Switching from Mac to PC...

Tim M

Thank you Remus. Excuse my ignorance but I didn't understand the graphics card for a laptop suggestion.
Tim

Dual core processor at about 2 GHZ, higher is better when it comes to clock speed.
A couple of gigabytes of RAM, again more is better if you can afford it.
A decent graphics card, Nvidia quadro if you can afford it, if not any nVidia card from around 6600 upwards.

If you do end up getting a laptop, be extra careful that it comes with a graphics card as integrated graphisc=crap SU performance.

remus

Some lower end laptops dont come with a graphics card, instead they have a chip on the motherboard which does all the graphics. This means that less computing power goes towards graphics than if you had a graphics card, as the card is more powerful than the integrated graphics chip.

Hope that makes sense.

Tim M

Yes, thanks.

@remus said:

Some lower end laptops dont come with a graphics card, instead they have a chip on the motherboard which does all the graphics. This means that less computing power goes towards graphics than if you had a graphics card, as the card is more powerful than the integrated graphics chip.

Hope that makes sense.

bigstick

Actually you can get a pretty good dedicated 3d graphics chipset on a reasonably cheap laptop. For say $800 you can get a machine with a 'proper' accelerated 3d graphics chipset. There are only manufacturers to look out for - Nvidia and ATI. You can research the various specs on Google. Needless to say it is less than half the price of a Mac with a comparable spec...

Burkhard

I think you need a real open gl support on that graphic card. Don't know about chipset specs

remus

Quite a lot of info on graphics cards chipsets in the article mentioned here: http://www.sketchucation.com/forums/scf/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=8077

Tim M

I will check the options and article out. Thanks to all. I really appreciate the input and the expertise. This forum is really a great resource and community.

Thanks,
Tim

sketch3d.de

the OpenGL support of PC based 3D graphics accelerators is, because of the long experience the manufacturers do have with this platform, more mature and stable than on the Macitnosh side. Therefore OpenGL based issues regularly mentioned in connection w/ OSX driven systems are much less occuring especially in connection with the nVidia Quadro CAx series of video cards.

If you can afford it, the e.g. Dell Precision workstation notebooks with a Quadro GPU are probably the best choice for running SU on a mobile system yet. Because single core speed is more relevant for SU than multiple but currently unused cores (by SU), focusing on the fastest dual core is recommendable.

hth,
Norbert

Tim M

Thanks Norbert, I’ll check this out too. It appears the nVidia cards are preferred by the SU community.
Tim

@sketch3d.de said:

the OpenGL support of PC based 3D graphics accelerators is, because of the long experience the manufacturers do have with this platform, more mature and stable than on the Macitnosh side. Therefore OpenGL based issues regularly mentioned in connection w/ OSX driven systems are much less occuring especially in connection with the nVidia Quadro CAx series of video cards.

If you can afford it, the e.g. Dell Precision workstation notebooks with a Quadro GPU are probably the best choice for running SU on a mobile system yet. Because single core speed is more relevant for SU than multiple but currently unused cores (by SU), focusing on the fastest dual core is recommendable.

hth,
Norbert

Mike Lucey

Hi Tim,

I'm not sure what you are doing but I run both versions of SU
on my MacBookPro. The Win version is run via Parallels 3.

The reason for using the Win version on Parallels 3 is because
I'm using Podium. It's not the quickest but does the job.

When I switched to the Mac and started to get to grips with Mac
SU it took a little while to get used to some of the key stokes.
But again I was also getting used to the Mac way of things at
the same time.

I think your learning curve will be with the PC Win more that
SketchUp itself!

If you are going for a Win Laptop I agree that Dell is a good
bet as their backup (in my experience) is quite good. But again
I can't understand why you are taking this route

Mike

Tim M

Mike,

I would prefer to stay with the Mac but I need a contingency plan in case the finances don’t allow a new one. I know a PC is in the budget. I’m crossing my fingers.

Tim

@mike lucey said:

Hi Tim,

I'm not sure what you are doing but I run both versions of SU
on my MacBookPro. The Win version is run via Parallels 3.

