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    Finally gone back(i mean forward) to a PC!

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    • jeff hammondJ Offline
      jeff hammond
      last edited by

      @olishea said:

      OK. You have £1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

      Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.

      Click render.

      Which one will be quicker?

      quicker at what?
      you could go buy a mac or pc, plug it in, install the rendering software, and complete a render

      -faster than-

      going to buy all the individual parts, assembling them, then plugging in/installing/rendering.


      that said, if the above scenario is your criteria for choosing a computer then we're just different.. different enough that i don't think either of us would change the other's mind.

      dotdotdot

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      • D Offline
        db11
        last edited by

        @olishea said:

        No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

        Apple Store refurbs have the same warranty as new Macs: 14 day return / 90 day support / 1 yr warranty / Apple Care available. So no reason to exclude them from consideration.

        That said, I don't think Jeff or anyone else thinks that you can't get more rendering power for less cash in a build-your-own scenario than any other.

        The actual cost comparison should include the soft costs (including the value of the many hours spent researching/purchasing/assembling/loading OS & Drivers etc...). For most if us, we want to use the tool to get work done, not work to get the tool done.

        For me, the f.ck-around factor —and hours spent trouble-shooting things that should work but don't (incompatible components/driver issues etc..)— isn't worth the cash saved.

        If it is for you, great! Happy that you like your new box as much as I like my new Mac. 😉 No doubt we each bought something —as did Jeff— that meets our current needs well.

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        • michaliszissiouM Offline
          michaliszissiou
          last edited by

          @unknownuser said:

          Buy a PC. Build a PC.

          Click render.

          Which one will be quicker?

          Mine, a ~ six years old dual xeon macpro. You gonna bet? ( a pc ~ 1500 euros, right?)
          Click render. A CPU based render, right?
          GPU renders are depended on the GPU card and nothing else. I can install any commercial GPU you like.

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          • D Offline
            d12dozr
            last edited by

            @michaliszissiou said:

            Any advices about a new decent mouse? A decent desktop mouse, not these gamer's mice with 40 buttons, I mean.

            I just got this one a few months ago, and it works awesome ($11): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IAM78WS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8%26amp;psc=1

            3D Printing with SketchUp Book
            http://goo.gl/f7ooYh

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            • soloS Offline
              solo
              last edited by

              Lets do a comparison.

              Apple Mac pro 6 core $3999.00

              Link Preview Image
              Mac Pro - Technical Specifications

              See all the technical specifications for Mac Pro with the M2 Ultra chip.

              favicon

              Apple (www.apple.com)

              For the same machine built by JNCS is $3433.00

              Sure the Apple looks great in it's shiny black drum.

              The thing is I do not mind Mac workstations, one can pick up really good priced ones on Craigslist, the problem is I do not want Apple OS, so if I could install Windows and not Mac OS I'd consider it, and the new ones come with AMD/ATI GPU's, no good for rendering. (not CUDA)

              http://www.solos-art.com

              If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.

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              • andybotA Offline
                andybot
                last edited by

                Sure, ten years ago building a PC could be rather hit or miss. Things seem to be much better quality nowadays. It's also possible to buy a DIY kit, where they've already figured out the compatibility: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.2144880 or just a budget PC with a decent processor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE%26amp;IsNodeId=1%26amp;N=100019096%20600014723

                Like Pete mentions, there are also small shops that can build whatever you need.
                http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15%26amp;t=50941%26amp;start=45
                Also, once you have a case and peripherals, it's very easy to upgrade, instead of having to buy everything new. (I still have a 15 year old dell case that I use for a home server. It's on its third or fourth motherboard and an upgraded PSU)

                http://charlottesvillearchitecturalrendering.com/

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                • olisheaO Offline
                  olishea
                  last edited by

                  I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to any of this!

                  Each has its pros and cons. My gripes with Apple really aren't based on the price as I keep saying.

