Bonzai 3D First Impressions

Ecuadorian · 5 Feb 2009, 23:12

"Nurbz" is how Nurbs is spelled in lolspeak. Come on, any frequent visitor of icanhascheezburger.com knows that.

xrok1 · 6 Feb 2009, 00:43

While we do not have plans to incorporate dimensioning tools in bonzai, we will have these (like SketchUp and much more) in formZ 7.0.

ZWebTech Support

no dimensions = no sale

looks like this is a free?(light version) of form-z written to suck you into purchasing form-z when you realize that the option you most need aren't there until you upgrade to BonzaiPRO (form-z).

or is it just me? if you like this program get Moi3D you'll like that better, and he's not trying to sell you MoiPRO.

xrok1 · 6 Feb 2009, 00:47

i think the script writers will stop when they find a SK killer, just like everyone else. SK is the prog we love to hate, its like our own child we overlook its flaws and and keep hoping it will grow up. the script writers are molding it into maturity, i think half of their efforts are just to show google what SK could and should be.

the thing i don't understand is that there are ump-teen 3d packages out there but somehow the elegant simplicity of SK seems to evade every other developer in the industry? nobody wants to make "another SK". i say please do, but finish the job, do it right. any developer please take SK loadup your favorite scripts play with it, see how it works, and how it dosn't; now don't go out and remake a 3Dmax or Silo or LW clone, make an SK clone, but fix it ,improve it, charge $295 for it ,then beat'em off with a stick and reserve my copy.

the sky really won't fall if someone goes head to head with SK as long as they do it right ,the customer base is already there just waiting.

remember one man made Moi3d http://moi3d.com/ (similiar to SK but nurb based)really nice program. i think an SK clone would be an easier task for talented people(s). (give it a try Whaat )

pilou · 6 Feb 2009, 02:42

Seems working only connected to the Net! Is that the same for you?

lewiswadsworth · 6 Feb 2009, 03:38

Oh, Geez. LoLspeak in my CAD programs. It's bad enough having twenty-pound black tomcats running around the home and office and making tasty snacks of expensive computer cables. Do they have to write computer programs now too? (That could explain a lot about Banzai, come to think of it.)

fakircho · 6 Feb 2009, 07:34

I am quite frustrated with Bonzai 3D. It has some nice ideas but it is just annoying to use.
Selections suck, why do you need 3 different tools? Work planes suck too. Some nice reshape tools i think Sketchup should have out of the box, the splines too, N-Loft i can't get do anything but sounds like what i have been wanting for ages. Really like the parametric stair objects but that is about it. Don't think i like anything else in this program. It definitely feels like an alpha version on Win, i bit better on the Mac.

Sketchup still rules

remus · 6 Feb 2009, 07:55

@xrok1 said:

i think the script writers will stop when they find a SK killer, just like everyone else. SK is the prog we love to hate, its like our own child we overlook its flaws and and keep hoping it will grow up. the script writers are molding it into maturity, i think half of their efforts are just to show google what SK could and should be.

the thing i don't understand is that there are ump-teen 3d packages out there but somehow the elegant simplicity of SK seems to evade every other developer in the industry? nobody wants to make "another SK". i say please do, but finish the job, do it right. any developer please take SK loadup your favorite scripts play with it, see how it works, and how it dosn't; now don't go out and remake a 3Dmax or Silo or LW clone, make an SK clone, but fix it ,improve it, charge $295 for it ,then beat'em off with a stick and reserve my copy.

the sky really won't fall if someone goes head to head with SK as long as they do it right ,the customer base is already there just waiting.

remember one man made Moi3d http://moi3d.com/ (similiar to SK but nurb based)really nice program. i think an SK clone would be an easier task for talented people(s). (give it a try Whaat )

Perhaps it just isnt that easy...

kwistenbiebel · 6 Feb 2009, 09:48

@linea said:

It is not in Autodesks interest to simplify the software, the elitism is part of the marketing strategy...

Wonderful quote...and oh so true.

linea · 6 Feb 2009, 09:57

@unknownuser said:

the thing i don't understand is that there are ump-teen 3d packages out there but somehow the elegant simplicity of SK seems to evade every other developer in the industry? nobody wants to make "another SK".

No they don't, because traditionally 3d modelling and cad has been a fairly elitist industry dominated by one or two monopolies. These monopolies keep their old-school customers happy, as they are the ones who can afford the software and the training (or can be bothered to read a manual as thick as a bible) so it keeps them useful in the industry, so long as they dismiss Sketchup and any other cheap upstarts. It is not in Autodesk's interests to simplify the software, the elitism is part of the marketing strategy. IMO

But Autodesk messed up with Autocad and suddenly they added push-pull and sketchy styles because they realised people wanted it. I'm sure they could have done it years ago but decided to keep it in the bag for as long as possible.

Tim Danaher · 6 Feb 2009, 12:57

As xrok1 said --

This appears to be an attempt to get form•Z users in athe ground floor -- get them used to the form•Z way of doing things and then get them to buy what is the most overpriced modeller on the market these days.

It is, to all intents and purposes, form•Z. It's still based on the ACIS modelling libraries. I thought that it would be more along the lines of 3DVia -- a SketchUp clone.

Wow, I'm really missing the ability to pan & orbit with the mouse.

Has anyone found a way to edit derived surfaces after creation? I thought the generating spline was supposed to stay active? Maybe in the 'full' version.

Anyone found any shadow-casting capabilities yet?

