Animator: Parametric Animation plugin - Discussion
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@ntxdave said:
@sarkarshomit said:
i would really love to know about rendering options for animator.
i know its possible using keyframe animation,
but with animator i guess its only that ambient occlusion thingy which i am not that interested.
Would be great with vray or thea render.In addition to Ambient Occlusion, you can use both Twilight (Pro version only) and Thea.
[attachment=0:2g4uvf8x]<!-- ia0 -->Animator Render.PNG<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:2g4uvf8x]Oh wow, i will give it a try soon...thanks
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SO you can`t render the animation with V-Ray?
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Fredo6. I love your work. I'd like to share three things about the plugin related to Vray.
First, Animator doesn't work well with Vray Safe frame. When Vray Safe Frame is activated, Animator changes the viewport rendering. My Workaround is setting the SU Scenes with Vray Safe Frame, deactivate Safe Frame, create the Animator Cameras based on the SU Scenes, and then do the animation rendering with the Pre-rendering settings (Rendering size and proportion).
Second, Sometimes Animator sends a new render before the last one is properly saved, CPU has released the job, and ram is cleared. With Bucket rendering I just got 86 out of 301 frames. They were rendered but not saved. Now, using Progressive, I got frames 1, 3, 4, 7, 9, 11, 12, 13, 14... a bit better, but still an issue. Only workaround I found is activating Vray History Rendering, and recover the lost frames from that list. (It's not nice, however, to check on 300 frames, and save them 1 by 1)
Third, Animator apparently creates some instances that causes clipping. I was doing a 360° Light rotation (FakeSun, which was several kilometers away) And it inmediatly clipped my whole scene. I tried everything but the clipping remained beyond, basically, whole file wipeout (scenes, layers, models, etc.). Had to copy/paste to a new file and leave the sun for the final step, knowing there was nothing I could do on the model after that.
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@spartipilo said:
Fredo6. I love your work. I'd like to share three things about the plugin related to Vray.
First, Animator doesn't work well with Vray Safe frame. When Vray Safe Frame is activated, Animator changes the viewport rendering. My Workaround is setting the SU Scenes with Vray Safe Frame, deactivate Safe Frame, create the Animator Cameras based on the SU Scenes, and then do the animation rendering with the Pre-rendering settings (Rendering size and proportion).
Second, Sometimes Animator sends a new render before the last one is properly saved, CPU has released the job, and ram is cleared. With Bucket rendering I just got 86 out of 301 frames. They were rendered but not saved. Now, using Progressive, I got frames 1, 3, 4, 7, 9, 11, 12, 13, 14... a bit better, but still an issue. Only workaround I found is activating Vray History Rendering, and recover the lost frames from that list. (It's not nice, however, to check on 300 frames, and save them 1 by 1)
Third, Animator apparently creates some instances that causes clipping. I was doing a 360° Light rotation (FakeSun, which was several kilometers away) And it inmediatly clipped my whole scene. I tried everything but the clipping remained beyond, basically, whole file wipeout (scenes, layers, models, etc.). Had to copy/paste to a new file and leave the sun for the final step, knowing there was nothing I could do on the model after that.
Hi,
The VRay implementation is still a first attempt, waiting for the Chaos Group to have a closer look and fix a few issues. In general, for rendering software, Animator just positions the objects and camera and then call the rendering software API for generating the image file for the frame.
So, if there are problems of clipping or any other that pertains to Sketchup objects and cameras, you should see them in 'Natural' mode (i.e. no rendering).
Regarding Vray Safe Frame, I don't know what it is. But I don't think Animator should have to interact with it.
Again, pending Chaos Group validation and possible adjustments on their end to fix a few issues / limitations related to Animator...
Fredo
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@fredo6 said:
@Pilou and chri
Animator is purely based on kinematics, not physics. In addition, Animation is predictive[...]
Can the plugin store the movements generated by Sketchyphysics, to later reproduce them without recalculating them from scratch? This would allow creating GREAT animations by merging different sketchyphysics animations but requiring no computation power!
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@jumpjack said:
Can the plugin store the movements generated by Sketchyphysics, to later reproduce them without recalculating them from scratch? This would allow creating GREAT animations by merging different sketchyphysics animations but requiring no computation power!
