Occupy Wall street
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@idahoj said:
Another "election year" spleen-venting session ... Sure, there needs to be change. But that change comes from electing people who will represent the will of the electorate. It takes legislation to change the situation in this country, not protest marches.
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Right. So if Sarah & that old-timer or maybe Hillary had been elected, things would be different now?
The govt is broken. Bad.
And i dont think you can rely on a broken system to repair itself. -
So how does one fix it? I'd run for president. I wouldn't be a good one by certain measures, but I'd be an honest one. But who'd vote for me? We say we want change, but in the end, its virtually impossible to actually effect change. So how do we fix a broken government? We don't like the people we've elected to govern us. But it seems impossible to replace them with who we want for some reason.
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I heard yesterday that President Obama had likened to Gordon Brown! (ie has gone all silent on America).
But does a president have to be a showman? And why does it matter so much? Can Obama just be left
to get on with his job? I remember when Reagan (Raygun) got in for a second term. Some American republicans
were interviewed on why they were voting. One replied that they "liked his hair"!!
Is that a good basis to vote for someone?
We said that Labour were broken (which yes I suppose they were? But at least they were still spending money.
Okay not on important things (like R&D), but at least they were investing something). But who have we in power now? A coalition
government who got in by the 'skin of their teeth' ie such a low voting turnout- no one really cared. Now it's
cuts cuts cuts, and probably the highest unemployment figures for 17 years.If you don't vote, the 'little man' will get in. Just like he almost did in France a few years back. Do you fancy the
idea of a bunch of Klansmen in office?
Heavens forbid!There's nothing really wrong with the principle of capitalism, it's just this present capitalist model, the one we have
now which is wrong. But It's not going to be a revolution that will change that though, it will be debate- kind of like what we are
doing now.
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To the citizens of the United States of America from Her Sovereign Majesty Queen Elizabeth II:
In light of your immediate failure to financially manage yourselves and also in recent years your tendency to elect incompetent Presidents of the USA and therefore not able to govern yourselves, we hereby give notice of the revocation of your independence, effective immediately. (You should look up 'revocation' in the Oxford English Dictionary.)
Her Sovereign Majesty Queen Elizabeth II will resume monarchical duties over all states, commonwealths, and territories (except Kansas , which she does not fancy).
Your new Prime Minister, David Cameron, will appoint a Governor for America without the need for further elections.
Congress and the Senate will be disbanded. A questionnaire may be circulated sometime next year to determine whether any of you noticed.
To aid in the transition to a British Crown dependency, the following rules are introduced with immediate effect:
- The letter 'U' will be reinstated in words such as 'colour,' 'favour,' 'labour' and 'neighbour.' Likewise, you will learn to spell 'doughnut' without skipping half the letters, and the suffix '-ize' will be replaced by the suffix '-ise.'Generally, you will be expected to raise your vocabulary to acceptable levels. (look up 'vocabulary'). (I love that one)
Using the same twenty-seven words interspersed with filler noises such as ''like' and 'you know' is an unacceptable and inefficient form of communication. There is no such thing as U.S. English. We will let Microsoft know on your behalf. The Microsoft spell-checker will be adjusted to take into account the reinstated letter 'u'' and the elimination of '-ize.' ' (I love that one too)
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July 4th will no longer be celebrated as a holiday.
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You will learn to resolve personal issues without using guns, lawyers, or therapists. The fact that you need so many lawyers and therapists shows that you're not quite ready to be independent. Guns should only be used for shooting grouse. If you can't sort things out without suing someone or speaking to a therapist, then you're not ready to shoot grouse.
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Therefore, you will no longer be allowed to own or carry anything more dangerous than a vegetable peeler. Although a permit will be required if you wish to carry a vegetable peeler in public.
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All intersections will be replaced with roundabouts, and you will start driving on the left side with immediate effect. At the same time, you will go metric with immediate effect and without the benefit of conversion tables. Both roundabouts and metrication will help you understand the British sense of humour.
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The former USA will adopt UK prices on petrol (which you have been calling gasoline) of roughly $10/US gallon. Get used to it.)
8.You will learn to make real chips. Those things you call French fries are not real chips, and those things you insist on calling potato chips are properly called crisps. Real chips are thick cut, fried in animal fat, and dressed not with catsup but with vinegar.
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The cold, tasteless stuff you insist on calling beer is not actually beer at all. Henceforth, only proper British Bitter will be referred to as beer, and European brews of known and accepted provenance will be referred to as Lager. New Zealand beer is also acceptable, as New Zealand is pound for pound the greatest sporting nation on earth and it can only be due to the beer. They are also part of the British Commonwealth - see what it did for them. American brands will be referred to as Near-Frozen Gnat's Urine, so that all can be sold without risk of further confusion.