And why can't we just download the videos and peruse them at our leisure?

Tim Danaher · 6 Feb 2009, 13:06

@xrok1 said:

the thing i don't understand is that there are ump-teen 3d packages out there but somehow the elegant simplicity of SK seems to evade every other developer in the industry? nobody wants to make "another SK". i say please do, but finish the job, do it right.

There's 3DVia -- as to whether they're doing it 'right'...

302 Found

(www.3dvia.com)

plot-paris · 6 Feb 2009, 17:35

I had a look at Bonzai3D - the beta version is still extremely beta (didn't manage to run it longer than 2 minutes without crashing; and only when using very basic tools).
graphic is very slow and choppy as well. by no means ready to be released yet.

but there are some things that look pretty impressive. when I look at certain 'reshape' tools, like the 'round-edges', the 'twist' or the 'bend function... that quickly shows, how limited and slow SketchUp can be (what Bonzai3D does with one mouse-click would afford a lot of work and the use of several rubies).

how do they do it? are they using some sort of auto-subdivide or are all objects built of NURBS?
by the way. that is exactly how I would like a SketchUp-NURBS to work...

Pixero · 6 Feb 2009, 17:58

Bonzai crashes every time at my first click in the viewport. Beta, I'd call it pre Alpha at the most.

Ecuadorian · 6 Feb 2009, 18:02

Has anyone figured how to orbit the view and how to do a marquee selection?

chango70 · 6 Feb 2009, 19:02

oooooouuuu! Bonzai looks interesting. Sketchup has some stiff competition coming its way! Which can only be a good thing. I am looking forward to SU8 even more now.

pilou · 6 Feb 2009, 19:16

Orbit = Ctrl + Right Mouse Button
Pan = Click not release Wheel Mouse Button and move

Seems the prog run only connected to the Net, is that the same for you?

linea · 6 Feb 2009, 20:19

I can't get it to run at all.

bonzai3d support · 6 Feb 2009, 20:49

Gentlemen (and ladies?),

Thank you for taking the opportunity to try our new software, bonzai3d! Bonzai3d is a new 3D modeler developed to fill in the demand for a quick, easy, simple but, most importantly, geometrically robust approach to 3D.

We have worked hard to make it as powerful, user friendly, and intuitive as possible. We are convinced that if you take the time to watch the introductory videos, and give it a test drive, that you will find it to be both easy to use, as well as a powerful modeling program.

bonzai3d is still in beta, so some irregularities are expected, and these will be corrected as soon as we are informed about them. However, some of the comments posted in this thread raise suspicions that there may be problems with the systems on which it is being run. bonZai3d utilizes OpenGL extensively, so it is rather important that you hvae properly installed and up to date video drivers. Likewise, for operating systems. We do not want to bother you with too many technicalities, but we will be happy to help you if you are interested in the details. Also, if you have any specific questions about features of b3d, we shall be happy to answer, here or on our forum: http://www.bonzai3d.com/beta_forum.html (It is preferable to post questions to our forum, as we monitor these more frequently -- and thus we can respond more quickly.) You can also email us at support@bonzai3d.com if you like.

Concluding this we would like to thank you all for hosting a discussion about b3d. We would also like to take this opportunity and express our respect for the SketchUp application. We have no interest in "killing" it. On the contrary, we expect SketchUp and b3d to compliment each other and hopefully this will be made easier when SketchUp evolves to the next level, as many of you have been requesting. Of course, you can also expect b3d to continue evolving as we hear feedback from you, and our other users.

We will make another post that includes more specific answers to questions you have raised here.

bonzai3d Technical Support
support@bonzai3d.com

bonzai3d support · 6 Feb 2009, 21:10

To address a few specific issues that have been raised on this thread:

Initially demand for bonzai3d was incredible and it swamped our servers. We have dramatically increased capacity, and it should be running properly now.
If you are still having stability issues on Windows after updating your system and video driver, please send your system specifications to support@bonzai3d.com so we can test with your specific hardware configuration.
Navigation: You can zoom in or out with the wheel mouse. You can orbit the scene by clicking and dragging with the Ctrl key (WIN) or Command key (OS X) pressed while dragging the cursor with the left mouse button pressed. You can pan by dragging with the middle mouse wheel pressed. You can navigate with the arrow keys. And you can access many more navigation functions via the Edit Menu: Key Shortcuts: Direct View Navigation commands.
The introductory videos are not yet on our web site, but we are working on this. If you have downloaded and run bonzai3d Beta, then you can access the videos from the start-up screen. See the Navigation video -- and others for details on how bonzai3d works.
Fakircho -- you mention that you can only zoom out with your track pad. Which navigation technique are you trying to use?
Lewiswadsworth -- You mention that you are getting reproducible crashes. Can you please send your BNZ.zip file to support@bonzai3d.com so we can investigate this?
Tim Danaher -- There are some similarities with formZ, but there are many many differences. Have you checked the introductory videos yet, and really given it a try?

... to be continued

bonzai3d Support

Ecuadorian · 6 Feb 2009, 21:13

Wow, SketchUcation is extremely visible in Google... Every single time we start discussing a new app, a representative comes here in no time.
I'll check the Bonzai videos. I remember dissin' SketchUp for years until I sat one entire day, from morning to late night, to watch all the 28 tutorial videos, and then started to design immediately. I had never before learned to use a 3D app in a single day! I hope Bonzai3D has a similar learning curve... I said hope.