I believe (part two...
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I like the Raja parable. Thanks Juan for the quotation. I am wondering where is it coming from? India? The wisdom comes from listening. Same as faith.
Talking about the Elephant... I would like to write few words about my experience of Him.
I can't say I know him and that I know how he really is, but what I have experienced it describes Him in general.
In other words I won't say that he is a column, because I haven't touched his leg, but I know that he is big, because he passed in front of me with high speed and I have almost fallen down.
Therefore I can say his size is huge.It was almost 20 years ago and it was not in reality, but only in a dream. I don't remember my dream from the beginning if there was such. I just remember that I has been taken out from the Earth high up. The blue plannet was getting smaller and smaller and surrounding was getting brighter and brighter. I have had a gradually increasing feeling that all my problems, all problems of the Earth are not that important and not that scary. I have started to worry about my parents and all loved one I had left on the planet, but that feeling has vanished as well. Its place has been taken by growing peace and I realized I hear an choir somewhere singing just one waving sound and noticed that the light is very bright then ... it has hit me. The feeling of LOVE AND PEACE I cannot describe in words. It was so immense, so powerful that I haven't even thought about a fear. It was the peace Jesus has said that the World cannot give. 100% of peace, undisturbed by the smallest pain, smallest worry - nothing. Perfect safety in father arms. The most powerful and the most loving Father ever. I has woken up. It has been a morning. I have known something has changed deep, deep in me. The World was the same.
@unknownuser said:
So what prompts you to make the statement ?God is Love?? How do you know? Where are you getting your information from? What is the ?It? you are referring to?
It is my source. My ?it?.
I have hope that someone will share his experience of our Father. I know that Buddhists experience Nothing, American Indians were meeting the Great Spirit. I intended to post my testimony somewhere else, on more 'appropriate' forum, but we have the corner bar here and the interesting thread.
So share your experiences, not quotes, please. I am really curious. Maybe we will get better view of our Elephant.
Cheers
Tomasz -
lol. Lucky you. My cats are spiteful little bstrds.
As is the Jaweh I remember from, errr, 'bible class'. Scared the hell out of me as a kid. I wasn't religious even back then, but still.In any case. Question for you religious folks out there (you know I love you, right?
). Whenever we vile atheists mock you guys, y'all get mighty upset. Oh, you do. "How dare you tread upon the very thing that's dearest to us?" And then you guys start saying how we hurt your feelings, and how we should understand this, and understand that, and so on.But ... errr ... dunno ... Ain't that a bit weird? Because, you know, aren't you the very same peeps who believe the likes of us will be and should be tortured in hell for all eternity? Eh?
Double standards - that's the phrase that comes to mind, isn't it?
Boys?
Hm?
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@unknownuser said:
@unknownuser said:
"Love is ...
I believe my cat is very close to being god...at least as described above.
You are happy man, modelhead!
You both have eyes, but do not see. You both heave ears, but do not hear.
Many have broken their teeth on Old Testament. Start with the New and do not fear to listen to your heart, not only to your mind.
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@unknownuser said:
@unknownuser said:
I believe my cat is very close to being god...at least as described above.
But given the chance I bet your cat would kill and eat a mouse
Stinkie, it is very difficult to have a religious discussion without toes being stepped on. That said... am I upset? No. Do I believe the likes of you should go to hell, not at all. Furthermore it is not my (or any Christian's) right to judge anyone; that is left up to God himself. I agree it is difficult to express one's view, especially a religious one, without sounding judgmental. And there are some who feel it is their right to judge, but it is not. I have accepted the gift God has offered and only want to share it with others.
I heard a good one this week... Atheism: A non Prophet organization.
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Tomasz,
Ok, I will be patient.
and I think I understand you.stinkie,
that is not true. We dont get upset when you mock at us, the well_known believers, saying that our *** is non_existent, it is you who gets upset when we tell you that your God you are talking about has nothing to do with oursBoofredlay,
and now Boo, dont escape.
Tell us where you hide those writings.
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@unknownuser said:
Furthermore it is not my (or any Christian's) right to judge anyone; that is left up to God himself.
Fair enough ... as in my view that means I can pretty much do anything!
Not that I would. Morals. Ugh. 
Yah ... it is fairly hard to discuss this sort of thing without offending anyone. I remember really mild jokes being made about Christ being a goalie for Nazareth United, or something along those lines, and someone reacting upset. That was what I was referring to. I remember thinking: you kidding? You think I deserve hell, but you can't take this kind of soft mockery? Come on!
That said, this is a subject I get riled up over pretty fast myself.
Frankly - and I'm not trying to insult anyone - I find it absolutely strange that the Almighty still plays such a large role in the lives of so many. Imagine this: half the world believes the Easter Bunny is real, and you don't.
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Which brings me to an observation...
I try not get involved in such debates/ discussions as there can never be a winner or loser as even with archeological proof of artifacts dating beyond six thousand years many fundamentally dogmatic believers refuse to acknowledge their existence.However on arriving in Texas almost nine years ago I was amazed how fundamental and commercial religion was south of the Mason Dixon, how shallow the members of such ‘clans’ were.
But what I never could understand and yet to get an answer on was the first Christmas in Dallas my then girlfriend suggested that we attend the local Baptist church. Now this was no normal church in my opinion as it was more like ‘six flags over Jesus’ (a theme park) it had a Starbucks in it, three restaurants, many shopping stores, a gym, sports facilities, a theatre, etc (list goes on) I noticed in the main foyer a guy dressed in a Santa suit giving kids gifts and the interior of the church decorated with many symbols of the red dressed idol.
On asking the question of why is Santa represented as a symbol of Christmas to young kids when the real message is the birth of Jesus the answer I got ranged from tradition to bringing joy to kids that are too young to understand the truth.
