The Obama Deception - Number #1 in Google Video
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@solo said:
How would this new transparent, evil elite free utopia work?
I certainly hope it doesn't involve those less fortunate than me and mine dictating our situation.
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Right, my two cents;
I have looked into the origins of the phrase "Conspiracy theory". Calling the opposite point of view "a conspiracy theory" is a slur that may have started in the Nixon era, and we all know what a fine upstanding guy he turned out to be. It doesn't matter how much conflicting evidence there is, once the media brand something a conspiracy theory there is not much room left for any sensible debate. The conservative majority of the public won't want to align themselves with conspiracy theorists (because that sounds like it might involve a tinfoil hat or worse still, mean that you are supporting anarchists, terrorists, communists, hippies etc, etc).
When, if, the s**** hits the fans and everything is in broad daylight, these people will forget that they ever dismissed these topics as conspiracy theories. But either side could be wrong.On a positive note, as I think Solo is trying to point out, you can get all depressed and angry after listening to Alex Jones or you can decide to make some changes yourself and step off the path to a NWO. This shouldn't mean bloody revolution. It could mean growing your own food or sourcing locally manufactured or fair trade consumer goods. This takes alot of power away from the corporations and the politicians that they support.
IMO - feel free to pull it apart.
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@solo said:
How would this new transparent, evil elite free utopia work?
'evil elite free utopia' might be pushing the realistic possibilities and i'm willing to assume that advanced civilizations that have been around for a million+ years still have issues in this dept.
personally, i don't have an answer and i doubt it's even possible for anybody to have a real answer.. it's an organic process but we can control the nutrients to an extent..
imo- the vast majority of all of our problems can be traced directly back to money.
there are people out there that can buy an entire country if they so choose (and while it's basically impossible to buy a country in a standard type transaction, it definitely happens in a more camouflaged way). SERIOUSLY, why does anybody need to own a country.. what that translates to is if the money man would simply share his cash, everybody in ecuador would have a place to live (amongst many other things)... for free! Instead, that money man chooses to buy the country as an investment.. one way that can occur is by loaning the country say $200billion so that country can install a national power grid, infrastructure, buy weapons, etc.. now, that country owes moneyman 200billion PLUS interest (PLUS overinflated rates on electricity via moneyman's new dam) and it will never be repayable.. instead of sharing the money with the country and helping the people, the country is placed in debt and the citizens (who personally, very rarely see any of the "stimulus package") are now responsible for that debt.. they are the slaves that are attempting to repay the interest.. moneyman just bought people! not a fresh boatload of 25 africans -- 50million slaves at once...
(oh, and if said country won't allow this scam to happen, just go in and bomb them and/or assassinate the evil doers)now, i know it sounds crazy to suggest this type of sharing. is it really that crazy though? attn: parents (esp. parents of two or more) -- Mine! Mine! you've all heard it .. we see it on a weekly basis in our children.. for this reason, i believe a basic form of greed in programmed into us.. it's an instinct but we also have a consciousness that has the ability to override this urge.. when one of my daughters gets into a MINE mood, i witness first hand the type of destruction it causes.. i'm left with crying kids.. mad kids etc.. from an outside point of view, i can fully see a better situation if the Mine!mood didn't occur.. they'd both be playing with said object, both would be in a better mood and generally enjoying each other's company..
i'd be willing to bet that everyone here knows that type of situation and everyone here would try to squelch the situation and/or encourage the child to share (or maybe even discipline the child for not sharing).. there are a few reasons why we want to shut down that type of behavior.. one, it's plain ol' bad manners but we also know everyone involved will be better off if the situation hadn't occurred (including US!).. why then, should this type of decent behavior not be encouraged in adults?
