2012

solo · 28 Jun 2009, 22:07

A name christian is what 75% American consider themselves, that's live a normal (sinfull) life, go to church every now and again (read funerals and weddings) and look down at other religions.
A natural christian is best summed up with words like obsession, a very restrictive lifestyle, devoid of true expression unless it's in praise or honor of your supreme leader, best explained here: Eph 5:15-17
A Spiritual christian is one that breaks loose from the shackles of tradition/religion and lives a spiritual life, Kinda like early Native Americans, lost Amazonian tribes, etc, with the exception they do not pay homage to the sun, clouds, mountains, rivers or animals but to Jesus.

And you asked: “What was wrong in Jesus life?”

Nothing, but can you kindly keep it to yourself? I'm not interested it that life, so no need to feel the need to save me, I'm perfectly safe.

Stinkie · 28 Jun 2009, 22:47

@unknownuser said:

Stinkie wrote:
“Not so fast, Cornel. 'Relative' and 'undefinable' are not interchangeable concepts.”
They are, because your relative moral precepts can be defined for a club, not to be valuable for all mankind, as the Bible is.

Errrr ... I think you're getting a tad caught up in your own newspeak here.

@unknownuser said:

Stinkie, you affirmed that finally a human being will be “either fire or worms”.
Is the human spirit included in those presuppose ‘shapes’?!

I meant that the 'afterlife' will consist of either burial or cremation. The best you can hope for, is that parts of you will be recycled to help out others. As for 'the spirit' - now there's a concept that makes me think of really large, unisex training pants. One can fit anything in there.

Alan, could you elaborate a bit further on your concept of afterlife? No - not poking fun at you. I'm quite serious.

Clarencecat · 28 Jun 2009, 23:08

I agree with you Solo
there's enough judging of people by other people, without being judged by an omnipitant power - & should there be such a thing, what a poor view these religious people have of their god that they think it so malevolent.
They cant have it all ways - either it created everything, including our thoughts, or it's just using ius for it's own amusement.
We might as well worship a paper bag - or the sun (which very popular once!)

When i was at school, although not a religiuos school, it was instilled in everone to worship god. As i got older i realised it was a myth, but for quite a long time i was secretly afraid to deny a god, it was that deeply ingrained - we are so fragile in our formative years.

We don't need religion or the threat of retribution to lead good lives - i'ts a natural thing to treat others well, simply because it's what works for everyone.
We are not in the stone age, we all know right from wrong.

This is not say i'm not spiritual - we are all made of the same stuff, the connection between us is a common history, common worries, common - well, common everything
(i know, a bit buddhist)

Maybe it's communication that we lack.

cornel · 28 Jun 2009, 23:25

Stinkie wrote:
“I meant that the 'afterlife' will consist of either burial or cremation. The best you can hope for, is that parts of you will be recycled to help out others.”

Is there a problem for you if those “others” will be undesirable beings or things?!

Stinkie · 28 Jun 2009, 23:27

@unknownuser said:

Stinkie wrote:
“I meant that the 'afterlife' will consist of either burial or cremation. The best you can hope for, is that parts of you will be recycled to help out others.”

Is there a problem for you if those “others” will be undesirable beings or things?!

What do you mean?

cornel · 28 Jun 2009, 23:55

Stinkie,
I’m not in your situation, to be "recycled fot others"…

My ‘scene’ will be this one:
“For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.”
(1 Thessalonians 4:16)

Cornel

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 00:03

Ed Hallam wrote:
“We are not in the stone age, we all know right from wrong.”

?!?!

The word INHUMAN denote that we have, in our conscience, an ideal model, which shows us what we have to do to be correct…
This presented that God created us ‘in His image, to be like Him’, but we are far now from that model; we are into a certain dynamic devolution.

In Psalm 8:4-5 it is written:
“What is man that you are mindful of him, the son of man that you care for him? You made him a little lower than the heavenly beings and crowned him with glory and honor.”

Apart from God, humans lost that initial “glory and honor” and took a new human ‘component’ named “sinful nature”, which enormous contributes to our devolution.
Post-modern humans aren’t more intelligent than a primitive one…

Take a child from a wild jungle tribe and put him/her into a very presigious suite of schools, in the most advanced country, and you will see no differences…!
Man capacities weren’t created by the progress, as evolutionists affirm. Human beings had them from the beginning, but they didn’t know how to materialize them…!

Cornel

Alan Fraser · 29 Jun 2009, 00:10

Cornel, almost everything you have just written there is total nonsense. If we have some model within us that dictates how we should behave, it’s largely cultural and doesn’t owe anything to any deity.
Other societies adopted practices that they regarded as totally normal and unremarkable that we would now judge to be totally abhorrent. We’ve come a long way over the last few hundred years in becoming far more tolerant and forgiving of other people; and this has gone hand in hand with an increasing secularism.
Our ancestors might have been far more rigorous in their religious observance, but that didn’t stop them attending public executions…often for very minor offences…in the same spirit we now go to a sporting event. What price the example of “He who is without sin…” there? Even the oh-so-pious Victorians thought nothing about hanging or deporting children for merely stealing enough to eat.

Post modern humans (whatever that’s supposed to mean) may not be more intelligent than earlier Cro Magnons, but they are a helluva lot more educated and knowledgeable and are therefore able to make far more informed decisions.

