Has anyone noticed the progression to a 'cashless' economy?

srx · 15 May 2015, 07:14

After many years of monopoly $$$$$$ printing machines are out of business. The end of $$$$. Euro-Asia central bank is taking control with its own currencies. So, let's make even more convenient system, where besides it has no real value, we do not have to print money at all. Just type it in the system. Who will have the control?

Mike Lucey · 15 May 2015, 20:25

This will only be of interest to non US citizens currently.

I came across BitGold today and am intrigued with what I see so far. In essence its a way to buy gold for a 1% levy, have it stored / insured for free, fully own it at all times, send and receive gold value payments and even have solid gold (10g Cubes or 1Kg bars) delivered to your door for a small cost. BitGold advise they they are launching a BitGold debit card (MasterCard) that will facilitate ATM cash withdrawals and other card payments.

Here is a link, https://bitgold.com/r/mWPVjY to get some free gold, 0.25g worth €8.61 currently ....... next year it could be worth a lot more if the financial system goes belly up

Mike

Krisidious · 15 May 2015, 22:06

Why only Non-Us? Fox watchers love gold... they're always talking about the system going down and gold being it.

Bep · 15 May 2015, 23:56

Gold wont give you peace of mind, read: http://nok-ind.tumblr.com/post/2100405115/mansa-musa-one-of-the-richest-men-who-ever-lived
You can not own, nor put in a bank or safe, the most valuable things in life.

roland joseph · 16 May 2015, 12:01

@unknownuser said:

a self-selecting few who will influence that value much more than the rest of us.

Some of us simple folk have just departed into the forest to avoid banks. The picture is of my wood silo. I have two that hold approx. 8 bush cords each, that's about 7000$. I keep them full.
The silo is my pay pal when it comes to purchasing many things from the community. Eggs, milk, bread/wheat, maple syrup, feed for animals, crafts, furniture, tractors...

If you are looking for freedom then this is its real currency. I have watched free-enterprise kill democracy and freedom in the last 50 years. It is surprising how many others have just moved away from it as well. I recommend it to everyone. Once you get a taste of freedom again (very few in the free world have it any more) You will never look back.

PayPal is the antithesis of the freedom and privacy I enjoy.

Daniel · 20 May 2015, 13:58

Mike, the move to a more digital currency (which started decades ago in the US with the advent of debit cards) will not eliminate crime, only transform it. As evidenced by the rise in cyber crimes, such as identity theft. Nowadays, a thief no longer has to have physical access to your money to rob you blind.

Back in '89 I worked briefly in a bank as a coin wrapper, housed in the bank's vault. Even back then there was surprisingly little money in the vault, since most transactions by then were done electronically. That is why the U.S. Treasury stopped printing large denominations.

pbacot · 20 May 2015, 14:47

Look in the headlines. These too big to fail banks have finally been given criminal convictions but will continue to prey on people, just cuz. Paypal has been found guilty of signing people into a credit scheme without their knowledge. I'm currently trying to get some relatively small fees back from a "no fee" credit card (never used) (from my local banker) that, surprise, charges $50 a year for "rewards program" I never knew about.

Anyway. No, I have not noticed a change to cashless for many years in my daily life. Just more predatory banks. I use debit cards just about the same I did years ago.

Mike Lucey · 20 May 2015, 22:41

@krisidious said:

Why only Non-Us? Fox watchers love gold... they're always talking about the system going down and gold being it.

Kris, It must be bloody annoying when you come up against this kind of thing particularly when in Canadian company of what appears to be good and solid standing.

I don't know why the US is excluded, probably because of some financial restrictions when it comes to purchase of gold or trading in a gold account. Could it date back to the Nixon days? I'll see if I can find out more.

Krisidious · 21 May 2015, 04:05

Thanks Mike... That's Awesome Roland...

roland joseph · 22 May 2015, 01:39

While I'm at it, here is another currency found in the bush. You might be able to guess. Quite an elaborate piece of architecture. Model that one for me.

Krisidious · 22 May 2015, 02:40

Some things cannot be drawn, they must be made, for if you draw them first something is lost... This is one of those things. It's gorgeous.

roland joseph · 22 May 2015, 10:48

@unknownuser said:

It's gorgeous.
Can you quess?

andybot · 22 May 2015, 12:14

@roland joseph said:

Can you quess?
Are you talking about a sugar bush?

