SketchUp and Rubies on Linux (yes, it works)

lewiswadsworth · 3 Aug 2008, 15:04

More SU on WINE on Ubuntu 64-bit notes:

I installed this again yesterday (had to wipe a partition...turns out that having 64bit and 32bit versions of Ubuntu on the same drive can be problematic) and tried to do some actual project work with SU once I had it going.

With another couple of minor WINE updates, SU now installs with no differences from the Windows installation process, as long as one allows WINE to install Gecko so that it can render HTML (used in the SU TOD window, for instance). Layout still doesn't work at all, although you must allow the Installer to pointlessly download .NET before it will continue with SU's installation.

There is a noticeable problem, once SU file sizes get a little bigger in this system: certain visual operations don't immediately appear on the screen. For instance, a zoom extents operation does not complete (or perhaps the window simply doesn't redraw) until one clicks somewhere in SU and begins another operation; the same sort of thing happens with hiding/unhiding objects. This can get a little tedious when editing groups and components...it is difficult to know, until you start another operation, whether a component/group is open for editing or not.

Also, 2D exports to DWG format failed about 50% of the time with a Bugsplat, although when they did work they were completed in about half the time it takes on Windows XP. Graphic exports to PNG and JPG complete much, much faster than they do on Windows...almost instantaneous with large resolutions (3000-4000 pixels) and shadows/anti-aliasing on.

eter · 6 Aug 2008, 19:28

Thanks to this thread I'm now running SketchUp on my Ubuntu partition. That Windows partition is suddenly looking a little superfluous.

Thanks for the instructions, although as Lewis observed, this is becoming more and more straightforward with newer releases of WINE.

lewiswadsworth · 6 Aug 2008, 19:53

?eter, are you experiencing the lag in hiding/showing/zooming that I noted in my previous post? It's only slightly annoying (much less annoying than trying to get dual monitors to run on Ubuntu), but I'm curious to know if anyone else has had the problem or had it and done something about it.

eter · 7 Aug 2008, 03:22

No trouble in zooming/hiding/showing that I've noticed yet, although I haven't worked on a really complex model. I'm running the 32 bit version because my home pachine is a P4. The one problem I did notice was that the tool windows wouldn't dock to each other when I moved them together-in fact they behaved pretty strangely all round- not collapsing when you clikc the title bar etc. But it certainly seems functional so far.

lewiswadsworth · 7 Aug 2008, 12:25

The toolbar problem seems to turn up on both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of Ubuntu. It would be interesting to know if it exists on WINE on other distros.

Scienthsine · 7 Aug 2008, 15:25

If other people don't have a problem with the view not refreshing from some things, then it's probley your video drivers... which is likely considering the shape the nvidia and ati drivers for linux are in atm.

However, this might be easily fixable. It sounds to me like it just doesn't refresh in some places where it should, and so you get no change until an action forces a refresh. It's unlikely that the operation is actually waiting, although I guess this could be possible if the events are somehow getting sent to sketchup late... but I don't think this is it.

So, we just need to try to force the view to refresh. Maybe one or a few of the observer classes can watch for changes, and invalidate the view? As a last resort we could launch a non-modal web dialog thing and have a javascript timeout that invalidates the view... but I think this would mean that we couldn't use another script with web-dialogs... right? (Haven't used one in my scripts yet, and haven't used anyone elses scripts either... but I assume that you can only have one running at a time?)

I might attempt to install via wine tonight, as I actually just reinstalled windows on a 10 gig drive a few weeks ago for sketchup... it's the only thing I boot windows for. (Well and starcraft... but if I can run sketchup under wine, I'll bite the bullet and run starcraft in wine also.)

[Edit] Also it could be wine in combination with a driver... anyway, we need to report it to wine and if it's not their problem, report it to your video driver people.

mozzie · 8 Aug 2008, 00:08

Another data point.
I understand that the SU install works for some NVidia graphics cards, but not for others?

Anyway, I thought I'd give it a go. I run SU on a WinXp laptop that's in hospital.
My other system is a Shuttle m/b with integrated/on-board Intel graphics chip (82865G Integrated Graphics Controller), Mandriva 2008.1, & Samsung 940bw monitor at 1440 x 900 - 24bpp.
X driver (Intel 810 and above),
Wine 1.1.2. I haven done any MS registration tho'.

SU Pro (licensed) installs successfully after making the registry changes and Gecko.
Icon appears on desktop. Launches fine EXCEPT the window is black - menus are fine and appear to work. If I draw lines/rectangles (even though I can't see them) SU appears to have done them, as it then wants to save on exit. So it appears to be a screen drawing problem?
Any suggestions?

lewiswadsworth · 8 Aug 2008, 02:33

That's the integrated graphics controller, I'm afraid. Bad or no OpenGL implementation on Linux. Sorry...it's the same result I get on an ATI graphics card on a Dell XPS notebook. But NVidia 7 and 8 series GeForces seem to work pretty well with this and later versions of WINE.

Sci,

@unknownuser said:

So, we just need to try to force the view to refresh. Maybe one or a few of the observer classes can watch for changes, and invalidate the view? As a last resort we could launch a non-modal web dialog thing and have a javascript timeout that invalidates the view... but I think this would mean that we couldn't use another script with web-dialogs... right? (Haven't used one in my scripts yet, and haven't used anyone elses scripts either... but I assume that you can only have one running at a time?)