                  Buit if a Mac Vs PC war makes everyone happy, then please, go ahead 😄

                  Pilou thanks for reminding me about Verve! Great fun, I will share some paintings! 😄

                  oli

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                  • olisheaO Offline
                    olishea
                    last edited by

                    And FYI, building the PC took me just over 2 hours and I enjoyed it. They call it a "LEGO build" for that reason. No problems with anything.

                    oli

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                    • jeff hammondJ Offline
                      jeff hammond
                      last edited by

                      @pete.
                      it's going to be interesting to see how cuda vs openCL plays out.

                      my understanding is that one isn't inherently more powerful than the other.. just that cuda up til recently has been easier for devs to work with. apple is fully backing openCL and they often have success in these types of 'battles' (html5 vs flash for example). final cut is a great example of what's possible with openCL. hopefully others jump on board too (as in- for consumers, openCL is way better.. it runs on any gpu as well as cpu)

                      indigo is going the openCL route in v4.. I haven't had a chance to try a beta yet but the preview looks sweet. how is Thea coming along with openCL? still nada?

                      fwiw, this was a consideration for me when buying a computer last year so I got the imac w/ nvidia as a holdover until I see gen 2 or 3 of the new Mac pro.

                      funny thing is though-- now that I have the imac, I'm really hyped on it for most of the stuff I do.. it really is a sweet CAD machine (rhino & Sketchup at least).. not sure if I really want or even need a Mac pro now 😉

                      dotdotdot

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                      • pilouP Offline
                        pilou
                        last edited by

                        This one seems very cool for MAC! (Free beta) after maybe 50 bucks! ☀

                        Frenchy Pilou
                        Is beautiful that please without concept!
                        My Little site :)

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                        • soloS Offline
                          solo
                          last edited by

                          Jeff

                          See link, OpenCL is in the works

                          Link Preview Image
                          Page not found - Thea Render

                          favicon

                          Thea Render (www.thearender.com)

                          At the end of the day it is not really the hardware (well Apple going all in with AMD maybe) that makes me not want a Mac, it's the software, I do not like the Apple operating system, I have an iMac (7 years old now, bought new) I bought it when Vista dissapointed, however Windows 7,8 and 10 are all fantastic.

                          http://www.solos-art.com

                          If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.

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                          • Mike LuceyM Offline
                            Mike Lucey
                            last edited by

                            👍

                            Support us so we can support you! Upgrade to Premium Membership!

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                            • olisheaO Offline
                              olishea
                              last edited by

                              Yeah, let's all kiss and Mac up

                              Oh wait a minute, let me just boot up windows to run "reconciliation.exe" as I can't find a Mac version.

                              😄

                              oli

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                              • jujuJ Offline
                                juju
                                last edited by

                                @olishea said:

                                OK. You have £1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

                                Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.

                                Click render.

                                Which one will be quicker?

                                that's a loaded question...

                                however, consider this, which s going to be the quickest when something breaks down?

                                • iMac: all-in-one machine; send it in, they send it away to be repaired, it gets sent back when it's repaired, you collect, hopefully a wipe and reinstall was not required and you can just continue working.
                                • Buy-a-PC: as above but few PC's come as all-in-one machines, all in one machines follow same procedure as above, where monitor and tower is separate only the one of the two malfunctioning needs to be sent in.
                                • Build-a-PC: if you went this route chances are you're doing it yourself, and can easily find the culprit, get a faulty part swopped out / replaced rather quickly, and off you go - no waiting on shipping times and wait in line until technician can look at it.

                                Obviously the above does not take laptops into account, you're pretty much in the same boat as iMac & Buy-a-PC when going this route.

                                Save the Earth, it's the only planet with chocolate.

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                                • jeff hammondJ Offline
                                  jeff hammond
                                  last edited by

                                  @juju said:

                                  however, consider this, which s going to be the quickest when something breaks down?

                                  if you depend on your computer for work, you better have a back up.. or at the very least, the means to buy a new computer in the event of a fail.. as well as backed up data.

                                  that aside, why does the iMac have to get sent away etc? like, where are you getting that idea from?

                                  apple aren't the only people allowed to repair macs under warranty (or out of warranty).. there are authorized service centers as well.. probably about 40 of them in my town.. one is a couple blocks away from me.

                                  if you're in a rush, you can usually get something fixed same day.

                                  and that also aside, iMacs aren't welded shut nor are the parts inside all soldered together.. you can fix it yourself if you're so inclined.

