ATTN: Landscape Architects! Share your workflow & tips...
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I consider myself a good sketchup modeler but nowhere near as advanced as some of the stuff on here. I just started a position where I do a lot of sketchup work for a landscape architecture firm (I was mainly hired because of my sketchup skills and experience). I am trying to get as advanced and efficient as possible and am looking for new techniques, must have plugins, extensions, and general things to make my life easier and models looking better. There are so many ruby plugins I don't know which ones I should install.
Right now I am using SU Podium extensively for rendering. I have been playing around with Land F/X and haven't really explored it yet but I have been using it for CAD cleanup before importing to sketchup and it works well. When working with topo I have had to go back and forth between CAD and sketchup a lot since editing topo in sketchup is difficult so I find myself importing topo, running sandbox tools, then going back to cad to fix things and doing it again a few times to get things right. I'm sure there's a better way.
I find myself spending a lot of time modeling the house or buildings on the site and getting detailed to make the landscape really look good against it. I could use some practice or tips to speed up modeling houses so I don't waste so much time on that aspect without them looking like blocks. I find clients really like seeing final renders where they can see how the landscape/hardscape really interacts with their house and look out from inside of it.
I got my office to purchase most of the CADplants library and it has been extremely valuable. Even with 4000+ plants I still find it doesn't have a good chunk of the plants we use and I am creating my own library to fill in the gaps which usually involves me finding an image, photoshopping it, and creating a component. My biggest challenge has been with hedge like shrubs and groundcovers. I try to only use accurate plant components so for groundcovers I find I copy the components many many times to create a realistic groundcover effect (see images below). It is kind of a pain copying everything out then dropping them onto topo and I'm sure there is a better way to do it. As for hedges the best way I have found is to create a tall skinny face-me component image and copy it out along the length of the hedge. The effect is decent and better than trying to apply a texture to geometry but I still wish there was a better way, and it looks alright for tall hedges but not some of the lower ones at certain angles. The 2D components are great except you can't show anything from plan view, I wish there was a way to easily substitute components with conceptual ones for plan view.
I'm the only one in the office who knows how to use skecthup so I am kind of learning on my own as I go and could really use some advice, tips, and tricks from landscape architects who have been using it in the profession for a while. I'm sure there is a ton I'm missing and would rather learn to do things right from the start.
Another big things is I wish there were better component and texture libraries out there, where do you find your components and textures? 3d warehouse is pretty limited, and I love the SU podium library but it is also tiny. I really need some good textures and I would really love some render ready textures with bump maps.To light houses I usually just create a big LEM on the ceiling and it works alright and is quick. For illuminating pools I have been making the bottom/sides LEMs as well.
So a few main things I would like to know-
-Tips for dealing with plants in general, especially using accurate images and techniques for groundcovers and hedges
-Tips for bringing models in sketchup back to cad
-Tips for quicker building modeling
-Must have plugins for landscape architects
-Where to find good textures/ rendering tips
-any resources for simple 3d plants to test out?
-General advice for a beginner landscape architect bringing sketchup into a firm and doing it right from the starthttp://i.imgur.com/xLWuol.jpg
http://imgur.com/pVXcM
http://i.imgur.com/O69eJ.png -
Some plugins to look into. (For starters)
Soap Skin & Bubble - Great for adding a mounded contour to bed shapes. http://www.tensile-structures.de/sb_software.html
UV Projection - For easily fixing grass and mulch textures on surfaces made using "From Contours" - http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=34552
Selection Toys - All useful features. The select Quad face loops is great for selection of all sides on a wall or pillar cap. http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=14975
Joint Push Pull - Useful in conjunction with select quad face loops to quickly add overhand to caps and step treads. http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=6708
I also have worked out a great method for using the CadPlants library more effectively. It involves renaming the whole library to the common and botanical names instead of being numbered. I used a program called Advanced Renamer to do a batch renaming, utilizing the Excel file that comes with the plants to create a "list" and then using that list as the guidlines for batch renaming. I then use Project Sketch from RenderPlus to search and place the plant components. There is also a great little script that I asked to be developed which will take the CadPlants and have the face the camera all at once. It requires they all be on their own layer. - http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=22084 If you need help with the renaming, let me know.
Another helpful thing would be a method I worked out for doing accurate soldier courses and pool coping. It involves multiple scripts. As soon as I have time, I'll put together a tutorial on this.
Regarding plants, you are on the right track. Making your own to supplement what you have is the best method for architects who are looking for accurate representation. I think you get a better result from 2D plants, unless you are animating, then 3D is the way to go. If you are only rendering still images, then I would use photoshop to composite in things like ground cover and grass. Birds eye view is tough with 2D plants. I typically do a plan view with plant symbols and then call out to a plant image or name. You could check out Sketch3D from Dynascape or FormFonts as well.
