sketchucation logo sketchucation
    • Login
    ℹ️ Licensed Extensions | FredoBatch, ElevationProfile, FredoSketch, LayOps, MatSim and Pic2Shape will require license from Sept 1st More Info

    Finally gone back(i mean forward) to a PC!

    Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Corner Bar
    127 Posts 29 Posters 11.3k Views 29 Watching
    Loading More Posts
    • Oldest to Newest
    • Newest to Oldest
    • Most Votes
    Reply
    • Reply as topic
    Log in to reply
    This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
    • pbacotP Offline
      pbacot
      last edited by

      @olishea said:

      Jeff I give in. I am going to buy a mac.

      Then burn it.

      πŸ˜„

      FYI it was actually Rich who changed the thread title.

      Don't take it so personally man, I've been using Apple for years and finally gave up. My money my choice. Simples.

      They don't call it the PC Master Race for nothing you know? πŸ˜‰

      Yes and our holy prophet (profit?) Saint Jobs told us all about the PC Master Race way back in '84. πŸ˜’ πŸ˜›


      Screen Shot 2015-02-07 at 4.40.38 PM.png

      MacOSX MojaveSketchUp Pro v19 Twilight v2 Thea v3 PowerCADD

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • jeff hammondJ Offline
        jeff hammond
        last edited by

        @andybot said:

        no, my point being there's a cost to buying apple products that is not purely justified by base line performance.

        well i decided to see myself and i think just going to the apple site vs trying to navigate hp's site is worth any extra cost of the computers πŸ˜†

        it doesn't seem like you can spec out one of their all in ones as a cad machine (2.2ghz was the fastest cpu offered in those).. so the desktop which is similarly configured as my iMac is this:

        Screen Shot 2015-02-07 at 7.33.34 PM.png

        it's entirely arguable what a similar display would be as the iMac but i think this one is probably similar a 27" 2560x1440.. not the cheapest and not the priciest:

        Screen Shot 2015-02-07 at 7.40.28 PM.png

        i'm pretty sure this is a fair comparison, component wise - agree?

        so it's ~$2300 for the pc setup vs the ~$2450 i spent on my iMac..**

        maybe i'm not thrifty enough but i really don't see much of a difference there.. but maybe that's just me..
        regardless, for the third time (i'll just copy/paste this time)--
        """nowhere do you see me saying apple computers are cheaper than other brands.. that's not what i'm trying to say.. what i am saying is that they're not insanely priced relatively speaking and they're actually quite competitive price wise."""


        **granted, i'm comparing a refurb mac to a full price hp.. i saved around $500 off normal price with the refurb.

        dotdotdot

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • andybotA Offline
          andybot
          last edited by

          since this is the corner bar, I'll keep going. You still are missing the point. I'm willing to trade the convenience of a one-stop-shop for the reduced cost of building my own boxes. I can get a much more powerful (and overclockable) computer for significantly less cost. It would be just as pointless for me to shop on the HP site as it would be for me to shop at the apple site.

          http://charlottesvillearchitecturalrendering.com/

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • jeff hammondJ Offline
            jeff hammond
            last edited by

            @andybot said:

            since this is the corner bar, I'll keep going. You still are missing the point. I'm willing to trade the convenience of a one-stop-shop for the reduced cost of building my own boxes. I can get a much more powerful (and overclockable) computer for significantly less cost. It would be just as pointless for me to shop on the HP site as it would be for me to shop at the apple site.

            i really don't think i'm missing your point.. just that i'm talking to a larger crowd. (as in -- nowhere do i think i've even hinted at macs being competitively priced against a build-ur-own box.)

            or- your argument isn't necessarily mac vs. pc pricing... it's mac AND pc vs. build your own.

            thing is.. if only a handful of people are using macs... then only a handful of that handful are building their own computers.. most people, by far, are buying their computers pre-built / brand names and that's what i'm talking about..

            but of course you can bypass the manufacturers and build/support/maintain it yourself.. that's an argument in itself of whether or not it's worth the saving$ vs. time&know-how to do it yourself but statistics wise, i'm thinking you'll find around 95% of people prefer to pay for convenience.

            dotdotdot

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • olisheaO Offline
              olishea
              last edited by

              OK. You have Β£1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

              Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.

              Click render.

              Which one will be quicker?

              oli

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • jeff hammondJ Offline
                jeff hammond
                last edited by

                @olishea said:

                OK. You have Β£1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

                Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.

                Click render.

