McCain vs Obama 1st debate
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@solo said:
@unknownuser said:
You don't see any relevance to "Barak Hussein Obama" being a presidential candidate in these times?
But another angry and millitant white man that wants to rule by force and impose his beliefs on the world is exactly what we need?
These times call for composure, consideration, intellegence, and decisive actions, not knee jerk reactions, un-needed wars and a cold war mentality.
These times also call for experience, foresight and candor. I don't trust Obama. I don't he knows what the hell he's doing.
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@fella77 said:
I'll admit..I do hear allot of people go out of their way to mention his middle name..and usually they are in the midst of bashing him when they do it. There are just as many ignorant people that will think he is a Muslim extremist because of his name, that will also not vote for him ( or vote for him) just cause he's half African American.
Gaganraj, unfortunately based on recent events.... in allot of peoples minds Arab does equal bad. When I was watching the world trade center be attacked I wasn't thinking it was the Swedes that were flying the planes into the buildings. I'm not saying it's right or fair..but in allot of peoples minds that middle name of his is pretty hard to swallow.
I agree. Although I don't think he's a Muslim extremist, I do question his loyalties.
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@bellwells said:
Paris, tell us more about yourself. Your bio is a little light. I have to say I agree with much of what you said except that the US has had it's day. We are the "light on the hill". Our most prized export is freedom. People risk their lives to come here. We do more good than harm.
You don't see any relevance to "Barak Hussein Obama" being a presidential candidate in these times?
You tout that America is the 'light on the hill' and a country that is built on freedom and equality for all and at the same time you condemn an 'American' black man who has elevated himself to where he is running for the highest position in the land because he was 'given' a name that evokes fear. A fear I might add that is self imposed. You can't have it both ways. It's time for America to wake up and realize that if they want to regain their status as a 'respected' world leader then they need to overcome their own arrogance and hypocrisy. Right now all I see is a country in peril, that is dominated by right wing extremist paranoia. Bush has opened the Pandora's box and unlike when you guys were humiliated by Vietnam these guys strap bombs to themselves and fly planes into buildings. As far as 'exporting freedom' goes, well, there is a big difference between 'liberation' and 'domination'.
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I agree with much of what Paris is saying. How can we be a 'light on a hill' when people are fearful of a candidates name? How are we in any way an enlightened society? McCain graduated 5th to last in his class and was, in his own words, reckless and egotistical. He is typical of an elitist, white establishment that has mislead the country into believe we are a 'christian' nation blessed by 'God' and taken them into a war for a valuable and vanishing resource. How can anyone be mistrustful of a man that has worked his way from nothing to being the leading presidential nominee JUST BECAUSE OF HIS NAME?! It is an ignorant, xenophobic, racist and uneducated opinion. In the same vein that people are mistrustful of a dark skinned man, I am fearful of old, warmongering white men, who have done little more than line the pockets of their cronies, while the world sinks into a future devoid of oil, water, fertile soil and most of all, rational thinking human beings.
Most older white men in this country will never understand what it is to feel any sort of oppression or discrimination. It is a dying generation that will have to come to terms with, before they are gone, that their country is lead by a man of color. deal with it.
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For the doom and gloomers regarding the collapse of the USA, this shows GDP, in $, of the G8 from 1970-2007. As of 2007, the USA, with over $12.4 trillion, is 3 times the next largest, Japan. That's despite 9/11, the war on terror, Katrina, Democrat congress, etc. Didn't bother with labeling the rest 'cause they're down in the noise somewhere...
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@gaganraj said:
It is an ignorant, xenophobic, racist and uneducated opinion. In the same vein that people are mistrustful of a dark skinned man, I am fearful of old, warmongering white men, who have done little more than line the pockets of their cronies, while the world sinks into a future devoid of oil, water, fertile soil and most of all, rational thinking human beings.
gag,
I suspect that the reason Arabs do not enjoy greater popularity in the States than they do is that they're just not as likable as you are.
~Voder
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whats not to like?
Is it because I said something negative about old white men? woops. -
Im actually looking forward to friday..the VPs debate!
In fact I dont think Palin will get creamed....she's a tough, savy chick...as she shows here http://www.truthdig.com/avbooth/item/20080928_fey_takes_on_palin_take_two/
But the big question is gonna be...'will she be wired?'...will Carl Rove be in the next room feeding her answers?...My guess is that she will be wearing her hair down....easier to hide the receivers of course!.....so Biden's best line could be..."Is that a radio in your ear..or are you just happy to hear me?" -
@solo said:
@unknownuser said:
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Even if you argue the point that Ralph Nader is a choice you know you are only paying lip service, as a vote for Nader would be like a vote against McCain in your case as you have very obvious conservative values which would result in a vote for Obama in essence.Here's Nader's response to those who say a vote for him is a vote for the republican candidate.
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Eric, you never read my post properly, I never said a vote for Nader is a republican vote.
I said if you are generally conservative or libertarian (closer to conservative values) a vote for Nader would take away from the republican candidate as well as if you are a liberal minded voter that votes for him will result in a loss for the Dems.
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@bellwells said:
@fella77 said:
I'll admit..I do hear allot of people go out of their way to mention his middle name..and usually they are in the midst of bashing him when they do it. There are just as many ignorant people that will think he is a Muslim extremist because of his name, that will also not vote for him ( or vote for him) just cause he's half African American.
Gaganraj, unfortunately based on recent events.... in allot of peoples minds Arab does equal bad. When I was watching the world trade center be attacked I wasn't thinking it was the Swedes that were flying the planes into the buildings. I'm not saying it's right or fair..but in allot of peoples minds that middle name of his is pretty hard to swallow.
I agree. Although I don't think he's a Muslim extremist, I do question his loyalties.
