibility....
Ah yes, this makes sense.
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Scary thought that is if they take away features we already have in the free version, if it weren't for google making a free version the sketchup community wouldn't be so big as it is today, in fairness why fork out hundreds for a 3D modelling software when you have the free version of sketchup, taking away features from the free version would be a bad move in my opinion, Trimble cant benefit from it and make free users pay more, they must realise that there are other free 3D modelling software's out there like blender and what not, and there are cheaper Pro 3D modelling software's for example silo is i think just over $100, To be honest if features are taken away in the free version sketchup will become a part of the past for me and ill pick up something else, free or cheaper, and i believe im not the only person who will walk, Trimble need to realise this and take into account that the community of plugin developers are who really made sketchup what it is today, in all honestly a risk assessment by Trimble would have to be put in place and im sure it already has and they would of had to ponder on these same questions too, taking away from the free version would be a case of bad management in my opinion, and the community increase of sketchup users would stop growing.
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I'm watching the Basecamp videos (which were just posted on Youtube!!
) and Bryn says there may be different versions of Sketchup available.I think that's great! For example, there could be a totally free version, a Pro hobbyist version for ~$100, and a Pro architectural version for $500...or some similar scheme.
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One mode of advancement would be to do nothing to the free version and put all of the advancements into the pro version with specialty modules (rather than whole versions) that can be purchased separately.
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I'd imagine that Trimble's priority would be to integrate SketchUp with their existing construction/GIS/Mapping products and this, possibly is the direction their 'Pro' version will take. I can see great potential for SketchUP with 3D scanning and Digital Terrain Modeling but this would require the software being able to cope with very large datasets and such an overhaul may be a bit ambitious for 2013, so probably no big changes in their first year. Imagine bringing a raw survey file from a Total Station or Scanner into SketchUP and getting a 3D SketchUp model of a building or interior out the other end! I’m sure Trimble’s own software for their hardware products claims to give a similar solution but is restricted to those who have invested heavily in Trimble equipment already. SketchUp could give others (architects, designers, Joe Blogs) the potential to use various Trimble data formats to produce final drawings/models. At present their customer base is Engineering/ Surveying companies but I’d bet they’d like to extend that to include architects, designers and even Joe Blogs.
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@bob james said:
One mode of advancement would be to do nothing to the free version and put all of the advancements into the pro version with specialty modules (rather than whole versions) that can be purchased separately.
This is what I expect to see -- wasting time on any free version new features is pointless -- as far as I'm concerned any and all new features should only be available via a paid license.
That said, if they don't make the new features substantially compelling enough they may lose both the established Pro users and the free users as well.
I have lost my faith in the SketchUp development process -- it's been so long since they've done anything substantial that I feel like they may have to relearn how to be a dynamic developing team... maybe even new leadership is needed to get back on a track to a "Pro" product.
Best,
Jason. -
@bob james said:
One mode of advancement would be to do nothing to the free version and put all of the advancements into the pro version with specialty modules (rather than whole versions) that can be purchased separately.
Do nothing? I hope not. Sketchup has to more powerful, faster, and more stable.
I don't think it'll be cost effective to develop a version with a weak, crippled core, alongside an improved version. The features wouldn't have to be changed much on the free version, but I can't see SU Pro being worthwhile if it is just more gizmos added to SU 8.
(OK sure, somer renderers have a free low res version--perhaps SU free would be hobbled to handle fewer polygons somehow.)
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@unknownuser said:
perhaps SU free would be hobbled to handle fewer polygons somehow.
I think I remember they confirmed they would keep one core, and maintaining several cores would be wasting resources of the small team.
I agree that removing the free version would be unfeasible for Trimble – they would hurt SketchUp's reputation more than they'd earn. Having a wide free user base (of 30 million, I don't know how many of them are Pro users) is maybe crucial for SketchUp, especially as the costs of ~500$ are intended for Pro users, such a price is not attractive for hobbiests who can't finance the license from SketchUp work.
There are professional 2d graphic softwares with far more features than SketchUp and only in the price range of 100$ (ok, SketchUp is 3d and it's inference engine is more worth than 1000 features). It might indeed be a solution to offer a reduced price and get more licensees. -
@jason_maranto said:
I have lost my faith in the SketchUp development process...
