MAC questions (SU related)
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Yep, I think I may pick that up too so that I can start playing around with it. I have heard and read great things about it not to mention, like you said, you can not beat the price. I heard the new update recently really makes it a strong contender.
Scott
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@unknownuser said:
Modo302 has a nice rendering engine but the material editor is a goat rodeo.
lol! Ah, the Shader Tree ...
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Yea, LOVE modo but the damn shader tree is enough to make to crazy. I do not understand with everyone (MAX, C4D, etc) all using somewhat the same design for a material editor that Modo would do things SO differently. Hopefully either they will change it or I will learn it well.
Scott
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@seadog00 said:
i'm going to interject here hoping to get some answers. i'm running SU through parallels and i'm having the issue where the 'snap points' (if that's what you call them), and drag arrows don't show up. for example when using the tape measure tool. wouldn't think that that would be annoying but it really is comforting to see a corner light up when you're drawing a line from it.
is this an video card issue? nvidia geforce 8800gt under the hood.seadog,
i have the same issue with parallels but only as the file gets bigger. too bad their support is so crappy.
i wonder if this is a graphics card issue. my macbook pro came with the nvidia 8600M GT card. because of that i have installed vmware fusion. so far the problem has not arisen.
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Great to know. I think after all I have read Fusion is the way to go thus far.
Scott
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Edson,
unfortunately, my file isn't even that big. but it's good to know that it's not my eyes that are failing. I'm getting the impression through the fora that fusion is more stable. I'm going to have to give that a try.
thanks for the input.
Wait. so according to the SU website, it says under the MAC hardware and software req, "Neither Boot Camp nor Parallels are supported environments." What's that supposed to mean? And why is sketchup so weird in Leopard. because that would solve this issue immediately. -
@seadog00 said:
Edson,
according to the SU website, it says under the MAC hardware and software req, "Neither Boot Camp nor Parallels are supported environments." What's that supposed to mean? And why is sketchup so weird in Leopard. because that would solve this issue immediately.this is total news to me. perhaps it explains why we are having these problems. however, one hears about lots of people who run SU under those two unsupported apps. go figure that.
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I read that too. I'm not experiencing any problems, though.
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i can't see any of the green 'buttons' on the scale tool. that's it. i'm done with parallels.
movin' to fusion.
and if that gives me grief, i balk at the notion of migrating everything to pc, for the sake of architecture. -
As an FYI, Rhino on MacOS is in process. The current beta version is quite good but as yet incomplete.
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running an OpenGL based 3D modeller in an emulation like Parallels or VMware is never a good idea, at least performance wise...
...don't underestimate the hardware requirements of SU, it's not a paint or office but a CAx application and thus simply needs performance-oriented and compatbile hardware.
Running SU with e.g. shared graphics "accelerators" like the Intel GMA series or gaming cards like the ATI Radeon series (under Win) is surely no good idea and will result in the known and regularly claimed display output glitches.
hth,
Norbert -
Norbert,
I understand that running any app in emulation is not good but with enough RAM it should not be an issue. I will be running 32GB so I will probably designate 8gb to the PC side (64bit Vista ultimate) and 24gb to the MAC side. That should be more then enough.
As far as a graphics card, I contacted Apple and will be having the system built with (2) 8800gt's. I wanted 3 but due to power draw on those cards I can only run (2) since they pull power off the motherboard.
Thanks for your input and help.
Scott
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@unknownuser said:
I understand that running any app in emulation is not good but with enough RAM it should not be an issue. I will be running 32GB so I will probably designate 8gb to the PC side (64bit Vista ultimate) and 24gb to the MAC side. That should be more then enough.
having enough RAM (32GB seems to be expensive overkill anyhow) is a requirement but obviosuly not sufficient, actually running a 2D application in an emulation is regularly no problem whereas routing the 3D screen output of an OpenGL based application through the video subsystem of the emulator as well as the hosting operating system might not be that easy and may result in a significant speed decrease as well as display problems.
another thing not recommendable is using a 'fresh' operating system like Vista especially if a reliable OGL support of the used video card resp. video driver is required. Being aware of this, currently XP Pro as 32-Bit version is the best choice for getting video drivers with mature OGL support even not being able to address more than ~3,x GB of RAM.