Why do you question his loyalties?
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@david. said:
For the doom and gloomers regarding the collapse of the USA, this shows GDP, in $, of the G8 from 1970-2007. As of 2007, the USA, with over $12.4 trillion, is 3 times the next largest, Japan. That's despite 9/11, the war on terror, Katrina, Democrat congress, etc. Didn't bother with labeling the rest 'cause they're down in the noise somewhere...
[attachment=0:3aqlu36t]<!-- ia0 -->CountryData-G8.jpg<!-- ia0 -->[/attachment:3aqlu36t]That's quite telling David. But why are we so poor then? Sure we have lots of things but we are owned by the Chinese. The bigger they are, the harder they fall.
I am more worried about the collapse of the US economy on "Main Street" as they like to say. The middle class, the lower class, or what have you. The breakdown of the Constitution and civil society. The decimation of our military by pointless and destructive wars and the overextension of a chaotic Empire. I continue to see the US on a downward slide in those terms.
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That SNL skit is spot on. Palin is about as intelligent as a pen cap, and just sits there and parrots what she was instructed to say, and peppers in allot of great republican buzzwords. She reminds me of those full size cardboard figures of people that they put in front of a movie theater to promote a film...catches your eye, but when you take a close look theres nothing really there..it's just a decoration. Problem is this cardboard cutout in the right circumstance could be our president. Then we will be busy burning books, and praying over homosexuals so they will turn straight..maybe passing some legislation so we can soil our entire country with oil drilling rigs, and taking all the real fun animals to hunt off the endangered species list...oh ya and making sure that women who are raped and victims of sexual molestation are forced to have babies they don't want. Personally, I think McCain might have sank his ship when he tacked that dummy onto his wagon. I have more respect for him than her, but she drags the whole Republican party down.
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@daniel said:
@bellwells said:
@fella77 said:
I'll admit..I do hear allot of people go out of their way to mention his middle name..and usually they are in the midst of bashing him when they do it. There are just as many ignorant people that will think he is a Muslim extremist because of his name, that will also not vote for him ( or vote for him) just cause he's half African American.
Gaganraj, unfortunately based on recent events.... in allot of peoples minds Arab does equal bad. When I was watching the world trade center be attacked I wasn't thinking it was the Swedes that were flying the planes into the buildings. I'm not saying it's right or fair..but in allot of peoples minds that middle name of his is pretty hard to swallow.
I agree. Although I don't think he's a Muslim extremist, I do question his loyalties.
Why do you question his loyalties?
Daniel, sorry for the tardy response, I was in meetings all day.
I simply don't trust him to act in the country's best interest. His association with William Ayers and the Wrong Rev. Jeremiah Wright is indicative of his allegiances and beliefs and character. You don't hear too much about this anymore, do you? The faithful media will make sure this story stays below the surface.
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Ron...you're out of control, so I will no longer comment on your wrong-mindedness: but I gotta say you're factually dead wrong about the media...starting a decade ago.
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@tomsdesk said:
Ron...you're out of control, so I will no longer comment on your wrong-mindedness: but I gotta say you're factually dead wrong about the media...starting a decade ago.
Wrong-mindedness...this is the best one yet, Tom. So now you're the arbiter of what's right-minded? This is laughable!
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Bellwells, Todd Palin (Sara's husband) was registered with the Alaskan Independence Party from '99-'05. The AIP has advocated Alaska become a separate nation, or become part of Canada. So, do you mistrust him, too? And if so, how could you trust his wife, when it has already been shown he was involved in decision making while she was governor?
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@daniel said:
Bellwells, Todd Palin (Sara's husband) was registered with the Alaskan Independence Party from '99-'05. The AIP has advocated Alaska become a separate nation, or become part of Canada. So, do you mistrust him, too? And if so, how could you trust his wife, when it has already been shown he was involved in decision making while she was governor?
Daniel, I did just a little research before answering, so I may be missing some facts. My understanding is that, while one of AIP's goal was succession, this platform was dropped when the founder died a number of years ago. They realized how futile this goal was. I wouldn't mind withdrawing from the heavy hand of the federal government given the current partisan bullshit going on right now! Apparently, the AIP is closely related to the Constitution Party.
Having said that, Todd Palin is not the one running for office. Michelle Obama has certainly said some controversial things as well. Presidents/Governors talk to their wifes/husbands all the time about national/state policies and decision making. Nothing new here.
To answer your question directly--no, I do not mistrust Todd Palin. It doesn't matter because I'm not voting for McCain anyway.
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@bellwells said:
Wrong-mindedness...this is the best one yet, Tom. So now you're the arbiter of what's right-minded? This is laughable!
Ron, that part of my post was just after reading (and deciding not to respond to) your "to dispise is right" comments in another thread...and should not have been mentioned here. Nonetheless, it is my one man's opinion.
That said, I repeat: a liberal press is long dead...those not obviously right-wing are motivated by and operate under self-serving agendas. That's why the News Hour on PBS at times seems left of center...which it really isn't.
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@tomsdesk said:
That said, I repeat: a liberal press is long dead...those not obviously right-wing are motivated by and operate under self-serving agendas. That's why the News Hour on PBS at times seems left of center...which it really isn't.
I guess we'll agree to disagree about the liberal press. The press has been so noticeably liberal for so long that any shift to the center is perceived as conservative. It really gets down to ones personal politics, doesn't it? We all like to hear our opinions validated and therefore gravitate to those news sources which offer this validation.
I watch various news shows to understand the subtle nature of bias. It's there if you pay objective attention. You can see it in the body language as well as in the words.
Thanks for the comment about wrong-minded/right-minded. I read your post in the other thread.
May the Schwartz be with you.
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