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@linea said:
This shouldn't mean bloody revolution. It could mean growing your own food or sourcing locally manufactured or fair trade consumer goods. This takes alot of power away from the corporations and the politicians that they support.
or setting up our own energy system.. that sounds like an ok start to me..
if everyone would pull their heads out of their asses we would realize that the only reason these absurdly rich people have their money is because of us.. all we have to do is quit buying into the bulls#$t and take some things into our own hands...
there are clean, viable, renewable energy sources surrounding us on a daily basis.. tidal, wind, & solar alone could power the entire planet but the big dog is geothermal. there's an estimated 5000 years worth of harvestable geothermal energy available to us right now (and it's renewable so in theory, it's an infinite amount of electricity).. but no, let's stick with oil!!
if we (the u.s.) set up windfarms in only three states, we would have enough electricity to power the country..
why don't we invest in ourselves? i'd be willing to give $5000 towards building our own power source.. if everyone in america did the same, we'd be well on our way to having our own, free energy source.. (ok, we're in a highly monetary society so it's not necessarily 'free' but it's a one time payment.. i spend ~$2500 per year for electricity so i'll gladly pay a few years worth of payments when the tradeoff will be no more electricity bills in a few years.. free energy for my children, grandchildren, and on).. -
@tomsdesk said:
@solo said:
How would this new transparent, evil elite free utopia work?
I certainly hope it doesn't involve those less fortunate than me and mine dictating our situation.
well, i guess 'fortunate' is an ok word here.. very, and i mean very few people even come close to having the opportunity to become filthy rich.. the idea of the american dream is mainly a hoax.. you are born into that world.. it's bloodlines..
more than half the population on earth are harder workers than these people and i bet quite a big chunk are more intelligent as well.. where's all of their cash at?these 'fortunate' people that you're putting your faith in aren't good people for the most part.. they are con men to the max.. very polished and their scams pull in tons of cash.. it's cool that you look up to them but really, how do you think they feel about you and/or your survival?
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@unknownuser said:
if we (the u.s.) set up windfarms in only three states, we would have enough electricity to power the country.
have you got a source for that? Its a very interesting claim and id like to read in to it a bit more.
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@unknownuser said:
if we (the u.s.) set up windfarms in only three states, we would have enough electricity to power the country.
The quotation comes from the Zeitgeist Addendum, at least it was mentioned there. I am not a fan of windfarms, mainly because of noise and impact on a landscape, but solar energy would be an option.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article5887597.ece
Of course it would require a serious investment. 'The Times' shows a solar power plant in the Mojave Desert as an example. -
Yeah I read that article about erecting windfarms in the Sahara to supply the entire Europe with cheap renewable energy, I think it's a great idea but!......
Which multinational company will own that? Are these new power suppliers gonna be transparent and non manipulating?, We may reduce our dependancy of fossil fuels from 'terrorist states' (not my coined wording) but anyone notice that the Sahara is also in the 'Axis of evil' (another Bush phrase) territory?
Not to mention the obvious, African acquired power to supply Europe, wtf!?, is Africa not the poorest continent? do they not need this cheap resource more than first world Europe?Don't get me wrong, I would love to see us getting away from fossil fuels, I agree that areas like Nevada, Arizona and even Texas would be great to harness sun energy, the Texas pan-handle would even be fantastic for wind turbines. I am just concerned about trading our current slave masters for a new bunch of even worse ones.
Energy is only a small part of the problem, look at world food shortages, clean drinkable water, these are the new sectors of real concern that face our future, and these are the issues that will impact humanity the greatest. Now is the time to deal with this.
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@solo said:
I am just concerned about trading our current slave masters for a new bunch of even worse ones.
The solution would be to have a solar panel being able to convert\store enough energy sufficient for a single dwelling, even in a country with very little direct sunlight as Ireland. In theory there is an option already available, which I have quoted in a thread related to clean energy sources, but as far as I know, it has not been verified\debunked yet (Magnacoaster amplifier).
