Attack on NPR/Big Bird: bad idea in pres debate
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A suggestion by a comission is different than making an official objective statement as a potential future president.
Also of note is that funding would be cut, not eliminated. Which means the states that cannot afford to pay (either via state money or private donations) will lose PBS broadcasting. Unfortunately, the poorer states tend to be (but not always) republican states, therefore the more metropolitan areas, and the coastal "blue" states will keep their PBS programming while the flyover states will lose much of theirs.
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Sesame Street is a $400+ million business let them pay their own way. There's no reason a multi-million dollar corporation, and yes PBS and Sesame Street are corporations, should be getting my tax dollars to run their business.
I own my own business and the government doesn't pay me anything but has no problem taking more from me every year. As far as poorer vs richer states getting to keep PBS in this digital age of the government subsidizing computers, cellphones, education, transportation, groceries, I'm pretty sure if someone absolutely needs a fix of Big Bird the can always log on to youtube.
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@o2bwln said:
Sesame Street is a $400+ million business let them pay their own way. There's no reason a multi-million dollar corporation, and yes PBS and Sesame Street are corporations, should be getting my tax dollars to run their business.
I own my own business and the government doesn't pay me anything but has no problem taking more from me every year. As far as poorer vs richer states getting to keep PBS in this digital age of the government subsidizing computers, cellphones, education, transportation, groceries, I'm pretty sure if someone absolutely needs a fix of Big Bird the can always log on to youtube.
Very well, by that logic then all of these industries should be cut off as well:
PBS shouldn't be on the radar. It's a terrible target when compared to the billions outlaid for the other recipients on the chart. Their allocation is a pittance compared to the subsidies above. Perhaps the kids in the poor states can log on to YouTube and catch a clip of Big Bird, but copyright is going to prevent them from watching too many full episodes. Assuming they can afford a computer and internet connection.
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Excellent!! So you're finally realizing that government shouldn't be in the business of financing business.
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@o2bwln said:
It's good to see the President rush to the aid of Big Bird cause he sure didn't rush to help the ambassador that got killed on his watch and last I remember PBS wasn't nearly as hostile when Obama's debt commission suggested cutting funding.
Interesting. Obama did not go to the defense of Big Bird. The chart shows a Big Bird fan response to Romney's knee jerk reaction to subsidizing education, arts (includes appreciation of great architecture), and culture. Most governments this side of Somalia also support this type of activity to some extent. The remark about going to the defense of the ambassador is totally unfounded. The ambassador was certainly aware of the risks of being an ambassador and could have requested more security. But an ambassador locked in an armed fortress can not fully function as an ambassador. Also the protests were infiltrated by Al Qaeda operatives at the last minute to create a target of opportunity. Anyhow thanks for the opportunity to set this piece of misdirection straight.
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(do we have a "like" button yet on this forum) 
That's what I findy wryly amusing about places like FOX and right wing radio - almost all the arguments are built on specious claims, straw-men, and logical fallacies. Yeah, why on earth connect PBS funding to the Lybia embassy attacks in he first place?
@roger said:
@o2bwln said:
It's good to see the President rush to the aid of Big Bird cause he sure didn't rush to help the ambassador that got killed on his watch and last I remember PBS wasn't nearly as hostile when Obama's debt commission suggested cutting funding.
Interesting. Obama did not go to the defense of Big Bird. The chart shows a Big Bird fan response to Romney's knee jerk reaction to subsidizing education, arts (includes appreciation of great architecture), and culture. Most governments this side of Somalia also support this type of activity to some extent. The remark about going to the defense of the ambassador is totally unfounded. The ambassador was certainly aware of the risks of being an ambassador and could have requested more security. But an ambassador locked in an armed fortress can not fully function as an ambassador. Also the protests were infiltrated by Al Qaeda operatives at the last minute to create a target of opportunity. Anyhow thanks for the opportunity to set this piece of misdirection straight.
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Pretty sad when the only credible learning channel available for free to all Americans is put in the cross hairs. In 1972 NASA started TLC (The learning channel) as an educational service later it privatized it and today the TLC's number one show is Honey Boo Boo (all non-Americans feel free to check it out, it sure is a great way to learn about the America the right wing lives in.)
