[Help] Wooden floor in Bathroom??

Rich O Brien

Hi,

I've got solid French Oak flooring planned for an upstairs bathroom. Everywhere I look and ask it's either I'm crazy or it'll be fine. Has anyone here any advice on what I should do?

watkins

Dear Mad Irishman,

I would wood go for an engineered wood flooring rather than natural oak flooring. natural flooring would probably swell and buckle.

http://www.woodtrend.co.uk/s.nl/c.625444/it.I/id.5/.f?sc=10&category=1257

I have seen this happen at a friends house when the flooring was laid over a poorly constructed concrete slab floor. She has an engineered oak floor which looks great and is certainly more tolerant to humidity. Make sure that you leave nice big gaps at the edges which you can then cover with the skirting board.

Regards,
Bob

watkins

Dear Rich,

You might consider a bamboo floor. It is less likely to warp, and would like good.

http://www.bambooflooringdirect.co.uk/ourrange.htm

Regards,
Bob

Rich O Brien

Bob,

Your advice has been passed on to higher powers! But, in 2008 when the higher power returned home with 9sq/yds of solid French Oak for an upstairs bathroom and was told the dangers of implementing such an audacious crime on humanity this happened...

Now the thought of broaching the subject of Bamboo instills fear and dread

Here's the higher power's response to been told yesterday that the floor is not suitable...

Fill bucket with water
Place piece of floor in bucket(leave 12hrs)
Measure piece with ruler
Estimate total increase
Prove world wrong

I've 2 choices, either lay the floor or commit murder

TIG

Is it tongued & groove jointed ?
How 'thick' is it ?
Is it sawn / finished so that any grain 'cupping' is up or down ?
What is the sub-floor - timber boards ?
How is it fixed down - presumably 'secret-fixed' through tongue or 'floating' ?
If it's floating what is its 'underlay' ?
Floating it under perimeter trims to allow movement whilst robustly gluing the planks t&g together might be best ?
Otherwise how are its joints / ends sealed ?
What is it pre-finished / to_be_finished_in_situ with ?
Are the front/backs/ends fully sealed ?
How are its 'edges' protected from water ingress ?
How is the floor's perimeter finished off ?
How 'wet' might it actually get ?
How 'slippery' will it be when it gets wet ?

That all said... seems OK to me if laid properly...

Dave R

Rich,

I would agree with Bob. Engineered flooring would be a better option and bamboo would be more stable than oak. Is "French Oak" an engineered product?

If you seal the wood to prevent moisture getting in, make sure you put the same amount of sealer on the underside, edges and even the ends. Sealing only one face is a good way to ensure the wood will cup and warp.

Would you have room to use some other material on the floor just outside the shower/tub areas? Perhaps tile or stone?

Your reply to Bob came in while I was typing. In light of that new information, I would say, what the heck. Go lay the floor and make the "higher powers" happy.

Rich O Brien

Hi TIG,

Is it tongued & groove jointed ?
Yes
How 'thick' is it ?
3/4"
Is it sawn / finished so that any grain 'cupping' is up or down ?
Both, i think...
Picture 002.jpg
Picture 003.jpg
What is the sub-floor - timber boards ?
Picture 001.jpg
How is it fixed down - presumably 'secret-fixed' through tongue or 'floating' ?
Not fixed yet
What is it pre-finished / to_be_finished_in_situ with ?
Pre-finished
How are its 'edges' protected from water ingress ?
I don't know?
How is the floor's perimeter finished off ?
Skirting
How 'wet' might it actually get ?
Will be main upstairs bathroom with bath and shower
How 'slippery' will it be when it gets wet ?
Not bad as it's already installed downstairs in 2 rooms and there has been spillages

Any guidance is much appreciated as it cost for this stuff

watkins

Dear David,

Would you recommend a varnish or an oil for the wood?

Timber Floor Finishes: Types of Wooden Flooring Treatment

How to finish timber floors. Find out how and what you use when sealing, waxing, oiling, polishing & varnishing timber and parquet floors

DIY Doctor (www.diydoctor.org.uk)

I would also recommend placing a length of flooring in the bathroom for a month or two to see if the plank warps during that time. If it doesn't then it will probably be okay. In fact all the wood should be placed in the bathroom for at least two weeks prior to fitting so that the planks come into local equilibrium with the room's moisture levels. There is probably a formula to work out the time per unit thickness of wood.

Regards,
Bob

Rich O Brien

Who's David?

Have you revealed the TIG's name?

I thought this was sTIG?

watkins

Comment was addressed to Dave R as he's the woodworker in the SU family. Sorry for the confusion.