I thought SketchyPhysics had a way to generate animations.
But I agree, recording the movement of objects, whether from SketchyPhyics, MSPhysics or other sources would be useful. In particular, because you can then manage th cameras and styling independently.At the moment, Animator is more handling animation based on its own creation of parametric movements (as opposed to 'free' movements), but this could be an interesting idea.
Fredo
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@fredo6 said:
At the moment, Animator is more handling animation based on its own creation of parametric movements (as opposed to 'free' movements), but this could be an interesting idea.
This brings to mind another question (but for users rather than developer): does it already exist an archive of animation parameters?
It would be for example interesting to have an animation for a generic "human figure", which users could than apply to any two-legged figure... human or not.
But I don't know if it is even possible to export just parameters of an animation... is it? -
@jumpjack said:
This brings to mind another question (but for users rather than developer): does it already exist an archive of animation parameters?
It would be for example interesting to have an animation for a generic "human figure", which users could than apply to any two-legged figure... human or not.
But I don't know if it is even possible to export just parameters of an animation... is it?Yes, most human figures animation are based on parametric files which you can exchange (or buy?).
In the Sketchup world, there is the animation plugin SimFonIA doing it. See this post.
Fredo
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I was asking about Animator plugin: does it export also just animation parameters, or only model+animation?
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@jumpjack said:
I was asking about Animator plugin: does it export also just animation parameters, or only model+animation?
Animator does not export anything at the moment. It creates videos.
My remark was more on importing movement files to control object animation.Fredo
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I just read that this plugin is an expireware...
So it's just a beta test for a commercial application? -
@jumpjack said:
I just read that this plugin is an expireware...
So it's just a beta test for a commercial application?Yes Sir, except the beta period is lasting....
Fredo
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Is there a trick to cause Animator (v1.7d) camera paths to approximate those generated by SketchUp itself when changing scenes? The circular camera path choice in Animator's GUI yields very different paths than SketchUp's native path in my experiments. Animator's circular paths unpredictably seem to swoop through the defined points. The attached SketchUp file demonstrates the difference that I'm struggling with. Here is what I see in the example file between the first and second camera positions: Animator's camera passes through the interior of the large rectangular box, whereas SketchUp's path rotates counter-clockwise remaining well outside of the box. The path between positions two and three are also quite different between Animator to SketchUp.
Camera Path Test - SketchUp vs. Animator
I have seen fredosix's YouTube video that purports to show how close the SketchUp and Animator paths are, but that path fidelity is not my experience. So far I've mostly been using Animator's linear choice because it's the most predictable. I would love to eliminate the bounce inherent to linear paths, but the circular (and to a lesser degree the bezier) path settings seem rather crazy. -
How do people with somewhat complex models cope with interactive (GUI) performance of Animator? I am trying to do some object movements in a model with about 700 component instances, 380K faces, and 730K edges. The GUI response is super slow, on an iMac 5K model (32GB RAM) that's just a couple of years old. With Activity Monitor running, SketchUp consumes about 30% of CPU when Animator's GUI is "doing something" such as letting me select an object to be the target of motion. By the way, regular SketchUp performance is totally fine when dealing with even more complex models on this same computer (e.g., a model with 2K component instances, 1M faces, 2M edges will pan and zoom and orbit very smoothly, perhaps 20 frames per second or so).
For the past hour or so I have tried unsuccessfully to create a motion sequence where a compound object (a group with many nested groups and components) rotates. I activate the motion tool, and select the object that I want to rotate (which becomes blue). That takes a few seconds for Animator to highlight the objects to which I'm pointing with the mouse, but it's tolerable.
Then in the GUI I try to click the ROTATION button. It takes the GUI about ten (10) seconds between when I first hover the mouse cursor over the button, and when the tool-tip for ROTATION appears. A similar delay occurs whenever re-pointing the mouse and hovering over another artifact in the Animator GUI - it takes ten seconds or so for the GUI to respond to the new mouse position. After clicking the ROTATION button, I then try to select the object that defines the rotation, and then set the rotation sweep angle. Here I fail.
