A Thread for Fine Design

[dale]

Another Stark quote:
Because there is different types of design. The one, we can call it the cynical design, that means the design invented by Raymond Loewy in the '50s, who said, what is ugly is a bad sale, la laideur se vend mal, which is terrible. It means the design must be just the weapon for marketing, for producer to make product more sexy, like that, they sell more: it's shit, it's obsolete, it's ridiculous. I call that the cynical design.

After, there is the narcissistic design: it's a fantastic designer who designs only for other fantastic designers. After, there is people like me, who try to deserve to exist, and who are so ashamed to make this useless job, who try to do it in another way, and they try, I try, to not make the object for the object but for the result, for the profit for the human being, the person who will use it. If we take the toothbrush -- I don't think about the toothbrush. I think, "What will be the effect of the brush in the mouth?" And to understand what will be the effect of the toothbrush in the mouth, I must imagine: Who owns this mouth? What is the life of the owner of this mouth? In what society [does] this guy live? What civilization creates this society? What animal species creates this civilization? When I arrive -- and I take one minute, I am not so intelligent -- when I arrive at the level of animal species, that becomes real interesting.

[Hieru]

There's no doubt that Starck is a great designer and his views on design are always memorable and food for thought. Only yesterday I was trying to explain my take on the above quote to a client who was stuck in a 'cynical' mindset - let's just say it didn't go down too well.

Having said that, when it comes to certain Starck designs I sometimes struggle to see how he lives up to his own ideals and it becomes a case of 'do as I say, not as I do'.

[simon le bon]

Thank you Dale,
You make me learn something new with the concept of "Cynical Design". The words bring to consciousness something that basically we suspected isn't it ?.

Then we have to re-consider and to think about the concept of "mauvais goût" (a typical french word !)

Making "beautiful" stuff as a "marketing weapon" is what France is specialize in must we admit

++simon

[dale]

Heiru and Simon
I find it refreshing, Starks musings. And totally opposite of some of the "Architect Speak", where questionable concepts are clouded in large words and coined phrases to basically make me feel dumb, and therefore give consent. (This is not intended to single out Architects, as this exists in the design field and many others including product design, interior design, landscape design.....)
I read a little article recently meant to spoof this way of speaking.

A Discourse on Emerging Tectonic Visualization and the Effects of Materiality on Praxis
Or an essay on the ridiculous way architects talk.
By Witold Rybczynski

But so much of design is subjective.
My Mother loved Pink.
The bathroom was awash with Pink fluff. To her this was comfortable elegance, and probably was a real luxury for a lower middle class woman.
And think of the era (maybe it did not infect Europe) of Avacado appliances and Orange shag rugs that you could lose a pizza in.
Like so many things in Society we endorsed, and bought right in.
And now it is rising up again as Retro (ORIGIN from Latin retro ‘backward.’)

So it is nice to have a Stark who is contemplating the fine details.
And it is nice to have the ability to say we don't agree with his interpretation.

As for "mauvais goût" (which I believe can be roughly translated as "Bad taste"
Perhaps it is there for contrast.

[Hieru]

I know plenty of people who find Starck's use of language to be impenetrable, but I understand what you mean Dale.

The key difference for me is that despite Starck's eccentric use of language, he expresses himself in a manner that is very humanistic and sympathetic to how we interact with one another and our environment - which does of course include a desire to surround ourselves with beautiful stuff.

Some designers and companies are so self absorbed they forget that people have actually got to use these products and live with them on a daily basis.

[simon le bon]

Hi Dave and Hieru,

interesting sequence of this thread isn't it?
Thank you again Dale for the reflections and the (pink) souvenirs!

• • we also (in France) had been "infected" by "Orange shag rugs that you could lose a pizza in."

It comes to me that the system is incredibly adaptive. The new "Bad Taste" (well wrapped) seems to me becoming the new "weapon for marketing"

I don't know as much as you both about PH. Starck

agree with your Hieru that "he expresses himself in a manner that is very humanistic and sympathetic"
for me those two pictures express that feeling:

The article Dale you were talking about:
http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/architecture/2011/02/a_discourse_on_emerging_tectonic_visualization_and_the_effects_of_materiality_on_praxis.html

I'm actually reading with great interest a book from another free thinking architect :Entretiens sur l'architecture par Eugène Viollet Le Duc.

