Lets get this forum Organised!
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In my previous post I wasn’t trying to be sarcastic. Just wanting to point out (in irony) the irony of Stu’s first post. Having said that I’m for an SCF with not too many (sub-)forums to be able to ‘not miss any relevant new posts’. Right now with the constant changes I sometimes find it rather confusing. But I’m not complaining, just being patient and I’m with Phil, we owe these guys (creating, moderating etc. SCF) a lot. I can imagine there is quite some effort and energy put into it. Give it some time… and good criticism/feed back.
Wo3Dan
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Phil,
A good point and one I was about to make...the guys organising this forum have done an invaluable job and I would much rather have more than I need, rather than nothing at all
And like Juan, I do miss the the old SU forum which, at its peak, had a vitality and a slightly out of control chaos that is just impossible to reproduce. And at its best I think it had 3 or 4 sections, in all. Towards the end though it was starting to get,IMO, somewhat boring and bloated...so there is no going back.
But I certainly am finding it tiresome trying to navigate this forum at the moment and in the end just get sick of all the clicks on this sub-forum or that.
Stu
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Well, I too was agreeing with the idea of limiting the proliferation of sub-forums...not with any (mis)interpreted criticism of our generous host and helpers.
Personally, I'd rather have a language translator than separate language forums...much rather! I believe this is the time in time to limit segregation, even (especially?) self-imposed, as much as possible...we come together so well, why split up for any reason.
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Interesting views and well, honestly speaking, everybody is right. Just a few remarks;
@Wodan (but in fact everyone):
Yes, you can tell that there are too many forums to browse through. But in reality, what makes the number of forums so high? Let's see the "Main" forum; SU & LO. Yes, we did create a "Newbie" forum deliberately to encourage newbies to post there. I still remember when I first started to visit the Pro forums and only lurked around without posting. This is now solved here and I'm sure you understand the importance of this since you visit and post at the two Google forums quite a lot as well.Well, LayOut is quite new and it has a forum now already over the GGroups.
Speaking of the Google forums: There is the "How-to" section there (maybe now renamed at the free forums). That was created with the intention of posting tutorials. Not questions like in the main forum. Now we have a tutorial section which we try to keep "clean" of irrelevant discussions and why would it bother anyone that a tutorial section, which is basically a "depot" of information (like a library), is organised so that those who are looking for something can easily find it? Alan, Chris, Ross, Tom; you have all those wonderful tuts over there in a once closed forum. It's almost impossible to mine them out and thanks for letting me transfer them over her where you will be able to find them!
The same with the plugins. In the old forums there was/is only the GIS section. Why only? There are lotes of plugins and if someone is not interested in how to export into Kerkythea for instance, then don't go there. I don't use SketchyPhysics for instance (the busiest subforum there) so I only drop by every day to check if there's any "problem" there.
These two forums make up most of those "many subforums" that you talk about. Together with the Components/Materials/Styles forum they are practically just deposits of tutorials and resources. Why not keep them organised?
As for the "Other Languages" forums (and @ Tom - but all the others as well in this case):
I don't know what's wrong with them. Yes, there are nations that don't speak foreign languages that well. For a Dutch for instance, it's almost natural that he/she speaks English but it's not the same with others. If we folded those forums with the main forums, it wouldn't mean to stop segregation but to deprive them from being able to effectively communicate in a place where they feel comfortable.I don't want to go into any political stuff here but what you call (and condemn as) segregation in the US is viewed way differently in Europe. Here it is taken for an essential right of everyone to keep, preserve and cultivate his/her differentness and national being - let it be within the European Union. Europe wants to keep its colourfulness while the US wants to create "one nation". I know your way is more "reasonable" while ours is a bit sentimental (saying this as a ember of a very small nation which may once disappear in globalisation).
But again, there is always the option to collapse whole categories (and this is why we made a separate category for the Other Languages subforums).
And finally @Juan - yes, I have had a couple of great people in my life. Great friends. Some have died, others have faded away others again have remained... But there have always been new ones. Like in these forums and also among my "colleagues" here especially when seeing how dedicated and enthusiastic they can be in favour of the community.
The latest additions were made on request and poll as well. The Local Area forums are basically for arranging meetings with each other. I han't even known that such things existed until a member here asked about its possibility. Just don't read the posts there and collapse the forum. If you don't need it, still let other people enjoy it.
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Well,me myself am grateful for having this forum. I thank you Coen for keeping it alive.
So I thank the moderators who work with you.
Lets have this point cleared .
Cheers.
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Please don't take these comments as a criticism. You guys have done a great job in setting this forum up...infinitely better than Google (with all its resources) has managed to do over at the Groups. However, you can put too much effort into a project. Ask any painter/illustrator/designer about the dangers of overworking a design. It's not a question of diminishing returns for a given amount of effort; it's a question of actually making it worse by continuing to tinker with it. There comes a time when you just have to stop and sit on your hands....however great the temptation to "...just do a little bit more."
Take the Tutorials forum, for instance. Isn't every tutorial going to involve tips and tricks? I'd have thought so, by sheer definition if nothing else. What if the tutorial you have concocted deals in equal measure with both modelling and animation in order to build an animated component? Where are you supposed to post it?