@unknownuser said:
...I wanted 3...
probably overkill too and probably doesn't help really in the sense of stability and speed, better invest in a mid-range nVidia Quadro FX and put the rest of the money in the fastest CPU you can get. Fastest in the sense of clock frequency.. SU does currently not make use of multiple kernels.
htc,
Norbert -
Norbert,
I understand what you are saying and I have spent alot of time making sure apps will run the way I need them to. Only running XP 32bit seems a bit silly as I will have all this addressable RAM and only using 3gb, hence the reason we will be running a 64bit OS. That all being said this is what we ordered asa far as apps go:
Sketchup (PC based only so I can run Vray for Sketchup)
Vray (PC based)
Modo302 (MAC) still waiting for thr Sketchup plugin to be released.
CS3 Master collection (wont use all of it right now but will dive into much of it later. We will be using photoshop, illustrator, and premiere right away).
Fusion VMware to handle PC apps and Vista ultimate OS.
Cheetah (MAC)
AutoCAD 2009 (we need this to work with the designers who are only PC based)
Also a few small MAC based apps that were fairly minor in price.
Wacom Cintiq 20WSXComputer:
See build sheet
We added another 8800 that does not show on the build but will be installed by apple prior to shipping.I want to thank everyone for their input and help with all my questions. Once I get this beast up and running I will take some pics.
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Scott,
simply buying the most expensive hardware components available doesn't mean to have an appropriate, balanced system for your needs but having much money.
2 quad cores (= 8 kernels) and 32gb do most of your mentioned apps not help at all, because probably most of them are not multi-threaded and cannot access more than roughly 2gb working memory anyhow. So most of the time greater parts of kernels are idling and consuming a lot of current and thus producing a lot of heat/noise.
The system you are describing is surely pretty good running a 64-bit server OS with 64-bit business database apps but not surely overkill for the mentioned purpose.
Choosing an OS based on the installed RAM is maybe the wrong way too, choosing an OS based on the requirements of the needed tools and applications should be the way. Knowing this and knowing that Vista and the currently available video drivers do show a lot of glitches using OpenGL based applications as e.g. SU, Shark and even AC, WinXPpro (32-bit) is currently the best choice at least of professionals in this area. If 3D modelling s only some minor use you can of course ignore this and hope, that time will bring some useable video drivers for Vista.
Two 8800 are good in the sense of throughput of vertices/triangels but surely inferior to a Quadro FX if quality of OGL support is relevant whereas much more expensive of course... hey, that's what you are seeking for, why not having two of them
hth,
Norbert -
Norbert,
Modo302 does support multicore procs but is not 64bit. We are buying this system this way with the understanding it will support the future of 64bit apps. I do not want to have to buy another system later or and OS that I could have purchased now.
As far as running (2) quadro cards the MAC Pro will not support the power draw from 2 (per apple support). Plus they are too expensive for little gain over the 8800. Yes 1.5 gb video is cool but few apps will push 1.5gb out of it. I currently have a 768mb Quadro card in a dell workstation and most of the time it sits almost idle. Too much cost for very little gain.
While some may see the system as overkill I see it as an investment. Video editing and rendering are still very taxing on any system and as time goes on and software becomes bigger, stronger, faster.....I want a system to support it without having to go to purchasing to ask for money to upgrade once again.
Hopefully you understand this is not seen by us as waste but an overall investment in the future.
Scott
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Why don't you use 3Ds MAX with Vray (I know it is expensive) via boot camp (I would prefer XP, not vista). You can model on SU then render on Max. You can control the environment a lot better than any program I guess. Alternatively C4D with Vray or Maya with V-ray can be used. On windows Rhino also have Vray. I have not used it before but some people say that Modo 302 native renderer is very good (3D painting is excellent by the way).
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