Trimble is having SketchUp pay its way!
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Not sure about the two way street bit unless I am mis-interpretting the workflow. I have always worked on a premeasured site survey and designed the building to fit. If the survey is accurate the building should fit and I shouldn't need a secondary varification, the builder can just "get on with it!".
I like the AR idea but my client's don't have pockets that deep.
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.... if you watched the demo video you probably would agree the the 'Trimble Field Link for Structures' system is being used for setting-out work. I imagine this process will be expanded over time.
Of course I realise that these days the site surveys are highly accurate but they normally take boundaries at face value during survey that sometimes should not to be relied on as when construction starts, 3rd parties can often intervene and set the true (legal) boundary situation straight. I have come across such situations. Having a system like the TFL in play would be a valuable tool for quick and efficient remedial action.
As regards the "fait accompli" comment, this was my read / take on the current situation. I really think the current work-flow, Surveyor - Designer - Quantity Surveyor - Builder, results in the builder being delivered construction documents that are not open to much 'flexibility' due to the complexity of current day stringent Building Regulations.
An small error / oversight in the early stages of the project can be exacerbated by the time a set of Con Docs get down the chain to the builder and if the builder is on a tight work schedule, as often he is, these errors may again get overlooked totally at worst or cause communication delays at best. Having systems in place that help to immediately identify and remedy these errors can be no bad thing.
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Just watched the demo video, it's a marker in their deployment of SU but not a game changer. I think we have a long way to go before we see SU BIM released.
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I can see this tablet being very useful in any number of ways....but curious as to cost $.
As a residential builder I could (one man) field layout/ck:
Better board placement & elevations.....& dbl ck prior to conc. pour.
Do same for walks/drives/landscape plantings etc........really just place/verify any points of importance from SU/CAD.Can't seem to find a $ on the net.......probably means $10k+ US.
Charlie
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@unknownuser said:
As an building professional I welcome this work-flow
I don't necessarily. This may apply a little in Civil work, but I think responsibilities would be confused leading to more arguments or legal battles.
Also why is this guy talking about "fait accompli"? Since when (I mean besides FLW)? The construction documents describe the intent of the design. The contractor is the one who ultimately figures out how to make it work. So you make the documents (models) even more exacting and somehow that helps?
My experience in smaller projects is that it is really more collaborative and flexible.
Some architects would put on the drawings: "Do not scale these plans. Written dimensions govern..." etc. This would be a case of saying "Please scale these plans exactly to the site, with laser accuracy." (This should provide more work for modelers, hopefully paid for by the client.)
Edit: A direct field to SU connection IS exciting though.
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I see this as purely wonderful. The interface between the architect and the land surveyor just got much easier for me. This will be a wonderul tool as well early in design to test home positioning to view in the field (pretty big aspect of home design along with solar orientation where I am).
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@pbacot said:
@unknownuser said:
Some architects would put on the drawings: "Do not scale these plans. Written dimensions govern..." etc. This would be a case of saying "Please scale these plans exactly to the site, with laser accuracy." (This should provide more work for modelers, hopefully paid for by the client.)
Edit: A direct field to SU connection IS exciting though.
I've found it more difficult to model not to scale. I've removed that note from all my plans and actually now tell contractors the opposite - "go ahead and scale them"
I think this could result in even more collaboration as having a field model during foundation set and framing would really help speed up the understanding of the build.
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@unknownuser said:
Can't seem to find a $ on the net.......probably means $10k+ US.
Almost. On SDG's site it's available for 3695 $
It looks like it can survive everything.
But it comes without fish...
[flash=300,225:359x3fu0]http://www.youtube.com/v/nQ9ll__0yVg[/flash:359x3fu0] -
Wow! All they really need now is a slick plugin that makes it easier to model the structure onto the surveyed land... maybe there is someone working on something like that...
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@unknownuser said:
Wow! All they really need now is a slick plugin that makes it easier to model the structure onto the surveyed land... maybe there is someone working on something like that...
And who better to do that, Aaron...?
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@unknownuser said:
I've found it more difficult to model not to scale. I've removed that note from all my plans and actually now tell contractors the opposite - "go ahead and scale them"
I think this could result in even more collaboration as having a field model during foundation set and framing would really help speed up the understanding of the build.
..... and when we think about it, surely paper plans (blueprints) will shortly be a thing of the past on building / fabrication sites now that pads / slates are becoming so common.
I think the current system of 2D plan production for site building / work is on its last legs. Cloud computing coupled with Pads / Slates is the way thing will go I imagine and I have a feeling that SketchUp could 'play' as a full-forward in this game as it would be friendly to all in the process.