While at it, this was an actual Fox news screen capture, believe it or not.
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I was kinda waiting for this type start happening in this forum. I always bristle at these kinds of attacks and mis-information because they don't paint at all the picture of Mitt Romney and who he really is. I don't expect my story here to change any minds, or anything like that, nor do I claim any special relationship now. . .but I would like to share this great personal experience just for the sake of shedding some true light on the subject rather than just going with the caricatures that have been painted by the media. . .
%(#BF4080)[Several years ago, long before the SLC 2002 Olympics --about 1995-- I had the opportunity as a young architect to help design and build a home for Mitt and Ann Romney in Utah. It was a great opportunity for me and helped define my career . Let me say. . .Mitt and Ann are the real deal. He is a very decent, good and accomplished man, and he will make a fantastic President. But on the personal side, they were both very kind to me. They treated me as a valued friend and colleague and never like one of the "help". It was a blast talking about design ideas and dreams that they had for the house and things they wanted to accomplish. They were that courteous with everybody involved in the project--from the plumbers to the framers to the interior designers--I was part of a very large team and --they were always enthusiastic and fun. Never condescending, elitist or rude about their wealth. It is just not in their character. Believe me, I have had clients like that as well. That is not them.
This construction of the house was going on about the time she was first diagnosed with the MS. I have since learned that she wasn't "officially" diagnosed until 1998, but as my memory serves, she was starting to feel effects of fatigue and shakiness, and was having suspicions about being sick. She would walk along the project with me.--and yes. .it was a very large, complicated house project-- as you can see from the attached photo. (MEMO to the World: Yes! the Romneys are rich!) As we would walk the project, I could tell at times that she was in pain or tired, but she never complained or was short with me or anyone else. And Mitt was always considerate and thoughtful of her comfort and welfare.
For those out there who have derided her for "not working a day in her life" or that she is so rich, she doesn't relate to "real", ordinary people--I am hear to say that nothing could be farther from the truth. I know because I am just one of those ordinary run of the mill guys, I can honestly say that Ann Romney is one of the greatest women I have ever had the pleasure to meet and get to know--although it was but for a short time many years ago. I would not dare be so presumptuous to say that I know her well today or have any special relationship. In fact they probably wouldn't remember me from Adam, but we do share a common faith so I do have an idea of from where she draws her inner strength. One of the great qualities she will display as First Lady, is empathy and compassion.I have understanding of the Romney family and their values--because they are my values as well and their faith is my faith. Mitt and Ann would never blow their own horns for their service to the community, the Church or to the Country.
You will never see him or Ann hob-nobbing with the celebrity set or taking lavish vacations on the tax-payer dime. He will never act frantic or try to be oh-so-cool. He will lead with quiet, dignified reserve--in other words, very Presidential.
What he accomplished here in Salt Lake in 02 and the Olympics is nothing short of a miracle and Utah has been benefiting from that legacy every since. In summary, I know for a fact that Mitt is one of the most honest, incredible accomplished persons I have had the pleasure to meet.Likewise Ann Romney. I will always treasure the time I worked with her on the house project. She will be an amazing First Lady because she has true warmth, compassion and a genuine love for people. Mitt Romney will be an historic, great President of the United States who has the real smarts, character and experience to get this country working, productive and respected again. . . ..and I cannot wait for the opportunity to cast my vote for them both.]
See the house Here
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Glad you had a great experience, and I'm sure having a lot in common helps you decide he will be a great leader. I feel he has been the greatest liar and flip flopper ever in the history of presidential campaigners, very happy the Brits figured him out the first day, something we cannot seem to do.
Maybe if he stuck to what he believed and never pandered to the freaky right wing in order to get through primaries I'd have a better opinion but a person that is willing to say anything to get elected scares me as he shows he has no core ideals and will say one thing at 10am the opposite at 2pm to different audiences just to get their support tells me he will do the same as president, we need a strong leader with principles and not one that sees the presidency as another trophy in his life of achievements.
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Very interesting David. I can't say I've personally gotten any indication that Romney himself is rotten or suspect as a person. It's what he's representing as the face of the republican party and the daily smears from right wing media that bother me greatly.