I can tell you that I have actually avoided posting some tuts...partly because I can't solve that problem and partly because I'm rather loathe to spend my time on creating such a tut if it's only going to reach a limited audience....because all the others are looking in the wrong place. It's no good saying that people should check all the different sub-forums...that totally negates the point of having them in the first place.
Tutorials before the end of this year will comprise elements of modelling, animation, scripting, workflow and scene setup. There will be very closely related other tuts which may drop one of those elements and pick up another one or two in their place. Where do you suggest they get posted?....please don't say you'll create another forum for 'm.
IMHO we would be much better off if there was a Tut forum for SU and another one for Image Editing that dealt with both the preparation of images for SU and post-processing techniques.
Everything else can be dealt with in the existing Ruby, Layout and rendering forums.Just my 3 cents (due to the continuing decline of the $)
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i just had the biggest burger ever!
i know it isn't in context, but i figured if i posted in here, more people would see it.
plus it was getting all serious in here, and i was getting confused.
pav
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@alan fraser said:
Please don't take these comments as a criticism. You guys have done a great job in setting this forum up...infinitely better than Google (with all its resources) has managed to do over at the Groups. However, you can put too much effort into a project. Ask any painter/illustrator/designer about the dangers of overworking a design. It's not a question of diminishing returns for a given amount of effort; it's a question of actually making it worse by continuing to tinker with it. There comes a time when you just have to stop and sit on your hands....however great the temptation to "...just do a little bit more."
Take the Tutorials forum, for instance. Isn't every tutorial going to involve tips and tricks? I'd have thought so, by sheer definition if nothing else. What if the tutorial you have concocted deals in equal measure with both modelling and animation in order to build an animated component? Where are you supposed to post it?
I can tell you that I have actually avoided posting some tuts...partly because I can't solve that problem and partly because I'm rather loathe to spend my time on creating such a tut if it's only going to reach a limited audience....because all the others are looking in the wrong place. It's no good saying that people should check all the different sub-forums...that totally negates the point of having them in the first place.
Tutorials before the end of this year will comprise elements of modelling, animation, scripting, workflow and scene setup. There will be very closely related other tuts which may drop one of those elements and pick up another one or two in their place. Where do you suggest they get posted?....please don't say you'll create another forum for 'm.
IMHO we would be much better off if there was a Tut forum for SU and another one for Image Editing that dealt with both the preparation of images for SU and post-processing techniques.
Everything else can be dealt with in the existing Ruby, Layout and rendering forums.Just my 3 cents (due to the continuing decline of the $)
I completely agree with Alan and couldn't have said it better.
Too many subsections makes it hard to find/post what you need. The tutorial section is an example.
Keep it simple! -
KEEP IT SIMPLE
that is.
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I have taken the advice and collapsed some of those sections which I'm less inclined to visit (like the language forums). Doing so has indeed simplified my 'Board Index' page.
One thing I find I miss is before when I visited the corner bar section at the top of the page were direct links to its sub-forums like the 'World Affairs' one. In my minds-eye it really was a 'sub' forum to the corner bar and the link there to those sub-forums made sense. With the recent changes those links are gone -- if you are in the corner bar you must return to the board Index page in order to get to any of those sub-forums. Consequently they no longer feel like sub-forums, and accessing them is requiring another click and an additional page download. The same goes for other sub-forums feeling detached. For example when I visit the render gallery sub-forum I almost always visit the sketchup gallery too. Before we could move between the two but now you must use the Board Index as an intermediate step. With my carpal tunnel problemo every click is a pain.
I think Alan is correct about the proliferation of tutorial sub-forums being unnecessary. I find myself rarely looking at them because doing so requires visiting ten different sub-forums when each has relatively infrequent additions. If they were all merged into one (or perhaps just a few) then a sticky posting at the top (occasionally updated as needed) could be used to index threads to particular topics for the convenience of someone looking for something specific.
I really do appreciate all Coen has done and continues to selflessly do for this community. The moderator team of volunteers is wonderful too. I feel grateful to be able to be part of this community. I would hope the comments about the recent changes do not dampen the enthusiasm Coen and the moderators have had for making this site the best it can be.
Regards, Ross
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Well, I am not the only one confused by the plethora of subforums.
I wish that poll had stayed on longer, I didn't even get time to climb down from the fence I was sitting on .Another thing that confuses me is that the word "Subforum" is more prominent than the subforum titles.
Guite
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@unknownuser said:
Just a heads up we're talking about this at length in the background.
We're going to simplify the Board Index and make it almost as the old sketchup.com forum.
Stay tuned!You all (SCF) are to be applauded for all your hard work and for salvaging the SU Pro forum community after the Google forum disaster. If a hardworking few can produce this superb forum, why can't Google with all its resources fix their forums? (sorry, silly question).
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@pmiller said:
If a hardworking few can produce this superb forum, why can't Google with all its resources fix their forums? (sorry, silly question).
What most amazes me in the Groups is Google's "Not invented here" attitude toward forum software. After quite a long time they with their army of programmers still haven't made it even decently functional. Compared to this it is like Paintbrush versus Photoshop.
Anssi
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