Bonzai 3D First Impressions

chango70 · 6 Feb 2009, 19:02

oooooouuuu! Bonzai looks interesting. Sketchup has some stiff competition coming its way! Which can only be a good thing. I am looking forward to SU8 even more now.

pilou · 6 Feb 2009, 19:16

Orbit = Ctrl + Right Mouse Button
Pan = Click not release Wheel Mouse Button and move

Seems the prog run only connected to the Net, is that the same for you?

linea · 6 Feb 2009, 20:19

I can't get it to run at all.

bonzai3d support · 6 Feb 2009, 20:49

Gentlemen (and ladies?),

Thank you for taking the opportunity to try our new software, bonzai3d! Bonzai3d is a new 3D modeler developed to fill in the demand for a quick, easy, simple but, most importantly, geometrically robust approach to 3D.

We have worked hard to make it as powerful, user friendly, and intuitive as possible. We are convinced that if you take the time to watch the introductory videos, and give it a test drive, that you will find it to be both easy to use, as well as a powerful modeling program.

bonzai3d is still in beta, so some irregularities are expected, and these will be corrected as soon as we are informed about them. However, some of the comments posted in this thread raise suspicions that there may be problems with the systems on which it is being run. bonZai3d utilizes OpenGL extensively, so it is rather important that you hvae properly installed and up to date video drivers. Likewise, for operating systems. We do not want to bother you with too many technicalities, but we will be happy to help you if you are interested in the details. Also, if you have any specific questions about features of b3d, we shall be happy to answer, here or on our forum: http://www.bonzai3d.com/beta_forum.html (It is preferable to post questions to our forum, as we monitor these more frequently -- and thus we can respond more quickly.) You can also email us at support@bonzai3d.com if you like.

Concluding this we would like to thank you all for hosting a discussion about b3d. We would also like to take this opportunity and express our respect for the SketchUp application. We have no interest in "killing" it. On the contrary, we expect SketchUp and b3d to compliment each other and hopefully this will be made easier when SketchUp evolves to the next level, as many of you have been requesting. Of course, you can also expect b3d to continue evolving as we hear feedback from you, and our other users.

We will make another post that includes more specific answers to questions you have raised here.

bonzai3d Technical Support
support@bonzai3d.com

bonzai3d support · 6 Feb 2009, 21:10

To address a few specific issues that have been raised on this thread:

Initially demand for bonzai3d was incredible and it swamped our servers. We have dramatically increased capacity, and it should be running properly now.
If you are still having stability issues on Windows after updating your system and video driver, please send your system specifications to support@bonzai3d.com so we can test with your specific hardware configuration.
Navigation: You can zoom in or out with the wheel mouse. You can orbit the scene by clicking and dragging with the Ctrl key (WIN) or Command key (OS X) pressed while dragging the cursor with the left mouse button pressed. You can pan by dragging with the middle mouse wheel pressed. You can navigate with the arrow keys. And you can access many more navigation functions via the Edit Menu: Key Shortcuts: Direct View Navigation commands.
The introductory videos are not yet on our web site, but we are working on this. If you have downloaded and run bonzai3d Beta, then you can access the videos from the start-up screen. See the Navigation video -- and others for details on how bonzai3d works.
Fakircho -- you mention that you can only zoom out with your track pad. Which navigation technique are you trying to use?
Lewiswadsworth -- You mention that you are getting reproducible crashes. Can you please send your BNZ.zip file to support@bonzai3d.com so we can investigate this?
Tim Danaher -- There are some similarities with formZ, but there are many many differences. Have you checked the introductory videos yet, and really given it a try?

... to be continued

bonzai3d Support

Ecuadorian · 6 Feb 2009, 21:13

Wow, SketchUcation is extremely visible in Google... Every single time we start discussing a new app, a representative comes here in no time.
I'll check the Bonzai videos. I remember dissin' SketchUp for years until I sat one entire day, from morning to late night, to watch all the 28 tutorial videos, and then started to design immediately. I had never before learned to use a 3D app in a single day! I hope Bonzai3D has a similar learning curve... I said hope.

solo · 6 Feb 2009, 21:23

@unknownuser said:

We would also like to take this opportunity and express our respect for the SketchUp application. We have no interest in "killing" it. On the contrary, we expect SketchUp and b3d to compliment each other

well said.

B3D support, I suppose that the hype for this product has been high so many here will hold it to a similar bar when evaluating a product that was rumoured to be the all in one 3D modeling solution.

Thank you for taking the time to respond to our members regarding your product and welcome to GSCF by the way.

bonzai3d support · 6 Feb 2009, 21:27

bonzai3d should work fine when not connected to the net -- although the net is required to view the introductory videos. If you are having trouble running bonzai3d when you are not connected, please email your specifications to support@bonzai3d.com so we can invistigate this.

Ecuadorian (et al) -- I am sure that if you take the time to fully investigate bonzai3d, you will not be disappointed.

Again, please don't hesitate to contact us directly if you are have any questions or problems. You can also check our Forum at: http://www.bonzai3d.com/beta_forum.html , where you can get more info and quicker feedback.

b3d!

bonzai3d support

Tim Danaher · 6 Feb 2009, 23:47

Bonzai3DSupport --

Thanks for your presence here -- very much appreciated.

Will be back tomorrer with more observations -- or as and when time permits.

bonzai3d support · 7 Feb 2009, 01:43

Gentlemen,

Thanks for the warm reception on your forum. We hope to be able to provide answers to all your questions.

