3D Truss Models
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You make two very good points:
- The detail should only be there when you need it: This is why I have balked at adding in too much detail into the model such as plates, fasteners, clips, and hangers. I've also split up my menus to use a simple UI and then offer "advanced options", which turns on sheathing, sub-fascia, rake boards, outlookers and eventually bird blocking.
The goal is to also make some global settings that can be configured so that even more control is given to the user regarding the level of detail and other configurable items. If the interface is too tedious to use the plugin is doomed.
- For a successful plugin it needs to do something everybody wants or do something that is difficult to do extremely well: In this case the plugin is all about saving the user time and effort by creating complex geometry in a matter of seconds.
The plugin will only appeal to a very limited audience. Most people could care less about how rafters or trusses generate the overall geometry of their roof, even my wife thinks I'm quite crazy, she doesn't get the fascination I have with trusses.
This plugin needs to make hard things simple, such as creating complex roof geometry that would otherwise take an experienced SU user many minutes or an hour or two to complete. Hopefully I can achieve this with what I am doing, and to some degree I think I already have. I don't think there is any SU user that can generate a rectangular hip roof fully framed out as fast as I can using the plugin, and the same goes for any of the trussed or rafter roofs.
This is why I would really like to complete the dutch gable rafter roof. There is a lot going on there (again see previous post with images) but if the plugin can generate all of that instantly then there is definitely some value in that.
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Interesting. Right off the batt I'm going to say this is well outside the scope of what I'm trying to do, but I think we all know that.
However, if someone was motivated enough I could see a progam that could generate all of the curves necessary to generate the hull shape/surface and framework given a specific set of inputs/parameters. It all boils down to mathematical model that is then translated into geometry. I wouldn't be surprised if there already isn't a plugin out there that is able to generate hull shapes.
Not something I'm interested in or about to tackle at the moment. It would be challenging, much more so since you are dealing with splines and curved surfaces.
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I'm not saying there's no value to the plugin at all. I'm just saying it has tremedous value for some, and it could have tremendous value for most if it was easy to do really hard stuff that people cannot.
As you say, an experienced SU user wouldn't be able to do a truss as fast as you with your plugin, but it probably takes an experienced user to use a plugin and know he saves some time with it. Also it takes time to master a plugin that is fairly complex. An experienced user knows that he is finished in an hour and that might be less than the time it takes to explore the plugin. So, he must really need it for whatever reason or he will suspect that he'll waste more time with the plugin than in actually doing his stuff.
I'm building trusses only marginally, the ones I build (or rebuild) on my refurbishments here in Lisbon are so twisted and out of standard, that I'm pretty sure I couldn't use your plugin even if I wanted.
However, I'm if your plugin would provide a way to have all the metal details that I cannot generate easily, I'd be interested in it...
Right now, it's really an interesting plugin but I'd probably only purchase it the day I'd build a new building with trusses. That, is already an interesting idea...
My wife looses her nerve, when I look at materials in the floor, in walls and touch concrete, wood and stones everywhere... But then again, she's an architect too so she just laughs a bit. The kids haven't noticed much yet!
Thanks for taking your time, I hope I find some more time to test your work...
Congratulations and keep it up it is already brilliant and you'll make it epic!
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I could add in an advanced option to model in the plates but for now it would be non-engineered and simply for representational purposes. If I have requests from other users for this sort of thing I will consider it.
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Thanks for the update Nathaniel. Again version numbering is conflicting with a prior version, also date stamp on the site differs from the post above. Any chance you could have an unique version number to every version you release, even if the change/update is however minor?
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Version 1.3.1 - 02.17.2016
- New submenu item and toolbar icon added for global settings.
I've also addressed a number of bugs for rafter roofs when metric units are being used. I highly recommend everyone download the latest version, especially if you are using metric units.
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Yes, I should probably roll a new rev. even when I make minor changes. The new menu item is really a partial update since I haven't yet add all of the code behind it so I didn't think it worth a new revision number. However, the bug fixes I just made are significant. I will be more strict about this in the future.
Date stamp on revision is now 02.17.2016
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Started to code in the dual pitch truss, the top chords, king post and bottom chord are there just need to add some webs:
Just an FYI, my previous post in Nov. had a sign switched in the last step of the derivation for Span 1, corrected in the plugin to a minus sign and everything is comes out perfect.
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Here is a Dual Pitch 2/2 - 3/3 truss with a 12:12 pitch and a 4:12 pitch.
Still working on the gable end trusses and the advanced options involving structural outlookers.