                                  dotdotdot

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                                  • olisheaO Offline
                                    olishea
                                    last edited by

                                    @jeff hammond said:

                                    that aside, why does the iMac have to get sent away etc? like, where are you getting that idea from?

                                    Well when my iMac screen steamed up and hard drive started failing, they told me to take it to the Genius Bar. So had to walk through a shopping centre with a huge iMac. 😕 They would absolutely not take it away by courier.

                                    They wiped the screen and gave it back 2 days later. Replaced hard drive.

                                    Steamed up again immediately. Had to take it back to the shopping centre. They wiped the screen and gave it back?! 😕 They said trees in my area must have increased the humidity causing screen to steam up?!!

                                    Steamed up again, this time I refused to take it anywhere and they had a courier pick it up along with my macbook pro which had coincidentally suddenly failed (logic board). The macbook pro case was also warping and distorting from the heat, it was a common fault that Apple denied. This was all during a university deadline.

                                    Sent away to Amsys repair centre by Apple under warranty.

                                    Amsys superficially damaged both machines. Dented the macbook pro so badly and claimed I must have dropped it. They also gouged the bezel on my iMac. Again, claiming I was responsible. 😆

                                    What the cheeky little b*stards didn't realise.....I had taken HD videos of both dent-free computers before I sent them away. I even had the CNN homepage open on both screens so they couldn't say the videos had been recorded months before. I treated both my machines very well indeed and this video really covered my ass.

                                    So....Apple said they are refusing to repair both machines because "I had abused and dropped them". The macbook case had warped and twisted because I had dropped it. According to them.

                                    I sent them the video. Silence. No more cocky Apple customer service trying to argue with me. 😆

                                    A week later, both computers were delivered with brand new cases and bezel. All problems fixed with a huge apology from Apple.

                                    Couple of weeks later I sold the macbook pro and the iMac screen steamed up again.

                                    It's still steamed up, but I don't care. I just use it for browsing the web now.

                                    So yeah, not all Apple repairs go as smoothly as you claim! Maybe the US customer service is less obstructive but over here it stinks. They immediately try and blame you rather than say sorry and repair it.

                                    oli

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                                    • michaliszissiouM Offline
                                      michaliszissiou
                                      last edited by

                                      @unknownuser said:

                                      They said trees in my area must have increased the humidity causing screen to steam up?!!

                                      😆
                                      For my apple display, they said, I was smoking. They replaced the screen panel three times. They replaced power supply the fourth time and now it perfectly works. The power supply was the problem, costed them 4 displays. Nice
                                      The other story with my macpro and the heat sink of the northbridge was funnier though.
                                      When they realized I was right and fixed it, they had to say something…
                                      "we found some hair" they said. Do you have a pet?
                                      "No" I replayed, "these are mine, I'm a huge and hairy guy, and I'm coming to take it back right now"
                                      I'm not huge or hairy but the trick worked.
                                      🤣

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                                      • R Offline
                                        roland joseph
                                        last edited by

                                        @unknownuser said:

                                        Build-a-PC: if you went this route chances are you're doing it yourself, and can easily find the culprit, get a faulty part swopped out / replaced rather quickly, and off you go - no waiting on shipping times and wait in line until technician can look at it.

                                        For those that can, hands down, building is the answer. I regret not learning how to repair my car from the beginning considering I was going to drive one all my life.

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                                        • olisheaO Offline
                                          olishea
                                          last edited by

                                          @michaliszissiou said:

                                          "we found some hair" they said. Do you have a pet?

                                          😆 😆 😆

                                          They tried that one with me too!! Seriously!

                                          I took my brother's iPhone to the "Genius" Bar as it kept losing signal....

                                          30 seconds in, after an otoscope inspection, the "genius" condescendingly pulled out a single dog hair with some tweezers.

                                          They tried to say the hair is causing the problem. A dog hair! Anyway, 2 hours of arguing later they gave me a new phone. 😆 😆 😆

                                          oli

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                                          • michaliszissiouM Offline
                                            michaliszissiou
                                            last edited by

                                            Please Oli,
                                            My message was, be like a hairy huge guy. It works. Give them something to thing about.
                                            🤣

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