Hope that helps.
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@earthmover said:
Some plugins to look into. (For starters)
Soap Skin & Bubble - Great for adding a mounded contour to bed shapes. http://www.tensile-structures.de/sb_software.html
UV Projection - For easily fixing grass and mulch textures on surfaces made using "From Contours" - http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=34552
Selection Toys - All useful features. The select Quad face loops is great for selection of all sides on a wall or pillar cap. http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=14975
Joint Push Pull - Useful in conjunction with select quad face loops to quickly add overhand to caps and step treads. http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=6708
I also have worked out a great method for using the CadPlants library more effectively. It involves renaming the whole library to the common and botanical names instead of being numbered. I used a program called Advanced Renamer to do a batch renaming, utilizing the Excel file that comes with the plants to create a "list" and then using that list as the guidlines for batch renaming. I then use Project Sketch from RenderPlus to search and place the plant components. There is also a great little script that I asked to be developed which will take the CadPlants and have the face the camera all at once. It requires they all be on their own layer. - http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=22084 If you need help with the renaming, let me know.
Another helpful thing would be a method I worked out for doing accurate soldier courses and pool coping. It involves multiple scripts. As soon as I have time, I'll put together a tutorial on this.
Regarding plants, you are on the right track. Making your own to supplement what you have is the best method for architects who are looking for accurate representation. I think you get a better result from 2D plants, unless you are animating, then 3D is the way to go. If you are only rendering still images, then I would use photoshop to composite in things like ground cover and grass. Birds eye view is tough with 2D plants. I typically do a plan view with plant symbols and then call out to a plant image or name. You could check out Sketch3D from Dynascape or FormFonts as well.
Hope that helps.
Awesome, I would love to compile a whole thread with tips like this. Can you give me more info on how to rename the whole CADplants library? Right now I have the whole lists printed out in a binder that I have to reference. Also, do you have issues with some of the plants coming in at absurd scales?
Another thing is with big groups of plants I would like to be able to randomly skew and scale them all. I found a plugin where you can automatically scale batches of components and set a scale interval but I really want something that will randomly skew and distort the images too, is there anything like that? I also do find it really annoying that they don't come in as face me components...
I'm looking to avoid compositing in plant matter in photoshop if possible, I've seen some great grass and really anything to bring it up a notch. Same with water, I would love to be able to get some more convincing ripples but the water looks much better than the groundcover.
How do you do your hedges?
One thing that is kind of annoying when creating topo from contours is that if the line segments aren't really divided up the topo won't conform to the contours and I have to go back and add more definition to the lines and split it up into smaller segments. Is there any plugin that will divide contours into small intervals automatically?
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Awesome, I would love to see your workflow, please post it!
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Hi,
As a landscape architect and intensive user of SU these are the plugins I can't work without now :
- Weld
- Drop or Raytracer plugin from ThomThom which I found more efficient in some situations
- FrontFace
- Joint Push Pull
- Tools on surface
- Beziers curves
- Projections
- Selections toys
- 3 line tools
- Component stringer
- Repeat Copy
- Smartpushpull
- Terrain reshaper
- Cleanup
- FredoScale
And more recently I used those ones :
- Artisan which become more and more usefull
- Materials tools
Good plugins are essential in order to work faster, but a good workflow is indispensable to be really efficient because plugins can drive you to spend much more time ! I participated to the Laurent Brixius' Book "Créer avec Sketchup" in french where I described my workflow to project a public place but from this time I improved it. I'll try to make a small description of it as soon as I can.
Edit : The french book was traduced in English : http://www.amazon.fr/gp/product/0240816277?ie=UTF8&tag=arim-21&linkCode=as2&camp=1642&creative=19458&creativeASIN=0240816277
Cheers.
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Is there a plugin that you can use to create contours at certain intervals from a surface? Basically I want to edit and create topo in a model then be able to run a plugin that will generate contours which I could then export back into a CAD drawing.
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Here is one that should work:
http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=31124 -
Here's a must have book for you
http://www.amazon.com/Google-SketchUp-Site-Design-Architecture/dp/047034525X
Daniel Tal put it out awhile ago and I, along with some others, were given copies to review. I'd been working in SU for a few years when I read through it and learned some really great tricks. No magic, just using tools like SU's contour tools in ways I'd never thought of before and that sort of thing. He also has a great list of plugins and walks you through a number of projects. He doesn't deal with rendering but it sounds like that's not your main concern.
Here are some other misc. tips.
-For groundcover you could try the component spray plugin
-For randomizing size I recommend Chris Fulmer's "Scale and Rotate Multiple" plugin
-For quicker building modeling try to model as little as possible. At your stage you've probably got CAD elevations. Try printing them out, going over them with prismacolor markers and then scanning them back in to use as textures for the house model. You could also apply the colors in photoshop as well. If you look closely at the images on http://www.cadplants.com/ that seems to be sort of how they did it, although they may have used photos or added extra detail to the images. You can also add detail into the images after they're rendered.