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@unknownuser said:
The solution would be to have a solar panel being able to convert\store enough energy sufficient for a single dwelling
Great solution on paper, I guess we would need to understand that only home owners will benefit from this leaving a large chunk of less fortunate people stuck on the grid, and now paying higher prices for the same usage, as the power companies still need to make a profit even with a dwindling market.
Here is a graphic of home ownership in the USA, see the ethnic and racial divide this will cause?
edit: I forgot about the recent home foreclosures, these numbers will be much lower thanks to the burst property bubble, and the fact that these people who have foreclosed homes will probably not be elegible to purchase properties again for a while, at least until the judgements occured dissapears.
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Its also worth noting that a system where everyone had their own power source could be very inefficient, as any home system would have to have a large power output to account for any chance of a sudden increase in demand (turning the kettle on, for example.) This means that a lot of the time your going to be wasting a lot of power.
Compare this with a national grid type system where power is distributed where it is needed, thus you got a lot less wastage.
I suppose the ideal here would be a combination the 2, so everyone has enough power generating capacity for, say, 2/3rds of their peak usage and are connected up to the national grid, so when theyre not using all the power being generated it goes in to the national grid so people who need more can use it.
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@juanv.soler said:
Homo homini lupus est
That is exactly the point. That is what they haved teached us. That is what the power wants.
But it is not.
And that is what we have to learn. We are so slaved to everything that we forget we can look at each other in another way. A much better way.Hello everybody, back again.
Welcome back Jaun
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@remus said:
@unknownuser said:
if we (the u.s.) set up windfarms in only three states, we would have enough electricity to power the country.
have you got a source for that? Its a very interesting claim and id like to read in to it a bit more.
Jacque Fresco and the venus project via zeitgeist addendum. According to them, the figure comes directly from the u.s. dept. of energy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KyA9dPcM7g
~3 minutes into that video is where it's mentioned.after a quick search for their actual source, i can only find a figure of 20% plastered everywhere which coincides with tboone pickens 'plan'
http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/science/07/08/pickens.plan/index.htmli'll try to locate the actual report by the u.s. dept of energy with the 3 states claim.
@solo said:
Which multinational company will own that?
my suggestion is that we the people own it. we research it and fund it.
if it's a traditional mega-millionaire style corporation, the money problem will still exist..my point about mentioning a new power system was less to do with making a green environment and more to do with fixing the major flaw in our societies.. the problem of greed.
@unknownuser said:
Energy is only a small part of the problem, look at world food shortages, clean drinkable water, these are the new sectors of real concern that face our future, and these are the issues that will impact humanity the greatest. Now is the time to deal with this.
thing is, there is enough food on our planet right now to healthily feed every single person on our planet.. famine in our modern world isn't a result of drought or lack of animals in the area, it's a result of greed.. again, imo, nearly all (90%?) of the world's problems are money/greed related.
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Thanks
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@unknownuser said:
these 'fortunate' people that you're putting your faith in aren't good people for the most part.. they are con men to the max.. very polished and their scams pull in tons of cash.. it's cool that you look up to them but really, how do you think they feel about you and/or your survival?
Nonononono...me and mine are the fortunate ones I was refering to: I put my faith in none of those greedy bastards doing the deciding now. Just saying we'd all be living pretty poorly if those who have nothing now were suddenly (after the revolution) deciding the standards of living for all of us.
But it won't get that far: the stupid of the greedy elite will be quieted or culled, the greedy serfs (middleclass) will be put back in their place, and the saga will continue...as you say, for the most part born into our station.
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Unless we humans evolve a little further and rid ourselves of our 'Greed' gene, there will always be a yearning for absolute power, absolute wealth and absolute control, it's in our nature.
Even if we create rules and laws to protect us from such trappings, in time the rules will be amended and challenged by greedy and controlling individuals.Jeff my question about ownership was in regard to the Sahara solar panels, we the people do not factor, as the article says, they are looking for large dollar investors right now, loosely translated to big business.