Do I understand you...you are proposing a ruby script for forcing a redraw, called every few seconds or automatically at the end of certain commands? I suppose first step would be to know exactly what events are not followed by refreshes, and then find the classes that observe them.

Scienthsine · 8 Aug 2008, 04:13

Yep, exactly, it's hacky... but desperate times

That would be good, I have alot to do this weekend, so I haven't installed it on my linux drive yet... but I don't expect to have the same problem, having a radeon. We'll see...

lewiswadsworth · 8 Aug 2008, 13:10

I have yet to be able to get SU to work on WINE with a Radeon at all...it rarely even works well on Windows, after all, with ATI cards, and the tech support people in Boulder will confirm that. Please let me know if you figure it out.

mozzie · 9 Aug 2008, 12:57

OK - have it working with my 82865G Integrated Graphics Controller. In the WINE forums, there was a suggestion that there was an issue with the Intel and ATI OpenGL drivers under DRI and that turning it off would work.
Requires a mod to the xorg.conf file - add the following line under the

Section "Device"
...
Option "DRI" "False"
EndSection

And I now have a non-black screen, and visible drawings. Not tested comprehensively, but will report back.

lewiswadsworth · 9 Aug 2008, 13:33

Mozzie, I'll have to try that as well on the Dell notebook...could you provide a link to the relevant WINE forum threads? Thanks.

EDIT: It worked! ...on a Dell Inspiron XPS P4 3.40 GHz with some nameless ATI Radeon with 256 MB VRam, about four years old. There is a strange white box around the cursor, but otherwise SU looks normal...I won't have a chance to test this with real drawings for a few days, though. (Incidentally, this computer had bad ATI/OpenGL issues running SU on Windows...I've always considered it a piece of junk.)

The toolbar problem seems to be caused by allowing the Window Manager "to control the window" in the Configure WINE control panel. However, unchecking the option can cause worse issues...on my systems, it seems that toolbars that are not docked or pallet windows (like Materials) that were open prior to the WINE configuration change will vanish until the desktop manager is allowed to manage SU again.

mozzie · 11 Aug 2008, 00:56

You probably don't need it now ... but here's the WineHQ reference.
It's the second item in the list, the heading is "Black Screen".

WineHQ - Comments

Open Source Software for running Windows applications on other operating systems.

(appdb.winehq.org)

The interesting comment there is the last item in the black screen thread.

@unknownuser said:

RE: Black Screen
by Alexander Sabourenkov on Thursday August 7th 2008, 1:21
Ok.

I'll try to track down the source of the problem. Seems likely that it is something missing from both intel and ati open source drivers, but present in non-accelerated driver and proprietary ones (nvidia at least).

I did a little testing. I don't have the white box problem (cursor looks normal).
Onscreen operations seem Ok, but horribly slow (to be expected) as the hardware acceleration is compromised.
Export to 2D graphic (PNG) was unsuccessful.

lewiswadsworth · 11 Aug 2008, 01:59

Thanks, Mozzie. I also could not export to PNG on the old Dell notebook, although JPG worked well. And of course, I lost functionality on other native apps that depended on DRI, like certain screensavers and some of the eyecandy on the Amarok music player.

In the end, it's not worth doing on this particular aging notebook computer...with a fairly big model (which will run just fine on WINE on a computer with an 8-series GeForce), turning on textures and shadows in SU nearly froze the system. And even once I managed to force SU/WINE to quit, the computer was hopelessly sluggish until I restarted it. Oh well. I'm sure on a more modern system with ATI or integrated graphics this will be of great value. But it seems like the NVidia cards are still the best bet for a system to run SU on Wine on Linux without too much functionality loss, assuming one has the option...at least until the poster you quote tracks down the problem.

eter · 13 Aug 2008, 03:28

OK, I was playing around a bit this week and I DO get the display delay thing- specifically, if I reverse a face, it doesn't display as reversed until I try another operation. I'm using an nVidia 6200 with the proprietary drivers that Ubuntu 7.04 installs.

tomasz · 21 Sept 2008, 11:41

Hi,
I have managed to start SU Free on SuSE 11.0 with Wine 1.1.4.
I've got GeForce 6200. It works fine, almost as fast as on Windows
but.. every time I minimize SU window and then open it back I get BugSplat..

SU(Wine) also doesn't refresh the view after selecting a scene. I have to click on the screen to see it changed.

I was really surprised to see SU widow on Linux and to rotate quite complicated models without a problem!

Tomasz

michelinux · 3 Oct 2008, 20:01

have you followed all the steps explained in this tutorial, particularly adapt ruby scripts for unix systems with tofrodos tools and the command dos2unix in correct directories where scripts are?

tomasz · 3 Oct 2008, 21:17

If you mention tutorial below... I haven't spotted it.
http://www.wine-reviews.net/applications/google-sketchup-6-on-linux-and-freebsd-with-wine.html
I have installed Gecko when wine asked first time. My bad.
Will reinstalling help? Will try it.

michelinux · 7 Oct 2008, 09:10

No, I intend the first page of this discussion here.

I've just updated SU to the last release, but I'm noticing the same problems you've described in your post.

Mick

tvcasualty · 10 Nov 2008, 03:35

I've been running SU on ubuntu 8.04 and now 8.10. I've had the black screen problem in version 1.16? of wine, however a day later it updated and the problem went away. I'm now on 1.18, and it still works great. Now all my plugin's work!