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Hollywood will be required occasionally to cast English actors as good guys. Hollywood will also be required to cast English actors to play English characters. Watching Andie Macdowell attempt English dialogue in Four Weddings and a Funeral was an experience akin to having one's ears removed with a cheese grater.
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You will cease playing American football. There are only two kinds of proper football; one you call soccer, and rugby (dominated by the New Zealanders). Those of you brave enough will, in time, be allowed to play rugby (which has some similarities to American football, but does not involve stopping for a rest every twenty seconds or wearing full kevlar body armour like a bunch of nancies).
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Further, you will stop playing baseball. It is not reasonable to host an event called the World Series for a game which is not played outside of America . Since only 2.1% of you are aware there is a world beyond your borders, your error is understandable. You will learn cricket, and we will let you face the Australians (World dominators) first to take the sting out of their deliveries.
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You must tell us who killed JFK. It's been driving us mad.
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An internal revenue agent (i.e. tax collector) from Her Majesty's Government will be with you shortly to ensure the acquisition of all monies due (backdated to 1776).
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Daily Tea Time begins promptly at 4 p.m. with proper cups, with saucers, and never mugs, with high quality biscuits (cookies) and cakes; plus strawberries (with cream) when in season.
God Save the Queen!
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@chris fullmer said:
So how does one fix it? I'd run for president. I wouldn't be a good one by certain measures, but I'd be an honest one. But who'd vote for me? We say we want change, but in the end, its virtually impossible to actually effect change. So how do we fix a broken government? We don't like the people we've elected to govern us. But it seems impossible to replace them with who we want for some reason.
We don't have a choice. Those puppets are placed there because they aren't honest and can be manipulated by the corporations.
It's about taking our government back. We don't have a government. They have us.For the people, by the people.
Not: for our greedy pockets at the expense of the people. -
@srx...
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@unknownuser said:
For the people, by the people.
Not: for our greedy pockets at the expense of the people.But how do you intend to rally 'the people' when all 'the message' does is alienate 'the people' by claiming that they are brainwashed or stupid?
You could also start by setting fire to your Mac? Apple are a global corporation and their products are manufactured in China.
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@tfdesign said:
But how do you intend to rally 'the people' when all 'the message' does is alienate 'the people' by claiming that they are brainwashed or stupid?
if it were up to me, personally, to rally the people..
i'd suggest that nobody sends money to the IRS next april.. i mean, we complain about all these crazy salaries and/or bonuses for the banker ceos and whatnot but where does the money actually come from? it comes from us.. our labor. basically 3 months of our work year is for nothing other than making a small handful of people very rich.our income tax isn't being used for bettering the country (education, infrastructure, healthcare, etc.).. it's being used to pay off interest to the federal reserve (private banking institution).. i.e.- they put $1 into circulation but we have to pay them $.25 to use that dollar.. unfortunately for us, there isn't actually enough money in circulation to pay off the debt so we pay it via labor (in other words - slavery)
so yeah, I'm pretty sure i could say to someone "you're stupid and brainwashed! but you don't actually have to pay taxes".. and they'd oblige
@unknownuser said:
You could also start by setting fire to your Mac? Apple are a global corporation and their products are manufactured in China.
pretty much everything i own and/or use is along the same lines.. me personally getting rid of the stuff isn't going to change anything.. i'm at the bottom of the barrel.. it's the people/corporations/banks at the top that need to go..
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I guess since I mentioned the federal reserve up there, they'll be checking in on this thread soon..
here's your chance to say hi!
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It was only a matter of time before things started to get out of hand: http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/15/world/occupy-goes-global/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
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Yikes!!! this is gaining momentum, maybe even out of control.
Note to Bilderberg group: avoid meetings until things cool down.
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"A great industrial nation is controlled by it's system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated governments in the world-- no longer a government of free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of small groups of dominant men." -- President Woodrow Wilson
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The best thing so far that I have noticed is OWS in NOT partisan.
I saw a great sign in Dallas this morning (yeah we also have protests going on)
@unknownuser said:
The mere idea that Democrats and Republicans exist separately is a delusion...no different than two fleas arguing over which one owns the dog.
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@solo said:
"A great industrial nation ..."
here are the two sentences w.wilson said just prior to what you quoted:
"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country.A great industrial nation...."
Woodrow wilson is the man that was duped(?) into handing over a big chunk of our govt to the banks in the first place..
via wiki:
He began bankrupting America by signing the Federal Reserve Act. This also introduced the IRS, which would tax the income of citizens to pay off the interest on US government loans. The constitutionality of the IRS has been in question based on the fact that it was never properly ratified, and that it may be seen as a violation of the 4th and 5th amendments. -
In order to fix the way the government affects us we need to fix the way the government is elected and to eliminate, or at least greatly mitigate, the effect of personal wealth on who can run for election.