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@tomsdesk said:
Nonononono...me and mine are the fortunate ones I was refering to: I put my faith in none of those greedy bastards doing the deciding now. Just saying we'd all be living pretty poorly if those who have nothing now were suddenly (after the revolution) deciding the standards of living for all of us.
But it won't get that far: the stupid of the greedy elite will be quieted or culled, the greedy serfs (middleclass) will be put back in their place, and the saga will continue...as you say, for the most part born into our station.
oh, ok.. i fully misread what you were getting at.. (that's another one of our problems - miscommunication)
@unknownuser said:
(after the revolution)
a revolution does need to occur. however, that revolution can't be like all of those in the past which basically will only shift control to a different group of power mongers.. the revolution needs to occur in our brains.. science has brought us to a point where our basic survival no longer needs to be a worry. we are poised for the next level of consciousness.. i doubt i'll see the full change in my lifetime but i do recognize the need and i'll attempt to contribute my miniscule thoughts towards bettering future generations.
“We will see how very important it is to bring about, in the human mind, the radical revolution. The crisis is a crisis in consciousness. A crisis that cannot, anymore, accept the old norms, the old patterns, the ancient traditions. And, considering what the world is now, with all the misery, conflict, destructive brutality, aggression, and so on… Man is still as he was. Is still brutal, violent, aggressive, acquisitive, competitive. And, he’s built a society along these lines.” - J. Krishnamurti
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@solo said:
Unless we humans evolve a little further and rid ourselves of our 'Greed' gene, there will always be a yearning for absolute power, absolute wealth and absolute control, it's in our nature.
Even if we create rules and laws to protect us from such trappings, in time the rules will be amended and challenged by greedy and controlling individuals.yes, i fully agree with you.
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..... I'm following this thread as best I can and it looks now like we are discussing 'actions' / revolution / get of your arse and do something sort of things. I'm all for that BUT the question is what to do.
Well, here in Ireland we will have a chance to say 'Feck Off' to the New World Order by voting NO for the Lisbon Treaty. Heck! these EU power brokers are so pushy that they are forcing us the say (vote) NO again. Of course they want a YES vote this time.
We gave them their answer last year but they are not accepting it and we will be looking at a new referendum in a couple of month time. Is this democracy?
This link is an 'Address' by European Commission Vice-President Margot Wallström http://ec.europa.eu/ireland/press_office/speeches-press_releases/wallstromregauthspeech_en.htm Lots of Blah, blah, blah BUT does not explain the KEY POINTS!
This link is to some Irish guy in his car telling it like he sees it, The Lisbon Treaty in a nutshell http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqN4GkGWVEk Now, I can understand the KEY POINTS!
I know what I will be voting AND I think this could be regarded as a revolt! There are only 4 million of us here in Ireland but we are able to say 'Feck Off' out loud when needed
In 1916 we started the breakup of the tyrannical British Empire Mike
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Coen, do you realise how incredibly patronising "Finally you're getting it." actually sounds?
No, I'm not getting it...I've always got it. There are bad and misguided people in the world who through sheer evil, or more often lack of consideration for others or all of the relevant factors, manage do bad things....including usurping powers they have no right to. We even have a phrase for the latter: "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions."What I don't do is get all worked up about it like some teenager discovering sex for the first time, utterly convinced that no one else in the entire history of mankind has ever 'discovered' this before.
Liberty requires vigilance, it doesn't require paranoia. (That US Bill doesn't even mean the end of commercial organic farming in the US, much less an end to growing food for your own consumption...although it is clearly a case of Monsanto flexing its muscles; and it is still perfectly legal to photograph policemen in the UK...just not when they are on anti-terrorist stake-outs. Hyperbole never helps anyone's case.)
As for what I tell my children...nothing. There is a difference between telling and discussing. They are old enough, intelligent enough and mature enough to weigh the evidence for themselves and come to the appropriate conclusions without any prepping from me.
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