                Which one will be quicker?

                quicker at what?
                you could go buy a mac or pc, plug it in, install the rendering software, and complete a render

                -faster than-

                going to buy all the individual parts, assembling them, then plugging in/installing/rendering.


                that said, if the above scenario is your criteria for choosing a computer then we're just different.. different enough that i don't think either of us would change the other's mind.

                dotdotdot

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • D Offline
                  db11
                  last edited by

                  @olishea said:

                  No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

                  Apple Store refurbs have the same warranty as new Macs: 14 day return / 90 day support / 1 yr warranty / Apple Care available. So no reason to exclude them from consideration.

                  That said, I don't think Jeff or anyone else thinks that you can't get more rendering power for less cash in a build-your-own scenario than any other.

                  The actual cost comparison should include the soft costs (including the value of the many hours spent researching/purchasing/assembling/loading OS & Drivers etc...). For most if us, we want to use the tool to get work done, not work to get the tool done.

                  For me, the f.ck-around factor β€”and hours spent trouble-shooting things that should work but don't (incompatible components/driver issues etc..)β€” isn't worth the cash saved.

                  If it is for you, great! Happy that you like your new box as much as I like my new Mac. πŸ˜‰ No doubt we each bought something β€”as did Jeffβ€” that meets our current needs well.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • michaliszissiouM Offline
                    michaliszissiou
                    last edited by

                    @unknownuser said:

                    Buy a PC. Build a PC.

                    Click render.

                    Which one will be quicker?

                    Mine, a ~ six years old dual xeon macpro. You gonna bet? ( a pc ~ 1500 euros, right?)
                    Click render. A CPU based render, right?
                    GPU renders are depended on the GPU card and nothing else. I can install any commercial GPU you like.

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • D Offline
                      d12dozr
                      last edited by

                      @michaliszissiou said:

                      Any advices about a new decent mouse? A decent desktop mouse, not these gamer's mice with 40 buttons, I mean.

                      I just got this one a few months ago, and it works awesome ($11): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IAM78WS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8%26amp;psc=1

                      3D Printing with SketchUp Book
                      http://goo.gl/f7ooYh

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • soloS Offline
                        solo
                        last edited by

                        Lets do a comparison.

                        Apple Mac pro 6 core $3999.00

                        Link Preview Image
                        Mac Pro - Technical Specifications

                        See all the technical specifications for Mac Pro with the M2 Ultra chip.

                        favicon

                        Apple (www.apple.com)

                        For the same machine built by JNCS is $3433.00

                        Sure the Apple looks great in it's shiny black drum.

                        The thing is I do not mind Mac workstations, one can pick up really good priced ones on Craigslist, the problem is I do not want Apple OS, so if I could install Windows and not Mac OS I'd consider it, and the new ones come with AMD/ATI GPU's, no good for rendering. (not CUDA)

                        http://www.solos-art.com

                        If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • andybotA Offline
                          andybot
                          last edited by

                          Sure, ten years ago building a PC could be rather hit or miss. Things seem to be much better quality nowadays. It's also possible to buy a DIY kit, where they've already figured out the compatibility: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.2144880 or just a budget PC with a decent processor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE%26amp;IsNodeId=1%26amp;N=100019096%20600014723

                          Like Pete mentions, there are also small shops that can build whatever you need.
                          http://sketchucation.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15%26amp;t=50941%26amp;start=45
                          Also, once you have a case and peripherals, it's very easy to upgrade, instead of having to buy everything new. (I still have a 15 year old dell case that I use for a home server. It's on its third or fourth motherboard and an upgraded PSU)

                          http://charlottesvillearchitecturalrendering.com/

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • olisheaO Offline
                            olishea
                            last edited by

                            I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to any of this!

                            Each has its pros and cons. My gripes with Apple really aren't based on the price as I keep saying.

                            Buit if a Mac Vs PC war makes everyone happy, then please, go ahead πŸ˜„

                            Pilou thanks for reminding me about Verve! Great fun, I will share some paintings! πŸ˜„

                            oli

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • olisheaO Offline
                              olishea
                              last edited by

                              And FYI, building the PC took me just over 2 hours and I enjoyed it. They call it a "LEGO build" for that reason. No problems with anything.

                              oli

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • jeff hammondJ Offline
                                jeff hammond
                                last edited by

                                @pete.
                                it's going to be interesting to see how cuda vs openCL plays out.