Krisidious · 22 May 2015, 15:33

I was going to say still or rendering station. But I think Andy has it, since it's up north... But it's so cold, how does syrup run in the winter?

pbacot · 22 May 2015, 15:44

Depending on how far north that picture could be May! haha

reminds me of the occasional structures we used in Hawaii. If it leans "kapakai" add another brace!

roland joseph · 22 May 2015, 19:21

Yes Andybot it is my Sugar Shack with shack being the key word.

@unknownuser said:

[/But it's so cold,quote]

Was it ever. Our season was weird. It started 3 weeks early, ran long enough for me to collect a batch (2days) but then it snowed and dropped to 25 below 0. The image is of me cooking the batch that day in the snow at about 25 below. Also that is an HDRI, the sun had not even come up yet. That is just the moon shining.

@unknownuser said:

If it leans "kapakai" add another brace!

Exactly!

Mike Amos · 1 Jun 2015, 09:14

I am another who despises pray pal, I WILL NOT use them preferring to go without whatever it is for sale.

I got caught up in one of their security failures and got nothing back, not even an apology.
Prey pal are doing a 'microsoft' closing out competition by low fee's for small businesses but grabbing that back by only processing a card four times before 'insisting' the buyer get an account by refusing further transactions. This is anti competitive as other banks will continue to process from credit and debit cards without the buyer being coerced into opening an account.
Prey pal pay lip service to security yet they still have staff smuggling account details, including access and security codes which are then sold on the dark net, they are building a large amount of problems for their clients that will not get better soon.

I know this sounds very conspiracy theorist and shiny hat alert alike but if you get caught once it makes a lot of sense to not get caught a second time.

juju · 1 Jun 2015, 11:25

@mike amos said:

I am another who despises pray pal, I WILL NOT use them preferring to go without whatever it is for sale.

I got caught up in one of their security failures and got nothing back, not even an apology.

Prey pal are doing a 'microsoft' closing out competition by low fee's for small businesses but grabbing that back by only processing a card four times before 'insisting' the buyer get an account by refusing further transactions. This is anti competitive as other banks will continue to process from credit and debit cards without the buyer being coerced into opening an account.

Prey pal pay lip service to security yet they still have staff smuggling account details, including access and security codes which are then sold on the dark net, they are building a large amount of problems for their clients that will not get better soon.

I know this sounds very conspiracy theorist and shiny hat alert alike but if you get caught once it makes a lot of sense to not get caught a second time.

were you using the service for receiving payments as well as making purchases?

Krisidious · 1 Jun 2015, 11:46

Bank of America charges people who do not have an account to cash a check... Even if the check is written to them. They also make them go inside the bank and do not allow them to use the drive through. Last time I was in they made me cut the line in front of non-account holders. It's getting crazy.

Aerilius · 1 Jun 2015, 16:10

Interesting how this discussion has so far focussed much at Paypal.

Has anybody thought about these points:

Basic right for an accepted currency
Currently cash plays the role of an (almost) universal currency, at least within a monetary union and for medium prices. If leave your home with enough value of cash in your pocket, you can feel relaxed that you can buy everything without the risk of being unable to pay (having enough amount but of incompatible type). Every member of a society can take part in using that common denominator currency (just by getting cash in exchange, or finding it on the street). No registration or identification or income statements necessary.

Neutrality
Other ways of payment often have a third party in the middle, which requires additional trust, agreement between payment services, and compatibility of their proprietary payment systems/pay cards/APIs. As long as systems aim for competition and exclusion (diverse credit card systems, Google/Apple Pay, Paypal which is not under banking law!), they are good as option but not suited as common denominator. Once cash will not be universally accepted anymore, it needs a successor, which ideally would be neutral and unbiased without giving advantage or control to specific companies over others.

Data minimization
I have bought ice cream, the ice cream seller got his money and I got my ice cream, but nothing else was exchanged and we didn't know each other and will never know. I even have stayed in hotels anonymously. Not that data minimization or anonymity is crucial (as it would be for presecuted people like E. Snowden), but it guarantees that a moment of life has fulfilled all what it was supposed to (satiation) and that everything else can get forgotten, without future consequences (like some big company logging somewhere forever that you have eaten ice cream).