Vectorworks -- questions

Stinkie · 17 Apr 2010, 12:34

Is VW much harder to use than SU?
Any tutorial dvd's you could recommend?

arail1 · 17 Apr 2010, 13:48

Yes, much harder, but there is no program as easy as SketchUp
I can't recommend any tutorials.

VectorWorks is a 'big' program. It's not just a sketching (SketchUP) or modeling (modo) program - it's a full architectural suite - CD documents, file management, modeling, rendering, etc. Some parametric abilities. It's not a walk in the park as far as learning curve goes. Prepare to spend significant amounts of time with it.

VectorWorks is the product you use over here in New York if you're an architecture or design office committed to the apple platform.

Big investment, big time commitment.

Stinkie · 17 Apr 2010, 17:03

@arail1 said:

Yes, much harder

Figured as much. Thanks for the answers.

watkins · 17 Apr 2010, 17:38

Perhaps these might be useful

Regards,
Bob

watkins · 17 Apr 2010, 17:42

......and this

Regards,
Bob

Stinkie · 18 Apr 2010, 06:47

Thanks!

tfdesign · 18 Apr 2010, 11:43

Hey Stinkie, you may want to hang on a bit....

Mac native AutoCAD 2011 sighted in beta SDK

Autodesk AutoCAD 2011 Mac beta build could be in the works. Code snippets from SDK for ObjectARX seem to indicate evidence of Mac port says AutoCAD blog site.

Architosh (architosh.com)

PS, I tried VW, and binned it almost straight away (well after a week or so). I couldn't get on with it at all.

Have you had a look at PowerCADD 8, or HighDesign? Both native Cocoa (unlike VW's), both work well with SketchUp. QCad is okay too, at a 'bargain basement' price.

arail1 · 18 Apr 2010, 14:56

I often wish there was a good, thorough discussion / description of the major 3D packages somewhere on the web so a prospective user could familiarize himself (herself) with their relative strengths and weaknessess before trying. A good discussion of why subd programs are great modelers but have no useful export function, why nurbs provide a high degree of accuracy for export but aren't great for animation, what is AutoCAD and what is VectorWorks, etc., etc. Few of these questions are going to be answered in a 30 day demo period.

I think too often users either don't ask the question - 'what do I need the program for?', or they ask the question - 'what is this program good for?' but find no reliable source for an answer.

An example, appropriate to this discussion - I have a friend who designs and makes furniture. He's a AutoCAD user (full, not LT) and I ask him why? AutoCAD is designed for data management - for the architectural or engineering company that needs to seamlessly handle sheet management, data management, construction d's, layers, x-refs, blocks, BIM, dimensional formats, etc. My friend dutifully pays his upgrade price every year and thinks that SketchUp is some kind of a toy. But he's bought and is paying a yearly fee to maintain a battleship in order to take a brief sail in the harbor.

May first answer to your post may have been misleading - VectorWorks is much harder to learn than SketchUp because VectorWorks does much more than SketchUp does - so there's more to learn. The important question might be - do you need all of the functionality of a program like VectorWorks? Do your models need to be exported with dimensional data in a format that can be blocked or x-reffed into another company's data flow? Do you need orthagonal, 2D and 3D capabilities with dimensional info formatted appropriately for each function?

Hope this long winded 2nd reply is useful in some way.

Stinkie · 18 Apr 2010, 15:14

I agree with your sentiments.

I was wondering about the learning curve VW comes with, though, because I'm looking for a job (playime is over). I saw an ad that mentioned applicants should have a basic knowledge of the app.

arail1 · 18 Apr 2010, 16:22

@unknownuser said:

I agree with your sentiments.

I was wondering about the learning curve VW comes with, though, because I'm looking for a job (playime is over). I saw an ad that mentioned applicants should have a basic knowledge of the app.

Come to NY -
http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/egr/1694232592.html

I'm in the same boat. I closed my business as soon as the Crash hit but now, a year later, I'm going to have to go back to work. I make shop drawings for two small companies in AutoCADLT but that's not going to be enough going forward. So I have to go out and look for work (never had to do that before). Scanning Craigslist I'd say the biggest request is for AutoCAD, followed by MAX, followed by Revit. This is NY so I'm sure it's different where you are.