Every time I move the mouse, it takes 20 to 30 seconds before some object under the mouse (or under where the mouse WAS, when I had been moving the mouse) is shown in orange. Any little movement of the mouse causes the GUI to think for another 20 to 30 seconds. The Activity Monitor utility shows ~30% CPU busy during such times. I am training myself to just not touch the mouse any further until Activity Monitor shows CPU at background level, so that I know the Animator GUI is truly idle.
So I try to click the mouse when I think I am pointing the mouse at the desired point on the desired reference object (which is shown in orange), and the GUI has settled down (not drawing anything new) and Activity Monitor shows the CPU usage to drop to background. Again, this is 20 to 30 seconds after any recent mouse movement. (Thus it is super painful to try to select the reference point for the rotation! If I need to orbit and pan and zoom, OUCH! Super super slow, 20 to 30 seconds lag every time I do something with the mouse, before the GUI responds with a repositioned model.) After clicking on the reference point of rotation I cannot get the Animator GUI to recognize any subsequent clicks and mouse motion as indications of the angle I want the rotation to sweep. Instead of activating the red sweep protractor, I end up inadvertently reselecting a new reference rotation point. Or so it seems; the red sweep protractor never appears with a complex model and super slow GUI.
I have tried using an extremely simple model to understand how the Animator GUI operates to define a rotation. That works OK, very quick. I can get a little box to rotate. But attempting to apply the same actions, slowed down by a factor of 100 or so in a complex model, just does not seem to work.
What I will experiment with is creating a super-simplified version of my actual model. Use that simplified version to define the Animator actions. Then replace the simplified objects with their full-detail versions. Hmm, I cannot delete the simplified object, because that is what Animator keys its actions to. But perhaps I can hide the geometry of the simplified version, and paste in the detailed geometry?
Suggestions appreciated! Animator seems amazingly capable, but using it on a moderately complex model is very frustrating due to performance.
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Tom,
Thanks for your interest in Animator.
I'll have a look at the question of view transition path.
For performance, would you mind to post or PM your complex model so that I can check where the problem comes from.
Animator is still in Beta and so far I invested more in the framework than in fine-tuning each feature.
Thanks
Fredo
EDIT: I found the origin of the performance problem. Still I prefer to have a 'complex' model to check this is fine.
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Hi Fred, thanks for considering the concerns I mentioned. I will post a more complex model but I lost power last night and thus can't use my normal computer yet.
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Hello again, and apologies for spelling the name "Fred" in my prior reply - I meant to enter Fredo. I uploaded a copy of my moderately complex model to DropBox, about 69MB file size. It has 750 component instances, 380K faces, and 730K edges according to SKetchUp's Model Info window.
I am trying to cause the top-level group named "SSA-All for Azimuth" to rotate. That group represents most of the geometry in the SketchUp file. Below the base of the main group is a small cylindrical electrical connector socket. A short vertical edge and a horizontal disc are positioned below the electrical connector. That vertical edge (and disc center-point) represents the axis about which I was trying to cause the "SSAA-All for Azimuth" group to rotate. Performance issues were making that effectively impossible for me with Animator v1.7d.
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Hi Tom,
Just published Animator 1.8a and LibFredo6 7.9a, which should improve the situation regarding large models.
Thanks to advise if this is better for your model.
Fredo
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Hi Fredo, I upgraded to the new Animator 1.8a - WOW a huge improvement in performance! Thank you very much for making the enhancement, and providing it so soon. A complex model (about 2x the content of the model I linked in a prior reply) that previously required four or five seconds to update the viewport any time I dragged or clicked the cursor in the timeline, now allows moderately smooth dragging of the cursor in the timeline - nice, very usable! When playing the animation of that model within the extension it renders faster by a factor of 10x frames per second (from one frame per four seconds, improved to three or so frames per second with v1.8a).
I still have some slight trouble creating a rotation motion within the sample model I linked in a prior reply, I cannot seem to use the mouse to establish the rotation sweep angle. But I can get it to work by clicking on the rotation point, and then using the properties dialog box to enter a numeric value for the rotation (which I could not get to work with v1.7d). Also, the screen updating when selecting the object to be animated, and the ability to orbit and pan around the model while in that mode, is MUCH improved. Thank you again!
- Tom
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