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This actually did not start as an attack on Mitt Romney. It was the simple observation that when Mitt went after Big Bird and Jim Lehrer it provoked a significant bounce on the NPR Big Bird page. And the context and tone of of the Romney remark were more smart ass than presidential as the debate was over. It was like a winning boxer instead of waving to the fans going over to his opponents corner men and punching them in the mouth. It sort of harks back to Romney's reputation as a high-school bully. And it also reflects the modern republican attitude of take no prisoners and don't work both side of the aisle. It might work in American politics but in the grown up arena of world politics, it is ill advised. Lastly government funding of NPR is so tiny, I can not imagine what Mitt thought he could gain other than the votes of T-partiers who really have no where else to go anyway. A really astute politician would have weighed the cheap thrill of the below the belt shot against any real gain in the election process.
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I get all that. All the more reason why it shouldn't be funded. PBS was founded back in the mid-60's back when there was very little choice on the airwaves. ..especially in the area of children's educational television--other than Captain Kangaroo, as I remember. But I doubt anyone could argue that PBS is more than capable--especially Sesame Street in this day and age that it could totally self-supporting. Mitt was making the point that all of these endless taxes and fees that are no longer needed could be certainly done away with and the program wouldn't suffer at all. We all love Big Bird--but he is definitely a pretty well-off bird in a gilded cage.
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Let me explain why NPR is so vitally important. Tonight on the news they reviewed a list of the best and worst toys as rated by consumers (probably the parents of consumers). At the top was GI Joe. At the top of the worst list was the "Slip and Sue." It is like "Slip and Slide" but comes with the number of an attorney in case you are injured.
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The importance and value of NPR and PBS are not in dispute. But it no longer requires taxpayer support. That's all Mitt was saying. I agree. But let's leave it there. All i was trying to do was dispel some of this grotesque caricature of a man whom i respect and admire and with whom I have had some personal experience. Vote for him, don't vote for him. So be it--but I just wanted to say that all the evil-capitalist monopoly guy flip-flopper stuff that the media has been trashed about him is just flat out untrue.
We're all friends here right?
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@unknownuser said:
So be it--but I just wanted to say that all the evil-capitalist monopoly guy flip-flopper stuff that the media has been trashed about him is just flat out untrue.
We're all friends here right?
Even though I disagree with this and if asked or challenged can start a new thread to prove and discuss over 300 lies and 76 flip flops, let's agree to disagree.
We always will be friends, this is just politics regardless of where we stand, I'm vocal but not obsessed.
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Any SU user is a friend of mine, even if Romney is elected. It is like Bush, all bad things will pass in their time.
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@o2bwln said:
Excellent!! So you're finally realizing that government shouldn't be in the business of financing business.
Never thought it should. Never thought they should have blown taxpayer money to bail out big businesses. Don't believe that businesses should ever be allowed to get so big that they can adversely affect national or world economies for that matter.
My point is that NPR is small fry, there are billions elsewhere that could have been marked for retrieving government income. Those include tax loopholes for the wealthy, including Mitt's offshore wealth avoiding taxes, and the same goes for businesses (but we need to lower the corporate tax rate, it's insane).
NPR may be a business, but IMO it's simply a target for Mr. Romney because it's viewed as a liberal institution. He wouldn't dare say he's cutting off big oil subsidies.
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NPR/PBS was created when there were not many options for that form of broadcasting and they were broadcast to places that couldn't access the more mainstream channels. But that period is over and people have access to all forms of information If people are that worked up about how important NPR/PBS are then these companies should enter the free market and compete like all other businesses, not take tax payer dollars.
I like PBS and NPR but I also believe that they should compete for business. As far as educational content there are a million channels and websites that have the same content that these stations have.
While their budget is small compared to the overall government they should follow what all families have had to do during these hard times; every dollar that does not need to be spent is a dollar that the family can save. Pennies become dimes which become dollars, thats how my kids piggy bank grows and that's how the government should wean these types of business of the governments teat.
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I guess we're just talking past each other. You're justifying PBS as a target while seemingly ignoring the larger ones that cost families more. I'm saying it was a lousy target when there are bigger, more profitable fish to fry that could save billions, not a few hundred million.
Guess we'll just have to disagree.
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