                                my understanding is that one isn't inherently more powerful than the other.. just that cuda up til recently has been easier for devs to work with. apple is fully backing openCL and they often have success in these types of 'battles' (html5 vs flash for example). final cut is a great example of what's possible with openCL. hopefully others jump on board too (as in- for consumers, openCL is way better.. it runs on any gpu as well as cpu)

                                indigo is going the openCL route in v4.. I haven't had a chance to try a beta yet but the preview looks sweet. how is Thea coming along with openCL? still nada?

                                fwiw, this was a consideration for me when buying a computer last year so I got the imac w/ nvidia as a holdover until I see gen 2 or 3 of the new Mac pro.

                                funny thing is though-- now that I have the imac, I'm really hyped on it for most of the stuff I do.. it really is a sweet CAD machine (rhino & Sketchup at least).. not sure if I really want or even need a Mac pro now πŸ˜‰

                                dotdotdot

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • pilouP Offline
                                  pilou
                                  last edited by

                                  This one seems very cool for MAC! (Free beta) after maybe 50 bucks! β˜€

                                  Frenchy Pilou
                                  Is beautiful that please without concept!
                                  My Little site :)

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • soloS Offline
                                    solo
                                    last edited by

                                    Jeff

                                    See link, OpenCL is in the works

                                    Link Preview Image
                                    Page not found - Thea Render

                                    favicon

                                    Thea Render (www.thearender.com)

                                    At the end of the day it is not really the hardware (well Apple going all in with AMD maybe) that makes me not want a Mac, it's the software, I do not like the Apple operating system, I have an iMac (7 years old now, bought new) I bought it when Vista dissapointed, however Windows 7,8 and 10 are all fantastic.

                                    http://www.solos-art.com

                                    If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • Mike LuceyM Offline
                                      Mike Lucey
                                      last edited by

                                      πŸ‘

                                      Support us so we can support you! Upgrade to Premium Membership!

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • olisheaO Offline
                                        olishea
                                        last edited by

                                        Yeah, let's all kiss and Mac up

                                        Oh wait a minute, let me just boot up windows to run "reconciliation.exe" as I can't find a Mac version.

                                        πŸ˜„

                                        oli

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • jujuJ Offline
                                          juju
                                          last edited by

                                          @olishea said:

                                          OK. You have Β£1500 to spend. No refurbs or second hand. You must have a full warranty on all parts.

                                          Buy an iMac. Buy a PC. Build a PC.

                                          Click render.

                                          Which one will be quicker?

                                          that's a loaded question...

                                          however, consider this, which s going to be the quickest when something breaks down?

                                          • iMac: all-in-one machine; send it in, they send it away to be repaired, it gets sent back when it's repaired, you collect, hopefully a wipe and reinstall was not required and you can just continue working.
                                          • Buy-a-PC: as above but few PC's come as all-in-one machines, all in one machines follow same procedure as above, where monitor and tower is separate only the one of the two malfunctioning needs to be sent in.
                                          • Build-a-PC: if you went this route chances are you're doing it yourself, and can easily find the culprit, get a faulty part swopped out / replaced rather quickly, and off you go - no waiting on shipping times and wait in line until technician can look at it.

                                          Obviously the above does not take laptops into account, you're pretty much in the same boat as iMac & Buy-a-PC when going this route.

                                          Save the Earth, it's the only planet with chocolate.

                                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • jeff hammondJ Offline
                                            jeff hammond
                                            last edited by

                                            @juju said:

                                            however, consider this, which s going to be the quickest when something breaks down?

                                            if you depend on your computer for work, you better have a back up.. or at the very least, the means to buy a new computer in the event of a fail.. as well as backed up data.

                                            that aside, why does the iMac have to get sent away etc? like, where are you getting that idea from?

                                            apple aren't the only people allowed to repair macs under warranty (or out of warranty).. there are authorized service centers as well.. probably about 40 of them in my town.. one is a couple blocks away from me.

                                            if you're in a rush, you can usually get something fixed same day.

                                            and that also aside, iMacs aren't welded shut nor are the parts inside all soldered together.. you can fix it yourself if you're so inclined.

                                            dotdotdot

                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                            • 1
                                            • 2
                                            • 3
                                            • 4
                                            • 5
                                            • 6
                                            • 7
                                            • 5 / 7
                                            • First post
                                              Last post
                                            Buy SketchPlus
                                            Buy SUbD
                                            Buy WrapR
                                            Buy eBook
                                            Buy Modelur
                                            Buy Vertex Tools
                                            Buy SketchCuisine
                                            Buy FormFonts

                                            Advertisement