Stinkie · 18 Apr 2010, 17:55

@arail1 said:

Come to NY

Been there once. Interesting city, but I couldn't possibly live there. Far, far too crowded. Tough place, too, I think.

As for finding work, I'll probably end up being a editor/copywriter again. Not looking forward to that. Although ... I've just applied for a writing position at a museum. Wouldn't disagree with me.

sepo · 18 Apr 2010, 20:10

We use VectorWorks Architect in our office. We started with Powercad good 20 years ago (we were on Macs than) but got tired of 2d only capability of PowerCad so we Moved to Than MiniCad, now called Vectorworks. Once we moved to PC we stayed with VectorWorks as one could open the files crossplatform.
It is now very powerfull peice of kit.It is quite intuitive and WYSIWYG ....In my book it is much better software than AutoCad. Saying all of that we are not using VW to its full potential. Latest version opens sketchup files with SU materials no problem. If you want to render within VW than you will need module called Renderworks... All in all for CAD VW does all we need.

Stinkie · 18 Apr 2010, 20:47

@sepo said:

Latest version opens sketchup files with SU materials no problem.

Hm. That's interesting, Sid. Thanks for the info.

Edson · 19 Apr 2010, 12:05

tom,

i completely agree with sid. VW is a powerful app that does everything the big guns do (autocad, archicad, etc) in a more intuitive way. i have been using it since 1995 (!!!) when it was still called MiniCad and was owned by a small american firm. in the beginning it was a mac-only app but nowadays it is cross-platform.

VW is not that hard to learn if you go through the manuals. the best ones i found are the ones produced by archoncad in new zealand. their manuals come as books with a large number of videos that greatly expand what the written tutorials try to explain.

none of the students who come to work with me know VW; they are basically autocad-trained. they pick it up very quickly and after they leave my office they never go back to autocad and stick to VW.

VW is a complete application. besides the architect module it also packs a landscape module that is very good for making terrains and a complete renderer which i have always found too complicated.

before i found sketchup i used VW for everything: 2D, 3D and rendering. now i use it basically for 2D but since it imports skp files smoothly i will try to see if i can extract my 2Ds directly from the imported skippie.

one of the key features of VW is the way info is organized in it. besides the common layer level of organization, VW offers you another level of organization, called classes. this means that you can have a whole building in a single file: your floors go into VW's layers and the elements of each floor go into VW's classes. as simple as that.

i do think VW is worth a try.

dale · 19 Apr 2010, 14:28

I also go way back with Vectorworks (into the minicad days), and used to use it to create all my 3d models, which it has been and still is capable of doing, since back in the 80's. Now, like others it is relegated to 2D drafting most of the time with SketchUp doing the 3d work.
I also have reasonable proficiency at Autocad.
If you have used cad before, it will be more a case of learning the tools, layers and class system. The basics are pretty simple, but like any software, there is a learning curve, although I don't think it's anywhere near as steep as the Autodesk suite.
Edson is right about the archoncad material. They are about the best you can get. There is of course also the forums at http://techboard.vectorworks.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=cfrm
The interesting thing about using both VW and Acad is you see the strengths and weaknesses of both, and we can argue the pro's and con's for each, but Vectorworks is capable of all the sophistication you'll need with a reasonable learning curve.

utiler · 20 Apr 2010, 05:46

Hi Stinkie, I have been looking at a program called ARC+ in the past few weeks.
http://www.arc-techno.com
Go to the video examples to se it in action.

It is as close as you will get to the workflow that SU provides and seems quite reasonable.
Also, the two guys I have been in contact with from arc-tecno have been very good to deal with as well as one of their resellers in teh Netherlands, Stefan.

Have a look at these short videos on Stefans website. http://www.cadez.eu/video/
Audio is a little annoying so turn off the volume if you want.....
Seems very intuitive though!!