States of the United States are required, like the federal government, to be republican in form, with final authority resting with the people.
*%(#8000FF)["The republican form is defined as one in which the powers of sovereignty are vested in the people and are exercised by the people, either directly, or through representatives chosen by the people, to whom those powers are specially delegated.
Article IV of the US Constitution guarantees to every State in this Union a Republican form of Government. This was required because the states were intended to create and enforce most domestic laws, with the exception of areas delegated to the federal government and prohibited to the states. The founding fathers of the country intended most domestic laws to be handled by the states. Requiring the states to be a republic in form was seen as protecting the citizens' rights and preventing a state from becoming a dictatorship or monarchy, and reflected unwillingness on the part of the original 13 states (all independent republics) to unite with other states that were not republics. Additionally, this requirement ensured that only other republics could join the union.
The original 13 British colonies became independent states after the American Revolution, each having a republican form of government. These independent states initially formed a loose confederation called the United States and then later formed the current United States by ratifying the current U.S. Constitution, creating a union of sovereign states with the union or federal government also being a republic. Any state joining the union later was also required to be a republic."]*
But, over time, the powers of the states have been continuously eroded by the federal government and the representatives of the people are not elected by popular vote.
Furthermore, the election process has become an extraordinarily expensive marathon affordable only by the very wealthy, taking nearly a year with primary elections and associated campaigning.
IMHO, two steps in restoring control to the people would be to eliminate the electoral college so that representatives are elected by popular vote; and limit primaries and associated campaigning to three months.
Three months!! Yes, because with TV, and especially the internet, anyone wishing to reach the people with their message can certainly do that in three months. This is not the 19th century anymore where it took months just to get the word around; or even the 20th century with radio and ultimately television.
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See my other post here;
http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?f=179&t=40678
(so I don't double post, and break forum rules
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"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." ~ Henry Ford
"Too many of us look upon Americans as dollar chasers. This is a cruel libel, even if it is reiterated thoughtlessly by the Americans themselves." - A. Einstein
A couple of fitting quotes for the times ...
Cheers
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I am so NOT proud of what happened in my country yesterday...
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It looks like the Occupy Wall Street movement is gaining momentum! More details can be had here, http://www.occupytogether.org/
It also looks to me that the 'powers' are quite afraid of this movement and not willing to put the troops / police in, to stomp it out as they would have done in the past. It appears Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg is afraid of You Tube! Maybe he was joking but I think not!
I feel something like this would have been unthinkable 20 /30 years ago but these days the power of the Net is practically untouchable. I imagine the 1% in financial control are wondering what to do next. No longer can they manipulate the economies of the World from behind closed doors with impunity. Its now quite easy to identify who these people are. I imagine they don't like this one little bit! There is only, so high, a security wall can be built and they know this. Anonymity has been a great security wall, pre the Net (You Tube, WiKipedia etc), but not any longer.
What's going to happen? I have a feeling this movement will grow simply because there is no 'head' to it. It reminds me the Ganhdi movement in a way but more effective because, as I say there is no 'head' that the 1% can try to 'buy off'.
Maybe we are getting closer to true Democracy in the Western World? A Democracy whereby each citizen will be able to cast their continuing support vote via their mobile phone on a regular basis also debate and table solutions on a regular basis that all can vote on. This probably sounds over simplistic in one way and very complicated in an other, but I feel some way possible with the standard of 'instant' communication we have these days.
In this day and age, it just does not make sense to me that I elect a politician based on what they stand for and says they will do and then they go back on their word and do as they please or are 'encouraged' to do by the 1%.
If I employ someone to do a job for me over a 5 year period and find that after 6 months they are not doing that job I would like to be in a position to force them to do the job as agreed or sack them, not grit my teeth and wait for a further 4 years and 6 months before I can kick them out of the job! Okay, no political system can be changed overnight so we will have to live with the political party system for a while to come!
But what if, an elected Government, having a majority, would also be required to have a majority of citizen continuing support votes on an ongoing basis in order to pass bills / laws as stated in their election manifesto. Surely something like this would keep them on the 'straight and narrow' AND more importantly NOT give the 1% the inclination or ability to 'buy them off'!
Okay, it will be argued that this would be unworkable. But something along these lines would make sure that politicians and political parties would have to be straight on policy matters when seeking election. Once they diverge from their stated policies they would need further approval from the citizens. Its not enough to rely on the 'back benchers' as most of them will sit on their hands dreaming of future promotion etc.
Such a system would also encourage citizens to take more of an interest in politics ..... more that than the candidates hair
Does anyone have any more 'What Ifs'?
Mike
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Regarding the What If's: "The best laid plans of mice and men gang aft agley" to paraphrase someone memorable.
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