-for textures check out cgtextures.com
-Try to find a workflow that doesn't keep going back and forth between SU and CAD. Why are you bring SU back into CAD exactly? Maybe there's an issue there that can be fixed or tweaked to save you that extra time.
-Brodie
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I was going back into CAD mainly to reshape terrain because I was having issues shaping terrain with odd geometry made with the from contours tool. I think terrain reshaper will take care of that and now with the contours plugin I should be able to do it all in sketchup then bring a rough grading plan back into CAd when I'm done. That book is definitely on my list, is there a lot more in it than in his videos? I've been using the scale and rotate multiple plugin but it doesn't skew and distort components like I'm looking for and rotate doesn't help for 2d face me plants. I saw a pay-for randor plugin on smustard that looks like it does that for 3d trees and I wonder if it would do anything to 2d components.
I have CAD elevations for new projects and I'll have to play around with some ideas. I kind of like the clean rendered look so I need to model some detail- I'm wondering if there are any plugins that help to automate and speed up exterior house building.
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Don't get randor. I have it and basically it's the same as Chris Fulmer's tool except there are no controls. It randomly rotates and scales the objects you select without asking you for any parameters. I've stopped using it.
It's been awhile since I've watched Tal's videos. As I recall they basically do a good overview of the book minus the detail. If the videos didn't look too applicable then the book probably won't be terribly helpful and vice versa.
Terrain is difficult, and you're correct that SU's terrain tool creates some crappy geometry which is hard to manipulate. I try to use the soap bubble plugin whenever possible which someone mentioned above. For example, if you've got a bunch of circular mulch patches for trees and maybe a couple long curvy ones for bushes you can use it to create a nice flat plane which fills each space, and choose a subdivision level which will produce squares instead of long triangles. Then you can set a further parameter which will push up the mound in the middle while leaving the boundry at the same level as the grass - effectively creating a perfect dirt or mulch mound of whatever shape you have. Similarly if you use this for your main terrain you'll end up with square geometry again which you can use the smoove tool on to create whatever variation you need.
I don't know of any particular plugins to help with house modeling. I do hospital models which are quite large but I pretty much do everything custom for each job for the most part using some of the usual plugins like joint push pull. The only thing I can think of which I use to speed up the process is to keep some standard 3d objects that I use a lot in my component browser. So I'll make a good looking entry door which tends to be pretty much the same from job to job other than the size rather than recreating it each time. Maybe you've got some standard sconces, interior blinds, etc. you could use but you've probably already got something like that started.
-Brodie
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All in all, I think you need to work on finding a workflow of your own and evolving it over time, which is how most of us have refined our methods. There is no real magic here, but rather just understanding sketchup thoroughly and working within the confines of it's logic. (which all plugins adhere to)
It sounds as though you are a little over committed with your new job position and in turn are scrambling to learn everything in a matter of days instead of the years it took most of us to develop our toolsets and modeling strategies. There is no shortage of help here, but I'm just suggesting you take it in smaller steps and work through the precise aspects of each problem as you encounter it. Amassing a ton of information all at once can lead to more headaches and confusion. Just a suggestion and not at all a knock on your general ambition.
It sounds as if your biggest issues are -
- Terrain Management
- Plant placement and lack of plant material as well as hedges and groundcovers and grass.
- Textures
- Building Modeling
Terrain Management - What type of terrain data are you dealing with? (contour lines, grade shots, cloud data, survey TIN, etc.) How accurate are you trying to get? What are your main issues with the terrain you are creating? Sounds like you are trying to retopo the "From Contours" terrain to add more detail. You can use the Artisan plugin to subdivide particular areas. Didier's Terrain Resurfacer plugin works okay as well. I like using TIG's Drape Cpoints and Triangulate Cpoints plugins to retopo my terrains. Whatever is easier. You might also check out Instant Site Grader from Chuck Vali. There has been a lot of discussion on terrains here, so a quick search will probably yield a plethora of answers as will very specific question with illustrated examples of your problems.
Plants - Again, do a search, there are a lot of solutions on here. SCF member Oli made some nice hedges and shared them. Pixero made some nice Hornbeam hedges and shared them. I shared a bunch of landscape 2D plants. Solo and Tomsdesk have plant collections for sale on Solo's website. http://www.Solosplace.com. The 3D warehouse has a ton of plants. There are several other nice commercial collections out there. (Realworld Imagery, Dosch, etc) It all depends on our specific needs. As far as grass, the best is 3D grass, but not really possible in sketchup. (I use 3ds Max with 3D proxies and a free scatter plugin) 2nd best is compositing grass in photoshop. Lastly is textured flat grass. Check around, there are several threads on grass. Not sure why you are so against photoshop and post process, but to get where you want to be, you'll need it. For groundcover, you could also try the Sketchup Ivy plugin and swap the ivy leaf with a groundcover leaf.