That's unfortunate but I do believe the development team is working on the right track. I think Google created a bit of a mess but I believe the SketchUp team itself is going down the right path now.
I do recall Bryn saying there would probably be more than one "pro" version of SketchUp. I got the impression they would use these versions to target different disciplines. That could be a good move for them to make packages or as someone described it, different modules. I would also expect we'll see more development on the LayOut side and I'm looking for some big improvements.
Price increase? Sure, why not? It's the same price now as it was when I bought V3 from @Last. If you consider inflation and the improvements that have been made it's actually a better value now than it was then. And while $500 isn't anything to sneeze at, compared to a lot of other options out there, it's cheap.
As to the free version of SketchUp, it is perfectly reasonable to expect a wider gulf between the two. I see the point about turning off potential buyers of the pro version if the free version doesn't get developed along with it but Even if the free version didn't change from the current free version, what would it hurt? It wouldn't be going backward.
I remember reading a comment on a woodworking forum from someone who said he had just downloaded the free version just before the sale to Trimble was announced. He had decided not to learn to use it until he found out what Trimble was going to do with it. In my mind that's like saying you're not going to use the bandsaw you bought last week because the manufacturer was sold to another company. That doesn't change the tool you just bought any.
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Some good insight here, thanks.
Jason you say you have lost faith in the SketchUp development process. I can understand that as I imagine the 'soft and comfy' 6 or so years at Google must have taken their tole on the team. I still however feel that much of the original @Last ethos still resides in the core development team. I think its just a case of them digging deep and finding it again.
SketchUp v1 broke the mould! I still remember the say I stumbled across it and then took to it like a 'duck to water'. I would hope that SketchUp 2013 would again break a mould.
I must say that I was somewhat disappointed with 3DBC 2012. I thought an opportunity was lost to give the SketchUp community a glimpse of what might be in store for us. Even if the 'road map' was not fully laid out, I think we could have been shown some 'dreams'!
This was done at at earlier 3DBC, the second I think. At that 3DBC we were show lots of possible new features, some we got and more we didn't. If I remember correctly it was John Bacas that made that particular presentation.
2013 is only 19 days away but again there are 365 days in 2013
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There are only one thing I really want right now, 64 bit support or a way to handle more poly's, I'm sure Trimble also wants this as their business is based on topography, something SU does not do too well due to it's limitations.
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If the actual free version can works in the future, that will be yet a very good thing!
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As far as you did not sale your Minitel, you can run the V6.
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Hi free world!
excuse me in advance, here is to come a long post for my bad English.I wonder if the issue is properly raised.
As I see it, I think the real question is: Is SketchUP can be a real professional software.SketchUP is brilliant, full of talent, but it is constrained by its architecture at least on two unavoidable points.
First, SketchUp is unable to handle very large volumes of data. Yet it is the norm in today's industrial world.
Secondly, in today's world every creation comes through with curves. SketchUp can't do other than curves composed with straight lines. That generates unacceptable errors when carrying out the plans.
Would that for these two reasons, SketchUp can not hope to claim a truly professional status and have its place in the big league.
To overcome this handicap I fear SketchUP achitecture have to be completely rethinked and thus the entire code completely rewrited.On the other hand, the main (and only) significant SketchUP advances have always come from the volunteer developers in the invention and development of new tools. What would SketchUp Pro look like today without them? Let there be no mistake, this is because of the use of tools developped by free developpers of the free side that the paid version is capable of displaying a wingspan of Pro.
Widen the gap between the versions! Does it not mean "stealing code" to free developers to integrate their tools in the pro version?
Is "widen the gap" is not going to push the developers to leave the scene? Indeed, why give for free when Trimble turns it into cash?I do not know what will happen in SketchUp. But I think that before the idea of driving people to pay, Trimble team should roll up their sleeves and work for free, and show us what they are capable of such feats they earn our respect. Then we can actually revisit.
simonlebon
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@simon le bon said:
But I think that before the idea of driving people to pay, Trimble team should roll up their sleeves and work for free, and show us what they are capable of such feats they earn our respect. Then we can actually revisit.
simonlebon
So Simon, I wonder if you would be willing to do your job without pay. You ask that of the SketchUp team. You must be willing to do the same.
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