The reason for using the Win version on Parallels 3 is because
I'm using Podium. It's not the quickest but does the job.

When I switched to the Mac and started to get to grips with Mac
SU it took a little while to get used to some of the key stokes.
But again I was also getting used to the Mac way of things at
the same time.

I think your learning curve will be with the PC Win more that
SketchUp itself!

If you are going for a Win Laptop I agree that Dell is a good
bet as their backup (in my experience) is quite good. But again
I can't understand why you are taking this route

Mike

kmead

Be sure and compare the same specs on the PC as on the Mac, the Macs are much more cost competitive than you might think. The biggest issue I have with Macs is that they don't have a mid line box with an upgradeable video card available at the moment. I am toddering on with my 7 year old Mac tower which has been doing surprisingly well. My MacBook Pro is more than adequate and can go where I go.

If they offered a midline tower with an upgradeable graphics card, I would drop my 1800 tomorrow to buy it.

I don't often see graphics glitches on any mac, I see more on my bosses MSW box but so it goes.

Keep in mind that buying the memory after market is much better than buying it from Apple (or Dell for that matter) cost wise.

Tim M

Currently I have a G4 450 MHz running on OS 9. It has been and still is an excellent machine. I have had it for 8 plus years. Of course I can't run SU on it unless I upgrade to OS 10. One of our IT guys at the office advised against it saying I would be better off in the long run with a new computer. What I don't know is if OS 10 would work on my current computer or not. Is anyone running SU on a computer like this? Maybe there is hope in an upgrade.

I will compare both platforms. Thanks for the advice.
Tim

@kmead said:

Be sure and compare the same specs on the PC as on the Mac, the Macs are much more cost competitive than you might think. The biggest issue I have with Macs is that they don't have a mid line box with an upgradeable video card available at the moment. I am toddering on with my 7 year old Mac tower which has been doing surprisingly well. My MacBook Pro is more than adequate and can go where I go.

If they offered a midline tower with an upgradeable graphics card, I would drop my 1800 tomorrow to buy it.

I don't often see graphics glitches on any mac, I see more on my bosses MSW box but so it goes.

Keep in mind that buying the memory after market is much better than buying it from Apple (or Dell for that matter) cost wise.

Glenn at home

[quote="Tim M"]Currently I have a G4 450 MHz running on OS 9. It has been and still is an excellent machine. I have had it for 8 plus years. Of course I can't run SU on it unless I upgrade to OS 10. One of our IT guys at the office advised against it saying I would be better off in the long run with a new computer. What I don't know is if OS 10 would work on my current computer or not. Is anyone running SU on a computer like this? Maybe there is hope in an upgrade.

I will compare both platforms. Thanks for the advice.
Tim

I'd have to agree with him. What is the ram in a G4 450, PC-100? Does this one even have an AGP video card? Sure OSX will run on it but why do it?
Looking at http://www.everymac.com I see that these could have a 2X AGP slot and they did have a 100mhz system bus speed. Looks like a mini would be a faster machine that these in OSX. I got rid of my old PowerMac6500 for this reason. Not worth the upgrade headaches

http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g4/stats/powermac_g4_450.html

Tim M

Glenn,

I can’t remember the exact specs on my G4 but I do remember I maxed out the RAM a few years ago. His concern was the same as your’s it probably isn’t worth the headaches. Oh well, I’d rather know this than attempt a futile upgrade.

Thanks

@unknownuser said:

I'd have to agree with him. What is the ram in a G4 450, PC-100? Does this one even have an AGP video card? Sure OSX will run on it but why do it?
Looking at http://www.everymac.com I see that these could have a 2X AGP slot and they did have a 100mhz system bus speed. Looks like a mini would be a faster machine that these in OSX. I got rid of my old PowerMac6500 for this reason. Not worth the upgrade headaches

http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g4/stats/powermac_g4_450.html

caronte01

Tim

I recently moved from a pc to a mac. As someone else pointed before, considering specs, macs are competitive, when compared to a similarly spec´ed peecee.