Textures - They are all over. Just gotta search. Your best resource will be yourself and learning how to make seamless textures. There is a thread somewhere in the resources section with about 50 links to different texture resources.
Building Modeling - There are several roof building plugins (check TIG & Chuck Vali) and various window (Windowizer 4) and door plugins that will speed up house building. Also check out 1001bits Pro for good tools that aid in building construction. It depends on how accurate you are trying to get. I use mostly native sketchup tools for building construction while utilizing components as much as possible. It's still a very time consuming process. Your best bet would be to set up your camera scenes as soon as you block out your structures and then only add details to those areas that will be in the render view. Again, there is no magic solution, just time and practice.
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Partick, What is your role in the office? It sounds like you work as part of a team. Is your primary job to conceptualize landscape designs, to model a design for presentation, or to model and refine a design with the intent of doing construction documents?
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@honoluludesktop said:
Partick, What is your role in the office? It sounds like you work as part of a team. Is your primary job to conceptualize landscape designs, to model a design for presentation, or to model and refine a design with the intent of doing construction documents?
Right now I am doing a lot of modeling for conceptualization/preliminary design and some presentations. We're not using it for any construction documents but I would like to be able to at least find a good way to use the model to speed up doing final drawings.
earthmover- Yeah I'm trying to learn a lot quickly and I would just like to learn as much as possible so I can work better. Just from what I've learned in the past week with plugins and some new techniques it's all become part of my natural workflow so I see no reason to slow down. I'll take a look at some of that stuff, thanks!
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As far as transferring the info to CAD you can go to a top view with perspective turned off and export 2D and choose .dwg which should give you a great start.
Another thing I meant to recommend earlier which could be helpful with the SU to CAD transition as well as something you said earlier about looking at plants from the top view. People will sometimes use a proxy to shift between low and high poly models of an object. You could do the same thing for your purposes.
For example, you've got a component named Maple Tree and within that component are 3 components all on different layers (let's call them: Top, CAD, and Standard). The component on the Top layer might be a 3d maple tree or a 2d top view image of a maple. On the CAD layer you might have some simple linework, whatever you'd usually use in CAD to represent a maple. And on the Standard layer you'd have your usual 2.5d component. Then you just turn on whichever layer you need for what you're doing. Just make sure as you'd create this overall components that you save them to a component library where you can easily access them again for the next project
-Brodie
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Wow I found instant roof for quick house modeling. This will save me a ton of time...
http://www.youtube.com/user/chuckvali#p/u/4/XZYrM3niFQo
What other plugins can I use to model buildings quickly? Are there any plugins or one stop solutions for quickly putting windows and doors on buildings? Going to the 3d warehouse and modify everything is kind of a pain and it's hard to find collections of all the same kind of stuff. Also I'm sure this is a basic question, is there a way to quickly cut out the shape on a surface where a component intersects where it is glued? So I can just plop windows and doors on and have them cut holes so light can come through?
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Patrick, also check out the TIG's roof.rb script. For everyday gable and hip roofs, it's a breeze. http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=3470
Have you downloaded the bonus packs yet? http://sketchup.google.com/intl/en/download/bonuspacks6.html
There are a lot of premade doors and windows that are set up to cut through a single plane.
A lot of time though I have projects with custom doors and windows which I just draw myself and make into cutable components. Most times it's quicker to just draw something than to go and search for it.
If you build your walls with thickness, you will need to look into a hole punching script to get the window to punch through both the inner and outer wall. TIG's is a good one - http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?t=30846
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@unknownuser said:
For example, you've got a component named Maple Tree and within that component are 3 components all on different layers (let's call them: Top, CAD, and Standard). The component on the Top layer might be a 3d maple tree or a 2d top view image of a maple. On the CAD layer you might have some simple linework, whatever you'd usually use in CAD to represent a maple. And on the Standard layer you'd have your usual 2.5d component. Then you just turn on whichever layer you need for what you're doing. Just make sure as you'd create this overall components that you save them to a component library where you can easily access them again for the next project
-Brodie
Something like this. It's a Japanese Maple component I made, which has two layers inside it, one for perspective and one for top. Switch to top layer when doing birds eye view. The attached .skp has the component in it and is set up with two scenes set up for each view. The file size is large because of the detailed cutout of the plant for better shadowing. I vectorized the .png and brought it into sketchup as a .dxf, then ran simplify curves on it before adding the plant image. It's not necessary, but again, just makes better shadows.
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Thanks. Useful component.
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Anyone use Land F/X?
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for place cars on parking or any vegetal or anything you can try Replace Randomly Components by Sdmitch
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