Is this not a false god? If indeed the kids are too young to understand then why lie to them?
How disappointing it must be to a kid to reach the ‘age of understanding’ and be told by the folk they are now to believe about ‘the truth’ are the same people who lied to them about the Jolly Red giant.I see the same bunch are getting ready for Halloween soon, I wonder how they explain this one to the kids.
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good point, solo
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You make a good point Pete.
Well I for one don’t ever recall seeing anyone dressed as Santa at my church or any I went to growing up. Not to say it does not happen, you saw it. I have to say however I am guilty of the “Santa Game” with my daughter. But we have ALWAYS taught her the real reason for Christmas first and foremost; Santa is just a secondary thing. I never dress up or make a big deal, just a few presents under the tree.
Growing up I always wondered why Santa wrote just like my father After realizing there was no Santa Clause it actually had more meaning to me that my parents were “Santa”. (For what that is worth)As for Halloween, we actually go to church. We have “Trunk or Treat”. Church members park their cars and hand out candy. There are games and a Bible lessons as well, reminding the kids of God’s love and not of some un-holy holiday. We really don’t make a big deal of it at all.
Your post reminded me of a picture I found a while back too… I laugh every time I see this.
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JuanV; I find your replies quite difficult to understand and don’t know half the time if you are trying to make a joke or not. Also, I remember reading that you did not require an answer to your previous question but since I pissed you off…
@juanv.soler said:
Could you please elaborate ? :...the writings you ask for can be found in the book of Acts. 1:1-9 and 2:1-13.
i dont seem to find them.
Thank you.
if you want it, of course.They are in the Bible, towards the back.
This was the moment of Pentecost, when God sent the Holy Spirit to dwell in us, thus his communication changed.In response to my statement saying that Judgment is left up to God himself:
@juanv.soler said:
Boofredlay,
and now Boo, dont escape.
Tell us where you hide those writings.
Read Jesus’ words in John 5: 28-30
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thankyou Boo
now I understand you better. -
Boo,
You say :
Well, I believe the Bible is the word of God. You guys keep saying the Bible is nonsense. Well the writings and “saviors of science” you guys keep quoting don’t even seem to agree with each other. I get my morals and direction from the Bible that was inspired by God, written down by man and translated into different languages for the betterment of mankind, yes by man. But I also trust the wisdom of those who translated the Bible, voted on which books were to be in the Cannon and who undoubtedly prayed to God at length about which directions and actions to take; seeking God’s guidance rather than man’s.
So that means you have got the TRUE_REAL BIBLE
You say :
Someone here made the argument that God does not speak to his people like in Old Testament times. True, he speaks to us now in a different way. When Jesus came he “sealed the deal”. Then God changed his communication methods. Now it is through his word (Bible), through the Holy Spirit and through prayer, people and circumstances.
WICH WAY ?
IF GOD CHANGED HIS COMMUNICATIONS METHODS, WHERE ARE THERE WRITTEN HIS NEW METHODS ?
You say :
I am a Father, a Son and Husband; three “personalities” of the same person. I believe in a one true living God who is the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Call it what you will, I call it the Trinity.?Yes Boo, but you are not God are you ?We have been just having fun about the three_two_one game. Just read a bit up above the thread and you´ll join us.
if you want it, of course. -
Solo,
That Baptist church from Dallas is like the church of the Laodiceans:
“Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked..”
(Revelation 3:17)
Be patient…!
“The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.”
(Ecclesiastes 1:9 )
Cornel
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and, as this is the I believe (part two...
lets put this thread above and stop messing around Cornel.
you dont get the game yet.
Have you ?
Come back after new holidays,
or stay around without showing.But, the next time come naked, alone and with no books.
Yes
that is my thought. -
Regarding Raja’s parabola(mentioned a few times), it is a children’s story but which is believed by many naïve adults.
Blind men lack sight but God gives them compensating sharp senses. Though a blind man only touches part of an elephant, he feels the proximity/existence of the whole entity. A blind man perceives things differently than a ‘normal’ man blindfolded. Some people, blindfolded, think that God is what they imagine.
According to the Bible, “faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.” (Romans 10:17) In the Bible we have a complete image/description of God. Raja’s method was by trial and error and by mockery. Keeping our eyes open and reading the whole Bible, we see God in all his fullness.
Cornel
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Cornel, that story is a metaphor for the fool-hardiness of looking at things from a single point of view...it was meant for people like you.
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...Improper 'story', Tom!
Cornel -
@unknownuser said:
Perhaps the words of John Lenin can help. LET IT BE. Know it? Check it out. Relates perfectly to your desperate search.
GoDThe song "Let it Be" was written by Paul McCartney, no? And it's "Lennon" not "Lenin", unless you are trying to equate the singer to the communist leader.
I don't know how that song can be considered a call to stop the search for deeper meaning.
I have come to the conclusion that we apply meaning to what we do and experience. That is the way of humans. "Is this all there is?" is not about denying the reality of our experience but about who we are. Many of us live a soft life distracted by entertainments and business, but life overall is hard and brutal. Suffering is all around us. Can we make our time here meaningful? Do we just want to survive, exist for a while, and rot? My dog wags his tail. Hasn't a worry. That's good for him. Not enough for me. I have to worry about meaning for some reason.
That's why people seek. Most find solace in helping others.
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Re.: 'Let it be':
“When I find myself in times of trouble”…
…M.M. cannot be “standing right it front of me,
speaking words of wisdom” …
since she died.Without “desperate search”, I'm patient…
because “there will be an answer”:
"But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be added to you. So do not worry about tomorrow; for tomorrow will care for itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.” (Matthew 6:33-34) -
That is much better Cornel.
still, if you can be able to avoid the quotes of your Bible and write them with your own words, well, that would be perfect.
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