I work on a macbook, which i upgraded to 2 GB of ram, and find sketchup performance adequate, even with integrated graphics. Take into consideration the fact that a lot of stuff you see on your screen on OSX is opengl accelerated, so apple makes sure performance is ok. I work with hardware acceleration on, and there are no visible glitches (something you more than likely would have on a pecee with integrated graphics), and speed is ok on small and medium to large models. In this case, it´s not just a matter of raw speed, but also good drivers, and the mac certainly does have good ones.

I guess it all depends on the kind and size of models you do. I would be more than happy to have a macbook pro though, but it was out of my budget.

I also use a late gen imac, with ati graphics, and performance is very good, but, strangely i get more graphic glitches than on the macbook. Nothing terrible though.

Certain plugins do work only on peecee, but you have several option on a mac to run windows for those, if you need to.

Your computer is imo too old to run sketchup properly though.

It´s up to you in the end, but if it was my call, i would stick with osx. Not pretending to turn this into a flame war, but if you are used to mac, the switch will be full of surprises, and not all of them will be good.

The peecee has more variety, software wise, i agree, but most freeware, shareware, low cost programs on a mac are imo of a higher quality than equivalents on peecee.

Tim M

All excellent points and will make for good ammunition, I mean talking points, when I present my findings to my financial advisor/my wife.
Thanks

@caronte01 said:

Tim

I recently moved from a pc to a mac. As someone else pointed before, considering specs, macs are competitive, when compared to a similarly spec´ed peecee.

I work on a macbook, which i upgraded to 2 GB of ram, and find sketchup performance adequate, even with integrated graphics. Take into consideration the fact that a lot of stuff you see on your screen on OSX is opengl accelerated, so apple makes sure performance is ok. I work with hardware acceleration on, and there are no visible glitches (something you more than likely would have on a pecee with integrated graphics), and speed is ok on small and medium to large models. In this case, it´s not just a matter of raw speed, but also good drivers, and the mac certainly does have good ones.

I guess it all depends on the kind and size of models you do. I would be more than happy to have a macbook pro though, but it was out of my budget.

I also use a late gen imac, with ati graphics, and performance is very good, but, strangely i get more graphic glitches than on the macbook. Nothing terrible though.

Certain plugins do work only on peecee, but you have several option on a mac to run windows for those, if you need to.

Your computer is imo too old to run sketchup properly though.

It´s up to you in the end, but if it was my call, i would stick with osx. Not pretending to turn this into a flame war, but if you are used to mac, the switch will be full of surprises, and not all of them will be good.

The peecee has more variety, software wise, i agree, but most freeware, shareware, low cost programs on a mac are imo of a higher quality than equivalents on peecee.

Mike Lucey

Tim,

Have you thought about building a HackIntosh, could be fun!
Check out, Build a Hackintosh Mac for Under $800 at,
http://lifehacker.com/software/hack-attack/build-a-hackintosh-mac-for-under-800-321913.php

They measure up quite well against MacBook Pros. Not too
sure how kosher this is but I can't see anything wrong with
it as once Apple moved to Intel they opened the gates for
DIY. You still have to buy Leopard though. Mmmmm I wonder
does Leopard have a clause with regard to it use ... no
doubt it has, must look!

Mike

juju

at caronte01: peecee - dunno what that is...

You probably meant a PC, the abbreviation for Personal Computer.

Anyhows, just thought I'd toss in my 10c. Always entertaining to hear people explain why they are Apple / PC fans.

Tim M

I haven’t heard of that before but I will check it out.
Thanks

@mike lucey said:

Tim,

Have you thought about building a HackIntosh, could be fun!
Check out, Build a Hackintosh Mac for Under $800 at,
http://lifehacker.com/software/hack-attack/build-a-hackintosh-mac-for-under-800-321913.php

They measure up quite well against MacBook Pros. Not too
sure how kosher this is but I can't see anything wrong with
it as once Apple moved to Intel they opened the gates for
DIY. You still have to buy Leopard though. Mmmmm I wonder
does Leopard have a clause with regard to it use ... no
doubt it has, must look!

Mike