We have found that there can be issues when running bonzai3d without an internet connection. We are working to get this resolved ASAP.

Thanks for bringing this to our attention.

bonzai3d Support

xrok1 · 7 Feb 2009, 02:12

@tim danaher said:

@xrok1 said:

the thing i don't understand is that there are ump-teen 3d packages out there but somehow the elegant simplicity of SK seems to evade every other developer in the industry? nobody wants to make "another SK". i say please do, but finish the job, do it right.

There's 3DVia -- as to whether they're doing it 'right'...

302 Found

(www.3dvia.com)

3DVia is good for making paper dolls IMO, its been around a long time and hasn't really developed.

@unknownuser said:

We have no interest in "killing" it. On the contrary, we expect SketchUp and b3d to compliment each other

thats what we (I anyway) don't want, more complimentary software. gee, lets add one more step to our process

lewiswadsworth · 7 Feb 2009, 02:23

@bonzai3d support said:

We would also like to take this opportunity and express our respect for the SketchUp application. We have no interest in "killing" it. On the contrary, we expect SketchUp and b3d to compliment each other and hopefully this will be made easier when SketchUp evolves to the next level, as many of you have been requesting. Of course, you can also expect b3d to continue evolving as we hear feedback from you, and our other users.

Mmmm...at the AIA convention earlier this year, the word at your booth was not killing--I'll grant you that. It was replacement. When I casually expressed some skepticism concerning this, I inadvertently provoked an awkward scene that was witnessed by other members of this forum and which is best left undescribed further.

Now that we have all become a little more pessimistic about the future of SketchUp (it can't coast on Rubies forever), I'll also grant that the time is ripe for a replacement. So I will give your program a few more tries as time permits and try to figure out what I did that crashed it. But I agree with Tim's earlier opinion that there is a lot here that is obviously derived from FormZ. And I once quit a well-paying job with a visualization firm for an intern architect's negligible salary when it became obvious that my destiny was to be the "FormZ guy" for the rest of my time in that visualization firm. I've never regretted that decision, ever. I'm staring right now at the long-unused dongles for about $4k worth of various earlier versions of FormZ that were purchased using my own not-very-great savings. I keep them around to remind me of this so-often-overlooked fact: it's not what a program can do, it's what a person can comfortably do with the program.

remus · 7 Feb 2009, 09:05

Ecuadorian, have you tried it with an SU6 file? As SU7 wasnt released very long ago they might not have support for the new file format yet.

Tim Danaher · 7 Feb 2009, 09:09

@bonzai3d support said:

bonzai3d should work fine when not connected to the net -- although the net is required to view the introductory videos.
bonzai3d support

As I stated previously, please make these available as a separate download so we can peruse them at our leisure. the waiting times for them to load are just not viable at the moment.

Oh, and another thing: some way to navigate with the mouse. The disconnect between bonzai's way and the other programs I use is just too great. And that Cone of Vision thing -- it's pants.

SU has it nearly right: MMB -- Orbit/Tumble, MMB + LMB -- Pan, Scroll wheel -- Zoom. (I know you have scroll-wheel zoom in Banzai). My suggestion would be MMB + RMB -- Scroll. On some mice (like mine) the scroll-wheel action makes zooming unpredictable and erratic.

Tim Danaher · 7 Feb 2009, 09:41

@remus said:

Ecuadorian, have you tried it with an SU6 file? As SU7 wasnt released very long ago they might not have support for the new file format yet.

Indeed, Remus. I does import SU6 files.

Ecuadorian · 8 Feb 2009, 06:16

I've just noticed that Bonzai has .skp files listed in the Import dialog, but can't open a single one of my SketchUp models. And .skp files do not appear at all in the export list. If this is supposed to "complement" and not "kill" SketchUp, the development team has to sort this out quickly.

Feb-8 Edit: I suspected it could open SU6 files, but I still feel that not being able to export to SketchUp is what I call putting a "lock-in" on your data. Easy comes, but not easy goes...

chango70 · 8 Feb 2009, 07:53

If Bonzai3D can pull off nurb support with an intuitive UI then it is onto something. Does anyone have anything to say about its UI? My copy crashes as soon as I clich in the modelling space.

lewiswadsworth · 8 Feb 2009, 16:12

I dislike the Bonzai UI. It's not as bad as FormZ in UI, but it's not particularly intuitive. I haven't had that much time to play with it (between crashes), but there are simply too many tools doing too many very similar things. That breakdown of the selection tool (in every other modern modeler) into three different tools is really annoying. I really do think of Bonzai as a rebranded and repriced version of its ancestor...it's "FormZ Lite."

I can make Rhino do what Bonzai does already (including the implicit history bit), and Rhino will do dimensions and in fact function as a full-out 2D CAD program as well as a NURBS modeler. Rhino doesn't have a UI any more fluid than Bonzai, but at least I know enough about it to teach it. And Rhino 5 is supposedly around the corner (relatively speaking), with realtime shadows and more parametrics. Who knows? Perhaps I already have my SketchUp killer, and have for the last 8 years.

Mike Lucey · 9 Feb 2009, 09:51

@lewiswadsworth said:

it's not what a program can do, it's what a person can comfortably do with the program

Lewis, you never said a truer word

Mike

thomthom · 9 Feb 2009, 13:32

Anyone able to use it? To me to crashes every time after about 30 seconds.

XP Pro 32bit, Quadro FX 3500, 4GB RAM