Fee question
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Hello,
I've been asked to do a SketchUp model of a new two story house. Just the exteriors. Up to now I have done many models and perspectives (not all SU) but I haven't often been asked to estimate it, and (doh!) when I did models pro bono I haven't always been keeping the time. I want to ask for a reasonable fee but, I know I am not as fast as most, by a long shot. So I'll be trying to keep it reasonable while watching my time and working as quickly as I can.
Attached are a couple elevations and the roof plan. I have the CAD files and I know the building inside out. Here's the question: What time would you estimate for this work? I will look at the respondents (whether or not you are a Speed Challenge champion) and the overall sense. Or if you want to give dollar amount, that's up to you.
- Only Exteriors, hidden line or monochrome, SU output (export to .png)
- Windows and doors: simple flat images, import from CAD. Cut out the glass.
- Probably provide 6 views. (Charge extra for the time to get a movie to them.)
- Set shadows correctly and choose some good times for shadows in each scene.
Don't be shy. It's all hypothetical "ballpark" of course, as I can't give you all the data, and I'll be negotiating with them for whatever is fair. They've seen my work. Thanks for the help.
Oh, and I'd love to pass the work on, but, Guess what? I need the money. And the challenge.
Attached is also an image of a guest house that I did for them which shows the style somewhat (not finished, but they still liked it). And these are not my designs. I work quite a bit with this architect, for whom I am doing the plans and models.
Peter
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When I commission a full on, full color, to scale, 3d, artistic, detailed, accessorized, professional rendering for my work, I expect to pay between 1k to 2k for a 18"x24" board. I would not accept anything that is not professional, and expect it to sizzle (no CAD conditions allowed, too much rest on making a good presentation).
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Id say its about a days work, so 8 hours x your hourly rate=price. If it doesnt seem reasonable (too high or too low) just knock it up/down a bit. Honolulu's estimates are a good guideline, id say.
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Peter, without knowing your location or what the professional rates are in your area, it's hard to offer an opinion as to how much you should charge, but you should consider these factors:
- Based on the images you posted, it appears he's given you all the information so modelling should be easy. You aren't being asked to do any design work (correct?), or to run it through a renderer (correct?), so it is akin to a drafting job.
- It's straight SU output; the shadows should be easy if you know the location and orientation. Are you being asked to create a presentation with the images, or just providing the images to the architect and he takes it from there?
- You should have in mind how long it would take you to do the modeling. Do you know anyone in the profession in your area who is at the same level of skill/experience (if not, you might ask the architect what the going rate is for an intern/draftsman of your level). Keep in mind that a person's hourly pay rate is not what their employer charges to the job. My boss charges $75/hr for my work, but I certainly don't make that much. But for me to charge anything less than $75/hr for freelance work would be unfair to my employer and disparaging to my profession.
Do not undersell yourself; if you do, and he gives you future work, he will expect to pay you the same rate. The architect is a professional, so he is aware of the value of your time and skills. Also, make sure it is clear what you are charging for, and any additional work (such as modeling design revisions or alternates, or renderings) will be extra.
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Thanks Daniel, Honolulu, and Remus,
I'm in California and the rates are pretty good in my area. I am thinking my standard rates are too high for my SU speed at the moment, as I am an experienced designer/draftsman.
This won't be a presentation by either of us. The house is being built. They just want something like the image I posted (which the client liked), more of a massing study, more of a sketch (doing it all backwards?). I think it is more of a fun thing for the client, waiting for her house, than anything else.
I think the texture colors trees, rendering, post-processing etc. would eat up the most time for me. I've done some of that and as you know, you can mess with it forever. So keeping it simple on this one. There's no design or rendering, and I drew the plans so I can pretty well find my way about the building.
I work with this architect all the time. It is important to keep my fees up where I can continue this work as a living. So it's a balancing act until I get faster, but the interest in this work is gaining, from others as well. I thought of this as about a "day" but imagine it could take me longer.
Peter
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Given what you just posted, I say $750 is fair. It probably equates to $75-100/hour and it's in the range of affordability. SU models are a tremendous asset to the contractor as well; this should not be overlooked when you negotiate your fee.
Let us know. The building, while beautiful, looks fairly simple to model.
EDIT: I never get too hung up in hourly rates except for additional services, so if you underestimate your time, so be it. The only time I ever did a model for another architect, I charged $2,500. It was a fully textured model of a 5,000 sf house where the roof could be layered off to expose the floor plan with full height walls. I did get the impression that my fee was a little high, but I got paid.
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Thanks for the comment Ron. That's near what I was looking at. Maybe even lower, as I am not modeling the windows (well maybe) really, I think with a little push pull (a number of them are recessed anyway) and making "glass" they'll look all right in a hidden line, or sketchy style. I'll post it if it works out, maybe take it further, if so moved. There's a lot of site work too, walls etc, so I'll have to see where we draw the line or if I can stop myself once started.
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Pete, modeling the windows is a breeze with windowizer. Like you say, recessing the windows, doing a 3" offset and applying a transparent texture may work just fine. Site work could take a little time (I find simple triangulation and smoothing works great), but it's all fun, right? Say $500 then?
EDIT: LOL..stopping yourself once you start; that's always been my problem.
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The "going rate" for a colored front elevation rendering seemed to be around $500 around Denver. Basically it was competing against the watercolor artists that permeate the back of most Denver area real estate magazines. For some strange reason the real estate sector in the Denver area is obsessed with these watercolor renderings some of which border on being naive art.
The problem however when basing this rate with a Sketch-Up model is that it goes beyond a mere “flat” rendering of an architectural structure. The tendency is to work the model on all four sides including site development to a certain extent and development of details well beyond the ability of traditional rendering “artists.” Additionally, the client will also have a tendency to request a multitude of color and material changes. Thus you also become a “color consultant” of sorts in addition to a 3D modeler and renderer.
In the end I believe it takes about 3 working days (24 hours) to create a 3D model and rendering. This includes the above mentioned color and material changes. $500 is the minimum for a good competent rendering. In my experience the price range is anywhere from $500 to $1,500 so essentially the proposal should read:
“For an amount not to exceed one-thousand five-hundred dollars and zero cents ($1,500.00).”
“Billing to be based on an hourly rate of ______ /hr.”
If you think 1,500 is too high just adjust the above quote. It could be lower if you get a bulk contract with numerous renderings. If you are not familiar with the client also include a requirement of a retainer of around ten-percent (10%) of the maximum cost.
Emphasize the final cost for the client as opposed to an hourly rate especially if you’re thinking of a range of $75-100/hour which will scare off most people in this current economic environment.
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