Regards,
Bob

Dave R

Dear Bob,

It appears that the flooring that Rich is using is prefinished. I would guess it has some sort of varnish on it.

I like the look of oiled wood but for a floor, varnish makes more sense. And for a bathroom or kitchen, I would think varnish would be the only practical choice. Varnish isn't a waterproofing finish but it will slow the migration of moisture into and out of the wood. Although water-based finishes are popular these days, I think and oil-based varnish would be appropriate for the application.

As I mentioned before, the wood should be sealed on all surfaces to prevent it from taking up moisture unevenly. Is the flooring prefinished on the bottom, edges and ends? If not, it would make sense to varnish those surfaces as well before laying the floor. Of course this isn't a recipe for getting the floor down quickly. In the long run, however, it is likely to involve less time than periodically repairing the floor.

Rich, would "the powers" consider my suggestion of using some other material around and under the tub?

TIG

Aaaargh! you have one of those stupid old-fashioned baths that lets the water slop out everywhere !

In the absence of a sensible 'travertine marble' floor solution...

The grain 'cupping' is both ways which means that planks that do warp will sag/bow unexpectedly !
Chances are it won't do too much if it's already dried out / seasoned and well protected when finished...

Lay the planks over a 3mm foam sheet with taped joints, with it turned up the wall by ~40mm.
Do not fix the planks to the 'chipboard' [?] sub-floor.
Make sure all edges are varnished - including the ends of any cut pieces OR the holes needed for pipes etc [these also need silicone sealing at the floor's top face].

Glued the planks together with external quality water-resistant adhesive, wiping off any excess immediately.
Use an off-cut / block / 'hook' to knock the planks tight together as they are laid.
Leave a ~10mm+ gap between the wall and the floor-planks' 'slab' - wedge it around all edges to keep the joints tight until it's all dried.
Next day remove the wedges and fix a skiting/trim over the gap - bed that onto a bead of silicone sealant at the floor.

Let's be sensible when using the room - gallons of warm soapy water pouring over it everyday are not going to help... clean up spills and put a mat or towel on the floor, pick it up and let it dry afterwards!

Rich O Brien

Completely missed Dave's reply while typing TIG's response

This is turning into Abbot and Costello's 'Who's on first?'

Anyway, tiling or stone under the bath is an option..

Bathroom II.jpg

The internal hasn't been erected yet but need it as shower won't fit between window and wall.Aaaaaahhhhhh

As for varnishing each edge. Aaaaaaahhh

Do not fix the plans to the 'chipboard' [?] sub-floor.
By plans, you mean planks? Should i take it up and put down marine board?

I think i'll tile it!

TIG

Planksit is... No need to 'fix' - just leave the timber floor floating over the main floor sheets...

PS: Many know my true name and don't use it - to do so reveals their remoteness from me...

Rich O Brien

Thanks for all the info anyway guys! Helped alot

dermotcoll

Hi Rich

Sorry for the late reply and bumping the thread again. I have been away recovering from a wee heart attack!! I have a lot of experience in laying floors of all types and TIG has provided some sterling advice (as usual, I might add). Just one thing to be careful of with this type of flooring if you are going to varnish / lacquer the tongue and groove edges is that you dont layer it on thick as it might interfere with the jpoint (ie prevent you from being able to put the tongue into the groove after it has been glued). This has happened to me in the past due to badly machined timber and it is a feckin nightmare - you have to get the glue completely cleaned off using a wet rag and then dried down.

Also whenyou are gluing the floor make sure you get a continuous bead of glue along the joint to form perfect seal agaist water ingress. If you don not get squeeze out along the full length of the plank then there is a gap into which water will go, especially in a bathroom.

Good luck.

Rich O Brien

Hi Dermot,

To be honest i kinda given up on the lovely oak floored bathroom and will go the tile route! Now to offload some flooring, or have one expensive bonfire?

watkins

Dear Dermot,

I hope you are fully recovered from your 'wee heart attack'. Presumably, you have been told to change your life style, which probably means less time in front of the screen. Good luck with your long-term recovery.

Kind regards,
Bob

Mike Lucey

Rich,

I laid solid oak flooring to all the floors in my house back about 17 years ago. The 1st floor bathroom and en-suite were done also laid on 19mm ply and secret nailed!

The advised you are getting is sound. I allowed a gap (about 3mm) every metre. Don't forget to install a good extractor fan over the shower,

Mike

Roger

There is a local restaurant here in Phoenix with Oak flooring except that the Oak is a very convincing ceramic tile. This does not lend itself to architectural purism, but it might please the higher power and avoid a rotting mess in the long run.