Take a child from a primitive society and educate them in an advanced nation and you’ll get an educated modern child. The idea that there will be no difference is ridiculous. There are a huge number of examples of this.

Of course our capacities increased with evolution. There’s a vast difference between our reasoning powers and those of Homo Erectus or the Australopithecines.

I guess this is the point when you jump in and say that there were no such creatures and the world was created in 4004 BC?

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 01:29

Alan,
I know enough all so called ‘advanced theories’…
After I did study them (plus Terra history), intensive, more than fifty years, I established a clear conclusion:
The Bible is true and has no inadvertences or competitors.

Regarding evolution, we are into an incontravertible devolution!
Progressive technology doesn’t mean evolution...

W/ optimism,
Cornel

Stinkie · 29 Jun 2009, 07:38

@alan fraser said:

Simply maintaining that the Bible is true because it is; and that everything that contradicts it must be wrong, is no kind of argument. It’s not even Faith…just a dumb acceptance.

Aye.

@unknownuser said:

Stinkie wrote:
“I meant that the 'afterlife' will consist of either burial or cremation. The best you can hope for, is that parts of you will be recycled to help out others.”

Is there a problem for you if those “others” will be undesirable beings or things?!

I'd still like to know what this means. In English, please.

Alan Fraser · 29 Jun 2009, 08:20

@unknownuser said:

Progressive technology doesn’t mean evolution...

Who said it did?

@unknownuser said:

I know enough all so called ‘advanced theories’

Apparently not enough.
Technology has nothing whatsoever to do with evolution; and evolution is not a 'so-called advanced theory', it's incontravertibly true. To deny it you might as well deny that the Earth is round. If you don't accept evolution then you don't accept modern medicine...they often rely on the same techniques. It's the choice between CAT scans and casting out demons.

Simply maintaining that the Bible is true because it is; and that everything that contradicts it must be wrong, is no kind of argument. It’s not even Faith…just a dumb acceptance. If believing what you do helps you get through the day, that’s fine…for you. We all have strategies for dealing with life. That does not mean, however, that it’s fine for everyone else or that they are somehow too blind to see the ‘Truth’.

I also believe that large parts of the Bible are true. For instance, I believe that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed…but by natural catastrophe, not some vengeful god. I think the people who put that interpretation on it were history’s version of the spiteful, mean-minded, holier-than-thou types that labelled Aids as God’s revenge on the wicked. We still get ample evidence of the ignorant, superstitious and prejudiced interpreting ‘God’s will.’ There’s nothing to suggest that the same thing hasn’t happened throughout history.
There's a YouTube video of some mullahs arrogantly asserting that the Boxing Day tsunami was God's revenge on the unrighteous...flaunting their bodies on the beaches instead of presumably being at prayer. Same difference.

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 12:59

Alan wrote,
“I believe that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed…but by natural catastrophe, not some vengeful god.”

God has control above all Univers!
Not only Sodom and Gomorrah were punished…: the Flood, Land of Canaan (starting w/ Jericho…), Babylon, Nineveh, Tyre, Sidon, etc.
Others: Pompei, Herculaneum, Rome, Cartagine, Chicago, etc.
God has control of wars, pandemics, tsunamis, earthquake, fires, accidents and so on…

Re. “evolution”:
Our progress is for ‘stomach’…, and is based on advanced technology…!
Much more important are our spirits, and we don’t know what the spirit is - we are confounding the spirit w/ the soul… Shame of us!

Behold an example of devolution:
“And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper…
and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.” (Romans 1:28,32)

Cornel

Stinkie · 29 Jun 2009, 13:44

Has anyone else noticed Cornel doesn't like to answer questions?

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 13:46

Modelhead wrote,
“ If there is an all powerful being he will have witnessed my life and he will want me on his team anyway..”

God’s evaluations are different than ours…!

“For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.” (Ephesians 2:8-9)

Stinkie · 29 Jun 2009, 13:53

@unknownuser said:

Stinkie wrote:
“I meant that the 'afterlife' will consist of either burial or cremation. The best you can hope for, is that parts of you will be recycled to help out others.”

Is there a problem for you if those “others” will be undesirable beings or things?!

I'd still like to know what this means. In English, please.[/quote]

Please.

solo · 29 Jun 2009, 14:03

@unknownuser said:

The Bible is concise and very explicative.

If that's the case how come every denomination, sect, or accumulation of worshippers feel the need to interpret it their own way?

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 14:03

Stinkie wrote,
“Has anyone else noticed Cornel doesn't like to answer questions?”

The Bible is concise and very explicative.
English is my 5th language – I’m learning it!
I am busy…

The answer for your above question is pending - be patient, please!

Cornel

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 14:12

Pete,
For them, first place is occupied by COMPROMISES: superficial or partial studies, tradition, superstitions, personal ambitions, business, politics, etc.

Alan Fraser · 29 Jun 2009, 14:29

@unknownuser said:

Pete,
For them, first place is occupied by COMPROMISES: superficial or partial studies, tradition, superstitions, personal ambitions, business, politics, etc.

That's the entire history of organised religion right there. It's certainly true of the Christian church and the early years of Islam were also far more concerned with political and physical in-fighting than the words of the Qu'ran

cornel · 29 Jun 2009, 14:57

Yes, “God is still good” ...:

“… He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.” (Matthew 5:45)

…until the Judgement day.

Cornel