On this subject! Its strongly rumored that the iPad will soon have a little brother with a 7.85-inch screen. I would like to see a big brother iPad with a screen size roughly equivalent to A4. This size with retina display should be capable of displaying the most complicated of Con Doc on a site. And I am sure many builders would adopt this tech rather that trying to open A1 sheets on wet and windy sites!
This kind of tech could also virtually eliminate the requirement for the designers / tech supervisors to pay site visits. Imagine this set up, a big bother iPad with built in cameras in the hands of the builder as he goes around the project talking / discussion the ins and outs with the designers back in the office with all kinds of data at their fingertips (really with their feet up drinking coffee) which would allow for nearly instant informative and accurate decision making that could only result in better projects being built.
When you think about it, all the tech is current in place for such a system! Maybe this is the way Trimble SketchUp should be going with their rumored BIM!
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@unknownuser said:
Wow! All they really need now is a slick plugin that makes it easier to model the structure onto the surveyed land... maybe there is someone working on something like that...
slick plugin = landscape architect and/or civil engineer
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@mike lucey said:
On this subject! Its strongly rumored that the iPad will soon have a little brother with a 7.85-inch screen. I would like to see a big brother iPad with a screen size roughly equivalent to A4. This size with retina display should be capable of displaying the most complicated of Con Doc on a site. And I am sure many builders would adopt this tech rather that trying to open A1 sheets on wet and windy sites!
This kind of tech could also virtually eliminate the requirement for the designers / tech supervisors to pay site visits. Imagine this set up, a big bother iPad with built in cameras in the hands of the builder as he goes around the project talking / discussion the ins and outs with the designers back in the office with all kinds of data at their fingertips (really with their feet up drinking coffee) which would allow for nearly instant informative and accurate decision making that could only result in better projects being built.
A few years back I spoke to a design professional who said that the greatest advancement in the design/build industry he had seen in the past few decades was the fax machine. Not software or survey/construction hardware, but the fax. In this vein, I think that PDF, the first and most widely accepted digital drawing format, would get my vote for the "best" way to collaborate or share information.
I think this is a shame. I really think that technology is at a point where we can do exactly what Mike is saying. There is not reason that an architect cannot visit a site with a digital copy of his/her drawings. Or that a builder should not be able to mark up a plan set in the field digitally and send it back to the designer.
We are in the future...
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Agreed. I am in the process of going almost completely paperless. A couple of our local building departments are starting up the process of digital reviews. That said, I just bought a new HP T790 plotter
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@unknownuser said:
Agreed. I am in the process of going almost completely paperless. A couple of our local building departments are starting up the process of digital reviews.
Just hope by that they don't mean dwg or dwf. Will be nice. On some jobs we've just uploaded to print service and what people ordered (DL pdf or prints) was up to them. But no movement around here to go digital at the building dept. I am surprised it's more advanced up there on the "hill".
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I'm not in any way knocking Trimble's buyout of SU. But for anyone to say that the ability to use SKP's in Trimble's devices as a "direction" of their intent, is not logical.
You do not need to own the SU engine to use a drawing data file, which we call a SKP.
You only need to understand how SU structures its data, and any good Ruby magician knows that well.It then becomes obvious that Trimble has some other strategic plan to either somehow use the engine in its products (royalty free) or upgrade SU to better suit the community's needs, as well as their own, again without paying royalties and navigating Google's political/bureaucratic landscape.
Hopefully, upgrading SU in the spirit it has been for a long time, and NOT relegating all of the good new stuff to only the Pro version is the better way. Maybe putting some older Pro only features into new free versions would be an act of good faith on Trimble's part.
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Hi Joel,
You may well be right, however its the first instance we are publicly aware of where Trimble are leveraging SketchUp and surely that could to some degree looked on as a direction
Mike
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@pbacot said:
@unknownuser said:
Agreed. I am in the process of going almost completely paperless. A couple of our local building departments are starting up the process of digital reviews.
Just hope by that they don't mean dwg or dwf. Will be nice. On some jobs we've just uploaded to print service and what people ordered (DL pdf or prints) was up to them. But no movement around here to go digital at the building dept. I am surprised it's more advanced up there on the "hill".
No, it will be PDF format. There are too many variations between acad users to make review of cad files work. It still needs to be a static output form that can be produced by different programs like old school paper.
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@unknownuser said:
Agreed. I am in the process of going almost completely paperless.
The "paperless office" has about as much chance of success as the paperless toilet!
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[off:2a15cxe0][/off:2a15cxe0]
@jgb said:@unknownuser said:
Agreed. I am in the process of going almost completely paperless.
The "paperless office" has about as much chance of success as the paperless toilet!
Think about getting cash without writing a cash cheque and stop being such a Luddite.
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