Here is the link to read it and download it translated into English:
[url=http://www.archive.org/details/discoursesonarc00violgoog:2wqzmau8]Discourses on architecture (1959)[/url:2wqzmau8]

++simon

[dale]

Thanks for the link to the Eugène Viollet Le Duc book Simon.
I am aware that he was criticized for "altering" the restorations he worked on, so it would be interesting to see his point of view.
Watch out, if you keep up this reading pattern you will be reading Leon Battista Alberti before you know it>
Cheers

[dale]

It is not hard to see the major progress that, in particular, the introduction of new materials and technology, has allowed the field of design, in all it's aspects, to make.
Then:

Now:

But some of the most innovative have adopted a new future.
My interest was piqued after seeing the lamp Marcus designed and then followed through by having 3D printed. http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?p=384833#p384833

I stumbled upon the company "Freedom of Creation". I can't help but think that the developing technologies around 3D printing are going to have as big an impact on the design of products and the way they are manufactured and marketed as those PDA's we all rely on have had on our lives.
From Cad...
To Product...

And here is something they are working on at the moment. 3 Dimensional Fabric.
If you are a talented modeler, or a creative designer, I can't help feel your future is bright.

[dale]

And this is where it leads.

[dale]

More research into Digital Prototyping lead me to the website of Scott Eaton.
I was intrigued by this little guy, his ipod docking station.

His education which includes a Masters from MIT Media Lab, and also traditional studies at the Florence Academy of Art, have certainly combined to bring about some interesting career choices, including work with Steven Spielberg, and on the Harry Potter films.
What may be of real interest to some on this Forum, are his Tutorials. http://www.scott-eaton.com/tutorials
Much on sculpting (digitally) the human form, mostly in ZBrush.
And should you really wish to up the anti, he is offering an online course in figure sculpture starting in April. http://www.scott-eaton.com/digital-figure-sculpture

[mitcorb]

Hi, dale:
I am still following your excellent thread. Keep up the good work.

[simon le bon]

Dear Dale,

Let me prefer the first one

Concerning Alberti, Leo Battista (1404-1472)
This link, especially for collectors:

De re ædificatoria libri decem

and these interesting articles about him (in french I'm sorry)
http://architectura.cesr.univ-tours.fr/traite/Images/ENSBA208/B_751062305_20_0001.jpg
Lire Alberti aujourd'hui

simon

PS: Thank you for the sculpture turorials +++

[dale]

Simon. You always seem to be able to find the most interesting online documents

This caught my attention:
A practical, but at the same time whimsical little light you could really have some fun with.
And it took me to http://northernlighting.no/our-products/ a Norwegian Lighting company.
More whimsy:
But then the Pièce de résistance.
Does that not just make your day

[simon le bon]

Hi Dale,

Do you think "A VINTAGE SEQUENCE" would be interesting?

simon

[dale]

And we are off.....
I was just thinking that there are probably many forum members who have never actually used a rotary phone
Or sat transfixed by this...

But because this is a thread on fine design, here are some vintage sweethearts. Bowden Spacelander Bicycle – Designed by Ben Bowden – 1946; Manufactured 1960

The Kit Kat Clock (Eyes and Tail move) 1932 by the California Clock Company

Please feel free to contribute

[david_h]

I'm in . . .

The first car I remember riding in. . .my parents owned a 1959 Studebaker Lark. It was even this color.

Awesome car.

---

[dale]

My Uncle had one of these. It was Pink and Grey, and your right, it was awesome.

[simon le bon]

Fine Design Spans Eras
Nice Bicycle, Nice car

A little bumpy but anyway,
here a Maserati Indy (personal phone picts)
(all Maserati)

simon

[dale]

I've always wanted a Maserati. A tool to lose your license with

Richard Neutra
Kaufman House 1946

Haus Rentsch 1964

Kramer House 1953

[dale]

Another Retro Beauty
Case Study House #22
Pierre Koenig

The link between the above photos is there were taken by the father of Architectural Photography
Julius Shulman
http://www.getty.edu/art/exhibitions/shulman/