I will be looking at raised heel scissor trusses next, those sound challenging and interesting. Please post or send me examples of any raised heel scissor truss examples or shop drawings. The combined pitches of the top and bottom chord with a wedge, slider or vertical web and strut will require some serious calculations and ample logic.
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Version 1.3.2 - 02.23.2016
- Added Dualpitch truss type, configurations: (2/2-3/3).
- Metric input enabled for dualpitch truss type.
- Advanced options enabled for dualpitch truss type.
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
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Mono Cathedral trusses with heel wedge:
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
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A quick study of the general shape and layout of a 6/6 bowstring truss with different radii:
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Version 1.3.3 - 02.28.2016
- Added Bowstring truss type, configurations: (6/6).
- Metric input enabled for bowstring truss type.
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
I'm not sure how common place this truss type is anymore so I will add the advanced options at a later date if requested by a user. I can also add in other configurations with more panels if needed (ie. 8/8, 10/10).
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Added Bowstring truss type, configurations: (8/8).
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
Initially I wasn't really sure how to lay out this type of truss, especially the webs and panel distances. Then after some thought it occurred to me that the length of each top chord segment should be roughly equal to best approximate the circular shape of the truss. After some checking of existing shop drawings my theory tested correct. The length of each top chord segment is equal in length.
The necessary math and algorithm was much simpler than I initially thought. Another sidenote, as the radius of the truss decreases the pitch breaks of the truss become more apparent and the circular shape of the roof becomes more angular.
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28' Bow Barrel Truss (8/8) study.
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
Gable end trusses for this type are a bit of a question right now. I can add this one into the plugin if there is some call for it, but I may hold off until a request is made since the code will be somewhat tedious with all the separate members that make up the top and bottom chords.
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Version 1.3.4 - 03.02.2016
- Corrected a bug in the metric unit template module.
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Version 1.3.5 - 03.04.2016
- Added Bow Barrel truss type, configurations: (8/8).
- Metric input enabled for bow barrel truss type.
- Corrected a bug with the webs of the bowstring truss type.
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
Gable end option is also available (not shown in image above for clarity) for this truss type.
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I find the bow barrel truss very interesting. Its very similar to a flat truss in a lot of respects but then you essentially create pitch breaks at all the panel points and add some camber to it.
View model here:
3D Warehouse
3D Warehouse is a website of searchable, pre-made 3D models that works seamlessly with SketchUp.
(3dwarehouse.sketchup.com)
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I'm thinking the next thing I might tackle is an octagonal rafter roof. Something along these lines:
My time allotted to work on the plugin is very limited right now so I'm trying to decide if this would be something of interest for current and potential users of the plugin.
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@medeek said:
I'm thinking the next thing I might tackle is an octagonal rafter roof. Something along these lines:
My time allotted to work on the plugin is very limited right now so I'm trying to decide if this would be something of interest for current and potential users of the plugin.
Medeek Truss - Nathaniel
A half octagon roof would be useful for greenhouses, tea rooms, and extensions to existing
houses, cafes and small offices. (refer to screencapture with red section marks)I have been following your plugin using the "trial version" and a few thoughts come to mind:
**1. Keep it Simple (stupid). (KISS)** No offence intended, it is a common "Check - design" mnemonic or mental stamp used with every new idea or concept.Offering too many options although good can work against you until your market is tested.
Feedback is required as you may be going off into areas that users have little interest in.If your market is architects, builders and designers; remember they chose their profession because
they have an interest in that area, not structural engineering. Of course there is a crossover but I bet most in the above list are mainly interested in how the truss affects their area of focus.**2. Graphics help and assists in data input**. A good example to view is the "1001 bits" plugin.Graphics are important to aid the "non-engineer".
Colour, blocking of information that are linked or share associated areas would help.
Lists of data input are difficult to follow as there is no "road map" to where
it is leading.**3. Preset options**with data toned in colour or grey with limited options for changes to key variables in white or a colour. ( e.g. roof slope angle) This would allow the user at a glance to focus in on set options. **4. Truss design and engineering computations** are generally handled by "truss fabricators" here in Australia. Their CAD drawings, computations and fabrication are part of their "full package software". **5. The strength in your truss plugin is** allowing the architect, builder, client or designer, to understand better the likely design and construction issues for different truss options.I congratulate you on your enthusiasm and I enjoy checking every few days
on what new truss you have considered.All the best with your plugin.
Half octagone roof for Green houses, tea rooms and extensions.
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