Libya

JuanV.Soler · 31 Mar 2011, 10:40

It strikes me that the Lybian happenings are not commented in this Corner Bar.
I think it has been a fatal error to intervene there. As a Spanish citizen I feel out of our house of parliament. 348 votes in favour and only 2 against, out of 350 total people representatives.
I would like to hear your views. Thanks.

rv1974 · 31 Mar 2011, 10:52

david. · 31 Mar 2011, 15:59

First: European Oil Interests!
Second: Reduce immigration into Europe of North African refugees.

solo · 31 Mar 2011, 16:04

As a socialist liberal I do not believe we (America) has reason to be in any war/conflict. I'm against our involvement in Libya.

There is a lot of hypocrisy in all of this, Will we defend the people of Yemen, Bahrain, what about Zimbabwe?

I was against Bush for what he did as I am now opposing Obama for the same reasons.

JuanV.Soler · 31 Mar 2011, 17:39

Just picked up this video from David Icke website,

YouTube - Martin Luther King, "Why I Am Opposed to the War in Vietnam"
[flash=480,385:1a52dm3j]http://www.youtube.com/v/b80Bsw0UG-U?fs=1&hl=es_ES[/flash:1a52dm3j]

shivering and exciting words against the war in Vietnam that can be updated today.
I thought it may be interesting to hear for you as well.

Thanks for your answers so far.

solo · 31 Mar 2011, 19:33

[flash=600,400:1c70hgh7]http://www.youtube.com/v/q0i9acHS_zQ&feature=player_embedded[/flash:1c70hgh7]

srx · 31 Mar 2011, 20:05

How are they doing it over and over again when the most of the people are against it? People easy forget their government's wars when enjoying the war chase in their everyday lives...
But the bombed ones never forgets.

Gaieus · 1 Apr 2011, 04:17

Hungary is staying out of this European action now - not as if our forces were any decisive in any conflicts just it is Hungary's turn in the EU Presidency this half year. Interesting to see how our prime minister is trying to take part in the discussions while we are staying away from the conflict.

It is always a sad thing to see when a dictator turns against his own people and slaughters them. I know - we've had that, too (and actually we were waiting for or rather expecting or were looking forward to some western intervention in 1956 - as was promised and as we were encouraged - but fixing up the Israeli-Arab conflict and securing the Middle-East oil routes was again more important).

JuanV.Soler · 1 Apr 2011, 11:57

I understand Gaieus,
thanks for your input.

JuanV.Soler · 1 Apr 2011, 12:24

yes they may arise a lot of unexpected happenings over there
Thanks modelhead

Edit:

more warnings

YouTube - Min. Farrakhan Press Conf. on Pres. Obama, Col. Gadhafi and Libya War
[flash=480,385:1ynip9r0]http://www.youtube.com/v/6EwiGk9TXCE?fs=1&hl=es_ES[/flash:1ynip9r0]

JuanV.Soler · 1 Apr 2011, 12:31

they do not forget no,
besides :

YouTube - Farrakhan Warns, Advises Obama on Libya
[flash=480,385:21c5jadv]http://www.youtube.com/v/iLrLgOVHT8E?fs=1&hl=es_ES[/flash:21c5jadv]

Thanks srx

JuanV.Soler · 20 Oct 2011, 18:15

While some people are celebrating the death of Gaddafi,
watch this video about the reasons for wanting him dead

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-4eGqj_BCE

tfdesign · 20 Oct 2011, 19:43

@solo said:

As a socialist liberal I do not believe we (America) has reason to be in any war/conflict. I'm against our involvement in Libya.

There is a lot of hypocrisy in all of this, Will we defend the people of Yemen, Bahrain, what about Zimbabwe?

I was against Bush for what he did as I am now opposing Obama for the same reasons.

As a Marxist, I agree. However I don't condone the final assassination of Gaddafi either. I think that was wrong. He should have been arrested and then tried by a neutral court. The Americans (and British) were wrong to invade Iraq, but they acted correctly when they found Saddam down a hole and then arrested him. But they should never have handed him over to the resurgence. The Americans were also hypocritical when they found and then assassinated Bin Laden. They should have simply arrested him too.

America still has the death penalty, and were wrong to carry out two state executions recently- even if the accused had committed terrible criminal acts. Arab nations are often seen or described as brutalistic by the west, but the west can be just as brutal, but in a different way (see recent torture footage of Iraqis by both the British and the Americans), and I think as westerners, many of us find that hard to grasp or see.

It will be interesting to see what happens next.

srx · 20 Oct 2011, 20:10

Another democratic murder seen on TV...and all the western politicians (puppets) are celebrating!?...the one with the tail too...
This is sad and troublesome ...I think we all have to worry...and I pray that ordinary people in USA and other countries involved will wake up and say no to this kind of spreading democracy.

srx · 21 Oct 2011, 09:03

Can anyone tell that this is not the truth?

@unknownuser said:

Would the people in NATO countries to see these images, they could despite all the war propaganda understand that war by NATO, with a few as henchmen led, is not to the liberation of the people in Libya, but against the Libyan people and their legitimate government is.

About the reasons for this criminal act:

JuanV.Soler · 21 Oct 2011, 16:08

Did you know about this ? The **Green Book**of Gaddafi
Muammar-Qaddafi-Green-Book-Eng.pdf
We are know claiming
Direct democracy
and he wrote about that : %(#008000)[is the
ideal method, which, if realised in
practice, is indisputable and noncon-
troversial.]

source : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KuO9i_4hPg

what on earth are we doing ????????????????????????

srx · 21 Oct 2011, 21:53

Green book... More than interesting thinking in that it unites socialist ideas with natural laws contained in tradition and religion...not seen before...something I was just thinking about...the only right way to save the human freedom...the human soul...but how in practice to do it, not cleared to me. The goal is satisfaction of everyone's needs...and what about the need for domination? The book is very human, but too simplified in solutions. Thank you very much for this Juan!

Stinkie · 22 Oct 2011, 11:32

I don't particulary mind Ghadaffi is dead (I'd rather seen him sent to The Hague, though), but I'm quite sceptic with regards to Libya's future. I predict a wave of privatization.

dale · 22 Oct 2011, 14:06

Although I question the motives of Libya being singled out as a target for NATO intervention (oil, ya think?) while staying out of many other conflicts as pointed out, I wonder what the consequences would have been if NATO had not intervened?

Stinkie · 22 Oct 2011, 14:56

The insurgency might have failed, I imagine. Many civilians would've died, and many others would've ended up in cells and/or torture chambers.

And the West would've missed a great opportunity to make lots of money.