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    Mental Ray noisy shadows

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    • thomthomT Offline
      thomthom
      last edited by

      We have an increasing number of Revit project at the office and I find that as they become detailed it's very troublesome to get the model back into SketchUp in any workable manner.

      So I'm trying out 3dsmax to see if it fits better for the job. At the moment I'm using Mental Ray as it's what come out of the box and Revit can define Mental Ray materials.

      I have a scene I'm testing here. I've done no work on the materials, just trying to get the lighting there.

      Right now there is just a Sun & Sky light.

      Render01_x.png

      As you can see, the shadows from the Sun & Sky from the window is very noisy and I can't find the control to reduce it. (I'm a V-Ray for SketchUp user)
      I've tried increasing the Softness Samples under mr Sun Basic Parameters, but that did very little other than significantly increase render time.
      Default setting was at 8 - I tried 16 and 32.

      Any ideas?

      Thomas Thomassen — SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
      List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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      • Chris FullmerC Offline
        Chris Fullmer
        last edited by

        That slider for soft shadow precision right there, set at default 1, does not help to slide it up?

        Lately you've been tan, suspicious for the winter.
        All my Plugins I've written

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        • thomthomT Offline
          thomthom
          last edited by

          @chris fullmer said:

          That slider for soft shadow precision right there, set at default 1, does not help to slide it up?

          Nope. 😞

          Thomas Thomassen — SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
          List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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          • StinkieS Offline
            Stinkie
            last edited by

            I don't know anything about MentalRay, but I do own a book on it. I had a wee look, and as far as I can tell, you have to go into the "mr Sun Basic Parameters" panel (or rollout, or whatever it's called), and adjust the softness samples.

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            • thomthomT Offline
              thomthom
              last edited by

              @unknownuser said:

              I don't know anything about MentalRay, but I do own a book on it. I had a wee look, and as far as I can tell, you have to go into the "mr Sun Basic Parameters" panel (or rollout, or whatever it's called), and adjust the softness samples.

              I tried that too upped them from 8 to 32 - no real difference...

              Thomas Thomassen — SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
              List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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              • A Offline
                archigrafix
                last edited by

                Perhaps it's why you see so less interior renderings done with MentalRay! 😉
                Very kind from Autodesk, you buy a 3Dmax (several thousand dollars) and get to spend one more thousand to add Vray!
                In the past I've tried the demo of MAX several times...I was wondering to go to Max...but never succeed in using Mentalray for Archviz! I gave up when understood why Vray is the industry standard!
                However Vray + Autodesk = same fight. The right equation to buy many times the same software (I am also a Vfsu user)!
                I wont discourage you from testing, afterall things perhaps evolved in last versions. I personnaly think there's a lot of nice and well priced render soft, so why lose time on Max? 😲
                Bon courage

                Agir comme un homme de pensée, et penser comme un homme d'action...

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                • thomthomT Offline
                  thomthom
                  last edited by

                  @archigrafix said:

                  I personnaly think there's a lot of nice and well priced render soft, so why lose time on Max? 😲

                  Because Max imports Revit models without pain. And I can even define the materials in Revit if I use Mental Ray. Which means less work to update illustrations.

                  Though I do consider skipping Mental Ray and just use V-Ray instead. Gotto check if I can get a trial there as well before the Max runs out.

                  Thomas Thomassen — SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                  List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                  • J Offline
                    Jeff_LCI
                    last edited by

                    Having worked with mental ray, you can try the following:

                    Final gather to: Draft
                    Image Precision to: High
                    Glossy reflection: 2x
                    Glossy refraction: 2x

                    Optionally:
                    Turn on Global Illumination and set Max Photons per sample to 50,000
                    Turn off: Reuse Geometry
                    Disable Caustics (in rendering settings, indirect illumination)

                    Hope this helps.

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                    • B Offline
                      bhbarchitects
                      last edited by

                      Dont agree with mentalray being poor, I have had some nice results and seen some stunning examples of arch vis. Personally only use vray with sketchup as architects can never make their mind up and constantly change things!!!

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                      • StinkieS Offline
                        Stinkie
                        last edited by

                        @unknownuser said:

                        I have had some nice results and seen some stunning examples of arch vis.

                        Me too. Ramy Hanna's stuff's great.

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                        • EarthMoverE Offline
                          EarthMover
                          last edited by

                          Thom have you tried to run the scene through Iray? Not sure what version of Max you have, but the interiors coming out of Iray that I've scene have been superb. Also maybe Max 2 Thea would be a good solution for you Revit models.

                          With this MR issue, is your only light source the Daylight system? What is you MR exposure setting set to? If you turn off FG and GI are you still getting noise in the shadows?

                          3D Artist at Clearstory 3D Imaging
                          Guide Tool at Winning With Sketchup
                          Content Creator at Skapeup

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                          • Chris FullmerC Offline
                            Chris Fullmer
                            last edited by

                            I've done a bit of mental ray rendering many moons ago, and never had such bad shadow artifacts, so I'm sure there is a way to fix it. I just can't think of how off the top of my head 😄

                            Lately you've been tan, suspicious for the winter.
                            All my Plugins I've written

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                            • Chris FullmerC Offline
                              Chris Fullmer
                              last edited by

                              Here I remembered an old sample. Modeled from memory of my old Landscape architecture building at school. Then rendered in Max, using mental ray and the sun. I just don't recall the settings.

                              Link Preview Image
                              Building 7

                              Modeled in SketchUp in under 4 hours from memmory. Rendered in 3ds Max, using Mental Ray. Hopefully more complete images to come!

                              favicon

                              Flickr (www.flickr.com)

                              I might have the model around still if you want to peak at settings.

                              Lately you've been tan, suspicious for the winter.
                              All my Plugins I've written

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                              • thomthomT Offline
                                thomthom
                                last edited by

                                Chris - is that setup similar to mine? Interior with Sun & Sky lighting only?

                                Thomas Thomassen — SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                                List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                                • B Offline
                                  bhbarchitects
                                  last edited by

                                  ThomThom could you share that part of the model so, i can give it a try?

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                                  • thomthomT Offline
                                    thomthom
                                    last edited by

                                    @jeff_lci said:

                                    Having worked with mental ray, you can try the following:

                                    Final gather to: Draft
                                    Image Precision to: High
                                    Glossy reflection: 2x
                                    Glossy refraction: 2x

                                    Optionally:
                                    Turn on Global Illumination and set Max Photons per sample to 50,000
                                    Turn off: Reuse Geometry
                                    Disable Caustics (in rendering settings, indirect illumination)

                                    Hope this helps.

                                    I tried this, but it made no real difference...

                                    Thomas Thomassen — SketchUp Monkey & Coding addict
                                    List of my plugins and link to the CookieWare fund

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                                    • PixeroP Offline
                                      Pixero
                                      last edited by

                                      Two looong threads with lots of tips on MentalRay:

                                      http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=183&t=429322
                                      VRay-like interior renders with mental ray

                                      http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=183&t=303284
                                      Mental Ray - Render Troubleshooting

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